Can a kid who is not an URM, or recruited athlete or legacy get into an Ivy from a DC private?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We really shouldn't turn this into a public vs. private debate because in 2023 the odds aren't great from either side (at least in ED).

The DMV is packed with 1)legacies, 2)extreme wealth 3)URMs 4)athletes.
So the kids taken from the DMV are going to almost all be from these categories because there are plenty of kids who are super smart and who satisfy 1 (and usually 2, 3 or 4) of these institutional needs.
Kids from Vermont (which has almost zero URMs and far fewer legacies per capita and probably very, very few big donor legacies) are far more likely to be just white and unhooked.

The current reality is the same in every educated urban area.

And that’s been the reality for an extremely long time.

yes but a few things have changed which have exacerbated this to it's current extreme state.
A major one being test optional policies and grade inflation (Covid related and baseline) which have greatly enlarged the pool of "super smart" kids. Now the pool from which a college can pick their hooked applicants is MUCH larger.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We really shouldn't turn this into a public vs. private debate because in 2023 the odds aren't great from either side (at least in ED).

The DMV is packed with 1)legacies, 2)extreme wealth 3)URMs 4)athletes.
So the kids taken from the DMV are going to almost all be from these categories because there are plenty of kids who are super smart and who satisfy 1 (and usually 2, 3 or 4) of these institutional needs.
Kids from Vermont (which has almost zero URMs and far fewer legacies per capita and probably very, very few big donor legacies) are far more likely to be just white and unhooked.

The current reality is the same in every educated urban area.

And that’s been the reality for an extremely long time.

yes but a few things have changed which have exacerbated this to it's current extreme state.
A major one being test optional policies and grade inflation (Covid related and baseline) which have greatly enlarged the pool of "super smart" kids. Now the pool from which a college can pick their hooked applicants is MUCH larger.

That logic doesn’t follow, and again — the percentage of private school kids that make up Ivy League entering classes hasn’t changed.

[Anonymous]

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

What you don’t get is that I’m paying the $55k for a fantastic, rigorous education with engaged teachers and peers that is way, way beyond what my kid would get at Jackson-Reed or Whitman. I’m not trying to buy college admission and know that my kid has been well-prepared to do well at whatever college they end up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NCS had one girl last year who got into an Ivy without being a recruited athlete, URM or legacy (VIP or big donor legacy).
The trend seems to be continuing this year at NCS, GDS, Sidwell through ED at least. No kids admitted ED who are no hooked.

Time will tell if anyone unhooked gets in through regular decision.

The admissions landscape has REALLY, REALLY changed in recent (2 or so) years.
The high schools are trying to keep this under wraps but it is a a huge change.

You are very right about the private schools trying to keep this quiet.

For instance, GDS and Sidwell stopped reporting in any publication admissions by graduating class. Now they only show matriculations over the last 5 or 6 years of graduating classes. That’s a big new change.

At GDS, they have started actively recruiting top middle school athletes for 9th grade incoming class. This seems very new for them. Perhaps Sidwell and NCS have long recruited. GDS has not.

Finally, taking the incentives to their extreme, this will mean 9th grade admissions will be even more focused on VIP parents, URM and top athletes.

LOL - I saw this in full force at a independent school open house. No chance for us to ask any questions as admissions rep was gushing to the sports recruit that wanted to chat her up. She was soaking it in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

and know that my kid has been well-prepared to do well at whatever college they end up.

just like the vast majority of kids coming from area publics!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No one has data because the schools don't want you to know this.

-But talk to any parent of a senior this year or last.
-Talk to a NW DC college admissions counselor.
-Look at the schools' student-run Instagram pages from last year and this year (not prefect but give trends)

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

I'm in this camp. Everyone who is denying the veracity of this thread hasn't been the parent of a 2021 2022 HS senior in a DC top private school. Drop a post here when you get to senior year and see then yourselves that it's all changed. Maybe not for the bad but it's not table stakes you assumed when you signed up 4 or 8 years ago to pay $50k a year for your kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

What you don’t get is that I’m paying the $55k for a fantastic, rigorous education with engaged teachers and peers that is way, way beyond what my kid would get at Jackson-Reed or Whitman. I’m not trying to buy college admission and know that my kid has been well-prepared to do well at whatever college they end up.

Why do you assume that this is not happening at Whitman and JR? My kid is in JR and my older graduated Ivy League kid went to Walls. We've had a great experience at both!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has data because the schools don't want you to know this.

-But talk to any parent of a senior this year or last.
-Talk to a NW DC college admissions counselor.
-Look at the schools' student-run Instagram pages from last year and this year (not prefect but give trends)

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

I'm in this camp. Everyone who is denying the veracity of this thread hasn't been the parent of a 2021 2022 HS senior in a DC top private school. Drop a post here when you get to senior year and see then yourselves that it's all changed. Maybe not for the bad but it's not table stakes you assumed when you signed up 4 or 8 years ago to pay $50k a year for your kids.

Once again, no one cares about your anecdotal data. Private school kids have comprised about 40% of Ivy League entering classes for years. Hasn’t changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has data because the schools don't want you to know this.

-But talk to any parent of a senior this year or last.
-Talk to a NW DC college admissions counselor.
-Look at the schools' student-run Instagram pages from last year and this year (not prefect but give trends)

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

I'm in this camp. Everyone who is denying the veracity of this thread hasn't been the parent of a 2021 2022 HS senior in a DC top private school. Drop a post here when you get to senior year and see then yourselves that it's all changed. Maybe not for the bad but it's not table stakes you assumed when you signed up 4 or 8 years ago to pay $50k a year for your kids.

Once again, no one cares about your anecdotal data. Private school kids have comprised about 40% of Ivy League entering classes for years. Hasn’t changed.

This discussion is about how the composition of that 40% has changed. Ten years ago it was 50% hooked kids, 50% unhooked high stats. Today, it’s 95% hooked kids, 5% unhooked high stats. The fact that it’s still 40% of the entering class at Ivies is immaterial.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, but chances of acceptance are better from a public.

Might as well save your money.

I started a thread about this recently and was called a troll. It seems like the coveted ivy spots are taken by legacy, URM and recruited athletes. Often it seems like they are both URM and an athlete.

You could get to a top non ivy school from your local public if your child is a strong student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has data because the schools don't want you to know this.

-But talk to any parent of a senior this year or last.
-Talk to a NW DC college admissions counselor.
-Look at the schools' student-run Instagram pages from last year and this year (not prefect but give trends)

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

I'm in this camp. Everyone who is denying the veracity of this thread hasn't been the parent of a 2021 2022 HS senior in a DC top private school. Drop a post here when you get to senior year and see then yourselves that it's all changed. Maybe not for the bad but it's not table stakes you assumed when you signed up 4 or 8 years ago to pay $50k a year for your kids.

Once again, no one cares about your anecdotal data. Private school kids have comprised about 40% of Ivy League entering classes for years. Hasn’t changed.

This discussion is about how the composition of that 40% has changed. Ten years ago it was 50% hooked kids, 50% unhooked high stats. Today, it’s 95% hooked kids, 5% unhooked high stats. The fact that it’s still 40% of the entering class at Ivies is immaterial.

So does that 5% stand a better chance from public?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has data because the schools don't want you to know this.

-But talk to any parent of a senior this year or last.
-Talk to a NW DC college admissions counselor.
-Look at the schools' student-run Instagram pages from last year and this year (not prefect but give trends)

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

I'm in this camp. Everyone who is denying the veracity of this thread hasn't been the parent of a 2021 2022 HS senior in a DC top private school. Drop a post here when you get to senior year and see then yourselves that it's all changed. Maybe not for the bad but it's not table stakes you assumed when you signed up 4 or 8 years ago to pay $50k a year for your kids.

Once again, no one cares about your anecdotal data. Private school kids have comprised about 40% of Ivy League entering classes for years. Hasn’t changed.

The point is that those admissions are from legacy, URM and recruited athletes at those private schools. That leaves less spots for the unhooked high stats kid.

The privates seem to send a lot of kids to UChicago, Northwestern, NYU, Tufts, etc. You could get to these schools from public just the same. Check out McLean High.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has data because the schools don't want you to know this.

-But talk to any parent of a senior this year or last.
-Talk to a NW DC college admissions counselor.
-Look at the schools' student-run Instagram pages from last year and this year (not prefect but give trends)

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

I'm in this camp. Everyone who is denying the veracity of this thread hasn't been the parent of a 2021 2022 HS senior in a DC top private school. Drop a post here when you get to senior year and see then yourselves that it's all changed. Maybe not for the bad but it's not table stakes you assumed when you signed up 4 or 8 years ago to pay $50k a year for your kids.

DC private schools are an amazing one-stop-shop for finding college URM admits: smart, athletic, high income, liberal.
It goes very well with most top colleges nowadays. Great fit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has data because the schools don't want you to know this.

-But talk to any parent of a senior this year or last.
-Talk to a NW DC college admissions counselor.
-Look at the schools' student-run Instagram pages from last year and this year (not prefect but give trends)

Listen, we're not making this up for kicks and thrills or to start drama for fun. Pretty much no one is getting in who isn't a minority or an athlete or a big donor's kid.
OR feel free to keep paying the $55K per year and keep your head in the sand until your kid's senior year and you see this play out with your own kid. That's honestly probably the best approach.

I'm in this camp. Everyone who is denying the veracity of this thread hasn't been the parent of a 2021 2022 HS senior in a DC top private school. Drop a post here when you get to senior year and see then yourselves that it's all changed. Maybe not for the bad but it's not table stakes you assumed when you signed up 4 or 8 years ago to pay $50k a year for your kids.

Once again, no one cares about your anecdotal data. Private school kids have comprised about 40% of Ivy League entering classes for years. Hasn’t changed.

This discussion is about how the composition of that 40% has changed. Ten years ago it was 50% hooked kids, 50% unhooked high stats. Today, it’s 95% hooked kids, 5% unhooked high stats. The fact that it’s still 40% of the entering class at Ivies is immaterial.

.

College first Gen applicants are now a 10% admit quota at many private ugrad universities and have displaced the legacy bucket.
Thanks for those decades of donations and school spirit!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Private school kids are overrepresented at Ivy League and other top schools, relative to the overall student population.

But sure — keep up the myth.

I believe you, but this happens in areas where the public schools just can't keep up. The DC area is not a normal metropolis. It is where overly-educated workers congregate, which makes the area public schools really competitive. So for this area, your general statement may not be true.

Most of Harvard’s class comes from the Northeast, where public schools are arguably the strongest. Your argument simply doesn’t hold water against actual data.

Right, but there are other Ivies than Harvard, and we're talking about a trend - that Ivies recruit LESS from private schools nowadays, compared to before.


I think this conversation is moot anyway, because the REAL problem is that admissions are becoming more and more unpredictable. Test-optional is a nightmare for admissions officers who now lack national standardized data to compare kids across regions and school systems with varying levels of grade inflation. The advantage of high-reputation privates lies in the fact they do not inflate grades, and are therefore "trusted" by colleges, but test-optional is still wreaking havoc on every single high school in the US, public and private. Hence why privately-hired counselors are now advising students to apply to more colleges than ever before - if the candidate is a regular white bread American without an unusual life story, it's a lottery and they have to apply widely.

But the percentage of kids from private schools going to Ivies hasn’t changed. Unless you can show data that proves otherwise?

The point (made upthread) is that the people with the data, private schools, are changing the way they recruit for 9th so that they can maintain the quality of their college lists. They used to pick off the smart kids. Now they pick off VIPs/URMs/athletes. So the numbers from the school are roughly the same, but the analysis for the parents of a smart kid is very different.

LOL.

They’ve always given preference to those categories.

Completely agree - the only difference is that now those kids need to be in the top 20% of the class/high stats to get admitted to elite colleges. Top half of the class and legacy/URM/VIP isn’t enough anymore.

IMHO as a parent of a Walls grad and a Big 3 grad, the college outcomes were similar. The ivy admits at Walls may have been SLIGHTLY better. Still nearly all legacy/URM/1st Gen and top students like at the Big 3. It’s easier to have all As at Walls than at a Big 3. So if you are a legacy, and want to increase your DC’s chances of getting into an Ivy, Walls is the way to go. Both DCs received an excellent education and got into their 1st choice college.