How does Girl Scouts work?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread has been an interesting read. What I come away with is that there is something fundamental about the membership and program business model that does not work quire right. I am not informed enough to venture a guess, but I suspect it has something to do with not recognizing or enforcing the need for adult involvement. Or, maybe there is something off-putting about the adult volunteer experience that discourages participation or retention. Is this a rational observation?

It works fine as a model, but people are so overworked at their office jobs now that many don't want their kids to participate in things that require additional effort from them as parents. Which is a perfectly reasonable way to organize your kids' schedule - throw some money at it and get them off your hands for a few hours a week - but it gets ridiculous when those parents start demanding that GSUSA cease to exist so their kid won't know there's an extracurricular they're not signed up for.

I'm a PP and see this happening more broadly, not just in Girl Scouts. See many of the summer swim threads with parents complaining about volunteering and asking why the team can't just pay for people to run concessions or serve as timers. Our neighborhood for years has had events that were organized by parents, and they aren't happening as much because newer families with young kids want to attend but not plan them. Our church has tons of families sign their kids up for Sunday school but it's already September and they still can't find enough parent volunteers to teach all the grade levels.

It's a model that has worked and does work for many families. However, it culturally appears that at least in this area of the country families have the resources that they'd rather give of their money than their time for children's extracurriculars. This becomes a personal decision for each family whether they prioritize a particular activity enough to make it happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread has been an interesting read. What I come away with is that there is something fundamental about the membership and program business model that does not work quire right. I am not informed enough to venture a guess, but I suspect it has something to do with not recognizing or enforcing the need for adult involvement. Or, maybe there is something off-putting about the adult volunteer experience that discourages participation or retention. Is this a rational observation?

It works fine as a model, but people are so overworked at their office jobs now that many don't want their kids to participate in things that require additional effort from them as parents. Which is a perfectly reasonable way to organize your kids' schedule - throw some money at it and get them off your hands for a few hours a week - but it gets ridiculous when those parents start demanding that GSUSA cease to exist so their kid won't know there's an extracurricular they're not signed up for.

I'm a PP and see this happening more broadly, not just in Girl Scouts. See many of the summer swim threads with parents complaining about volunteering and asking why the team can't just pay for people to run concessions or serve as timers. Our neighborhood for years has had events that were organized by parents, and they aren't happening as much because newer families with young kids want to attend but not plan them. Our church has tons of families sign their kids up for Sunday school but it's already September and they still can't find enough parent volunteers to teach all the grade levels.

It's a model that has worked and does work for many families. However, it culturally appears that at least in this area of the country families have the resources that they'd rather give of their money than their time for children's extracurriculars. This becomes a personal decision for each family whether they prioritize a particular activity enough to make it happen.

This is to be expected among the type of people you find on DCUM, honestly. People work a lot, so they have money but not time. That's not for me in the slightest, so I keep my hours light and make less money, but have time to volunteer with Girl Scouts and teach Sunday School. Other people make different choices.

[Anonymous]

There is just something about the GSUSA business model that makes its program more impacted by these factors. Other programs are challenged by similar things, but I don’t see the same level of operating difficulty and volunteer membership churn. I know we are especially busy people in the DMV, but we are probably not as unique as we think we are. Organization program and business approaches need to adapt in order to thrive, and with the exception of the cookie finance strategy, GSUSA volunteers just appear to be trudging an uphill path — and being told everything is okay. Well, enough from me, as I am not informed enough to say much more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is just something about the GSUSA business model that makes its program more impacted by these factors. Other programs are challenged by similar things, but I don’t see the same level of operating difficulty and volunteer membership churn. I know we are especially busy people in the DMV, but we are probably not as unique as we think we are. Organization program and business approaches need to adapt in order to thrive, and with the exception of the cookie finance strategy, GSUSA volunteers just appear to be trudging an uphill path — and being told everything is okay. Well, enough from me, as I am not informed enough to say much more.

Girl Scouts only allows female adult leaders, right? All other programs/activities that I can think of (including boy scouts) allows for both male and female adult leaders. By limiting themselves to female only, it cuts the number of potential volunteers in half.

[Anonymous]

This thread has given me a lot to think about. I was a GS from kindergarten through high school, even getting involved when I went abroad as an exchange student. My mom, a SAHM, was my leader through elementary school. It was a really positive experience for me, in particular when it came to gaining confidence in myself and my ability to just get things done by communicating with people. It’s not time yet, but this is something I would really like to give my daughter assuming she is interested — the organization truly has a place in my heart. That said, I am a biglaw attorney. I just can’t lead a troop the way my mom did (and before anyone comes at me, I will definitely contribute because I understand how much work goes into it).

I wonder if it’s time for the model to be updated, especially in HCOL areas where dual-working couples make up the majority of parents of scouts. I wonder how such changes could work in a way that keeps the program reasonably accessible to girls of all income levels.

[Anonymous]

There are rules and basic practices that don’t really make sense today. For example, the way so many troops form and dissolve, instead of becoming healthy ongoing entities, creates churn and prevents the establishment and maintenance of powerful traditions. When enough girls leave a troop, the whole thing vanishes and the remaining adult volunteers are left with nothing to serve (unless they want to engage as a Service Unit person and serve in an all-adult setting). I know this is a generality and there are exceptions, but most reading this will recognize what I am talking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is just something about the GSUSA business model that makes its program more impacted by these factors. Other programs are challenged by similar things, but I don’t see the same level of operating difficulty and volunteer membership churn. I know we are especially busy people in the DMV, but we are probably not as unique as we think we are. Organization program and business approaches need to adapt in order to thrive, and with the exception of the cookie finance strategy, GSUSA volunteers just appear to be trudging an uphill path — and being told everything is okay. Well, enough from me, as I am not informed enough to say much more.

Girl Scouts only allows female adult leaders, right? All other programs/activities that I can think of (including boy scouts) allows for both male and female adult leaders. By limiting themselves to female only, it cuts the number of potential volunteers in half.

I don't think that's the case. Our assistant troop leader is the father of one of the girls in the troop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is just something about the GSUSA business model that makes its program more impacted by these factors. Other programs are challenged by similar things, but I don’t see the same level of operating difficulty and volunteer membership churn. I know we are especially busy people in the DMV, but we are probably not as unique as we think we are. Organization program and business approaches need to adapt in order to thrive, and with the exception of the cookie finance strategy, GSUSA volunteers just appear to be trudging an uphill path — and being told everything is okay. Well, enough from me, as I am not informed enough to say much more.

Girl Scouts only allows female adult leaders, right? All other programs/activities that I can think of (including boy scouts) allows for both male and female adult leaders. By limiting themselves to female only, it cuts the number of potential volunteers in half.

I don't think that's the case. Our assistant troop leader is the father of one of the girls in the troop.

I am quoting myself because i did some google searching - looks like fathers definitely can be leaders and volunteers. My husband volunteers and has done an engineering badge with the girls.

https://makingfriends.com/girl-scout-leader/girl-scout/male-girl-scout-leaders/

https://www.girlscoutsni.org/en/our-council/news/2016/dads_who_lead_the_wa.html

[Anonymous]

Yes, there are exceptions and men are “allowed”. But GSUSA is openly unwelcoming to men.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, there are exceptions and men are “allowed”. But GSUSA is openly unwelcoming to men.

Now you sound like someone who has a bone to pick.

[Anonymous]

I posted earlier but wanted to chime in again with my personal observation on why Boy Scouts seem to be able to get adult volunteers while Girl Scouts continues to struggle. This is just what I have observed in the past 18 years that I have had kids in the two organizations. The majority of Girl Scout volunteers are moms. For Boy Scouts about 2/3 are dads and 1/3 are moms. If a dad is the volunteer the mom in the family takes care of all of the other kids in the family and their activities to make sure that dad is free to participate in the Boy Scout events. For Girl Scouts the moms are the volunteers and they also arrange care for their other kids so that they are able to volunteer (the dads are NOT making this a priority for their family) This happened some in my own family but also happened in the other families that were active in both of our Girl Scout and Cub/Boy scout troops. The older our dd got and the more she was able to do in Girl Scouts the more my husband realized how important this activity was. He then stepped it up a home watching our sons so that I could volunteer more for Girl Scouts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is how I became a leader. Our school had a big troop for all levels but expected someone to lead each grade separately. My older daughter was already in a troop and I was asked to lead when my younger daughter came of age.

I did insist on having our own troop number, which was a life saver because the book keeping was a nightmare for what were essentially independent troops sharing one number/account. During COVID most of the other grades stopped meeting . . . I think we might be the only troop that didn't fold.

I knew I could handle being a leader; I'm a former teacher and SAHM. I recruited a co-leader whom I'd met a couple of times; it was important to me that the troop not be filled with all my friends' kids like my older daughter's troop was. The next year we wanted to open our troop to all the girls in the grade, so I asked all my parents and two more moms signed on. So now we have four leaders. In some ways it's maybe too many cooks in the kitchen, but I still do most of the planning and only one mom is consistently helpful. It's still nice to have the others because they'll step up from time to time.

Our Council seems to be struggling (I think they barely avoided bankruptcy during the pandemic) and oversight and support is minimal. You have to be pretty self-sufficient to run a troop, and as a result you'll get a wide variety of interpretations of what Girl Scouts means to the leader(s). I'm not really gung ho about the philosophy or anything; I just want to provide a fun and safe environment for the girls.

In our council we do not have to list our troop on the online search function (when we were listed on there they kept adding girls who lived far away, when we're a school-specific troop, so I made them remove us). It may be that there are troops nearby that you can't see; you'll have to ask your council.

Leading a troop is a big ask and I try to make it as stress free as possible. Like I said, my council has basically stopped organizing events and offering programming. So for example I'm taking my troop to Colonial Williamsburg. We're staying at a rustic Air BNB nearby. I wanted to do this because our schools have stopped doing field trips thanks to the pandemic, and because I'm not really a camping person. Planning a camping weekend would nearly do me in. This is something I can handle. Likewise, we only meet once a month after school (and then plan about one weekend event per month). I don't have the bandwidth for more. If you do end up leading, you can make it what you want it to be.

This is a helpful answer! Also, can you recommend your Williamsburg Airbnb?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, there are exceptions and men are “allowed”. But GSUSA is openly unwelcoming to men.

Half the volunteers in my kid's troop are dads, including the leader. I've never felt unwelcome as a male volunteer. There are restrictions, but they all make sense to me. I can't sleep in a room with scouts other than my daughter, that makes sense for safety. There have to be some female volunteers, again, that makes sense for a group that's supposed to be for girls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread has been an interesting read. What I come away with is that there is something fundamental about the membership and program business model that does not work quire right. I am not informed enough to venture a guess, but I suspect it has something to do with not recognizing or enforcing the need for adult involvement. Or, maybe there is something off-putting about the adult volunteer experience that discourages participation or retention. Is this a rational observation?

It works fine as a model, but people are so overworked at their office jobs now that many don't want their kids to participate in things that require additional effort from them as parents. Which is a perfectly reasonable way to organize your kids' schedule - throw some money at it and get them off your hands for a few hours a week - but it gets ridiculous when those parents start demanding that GSUSA cease to exist so their kid won't know there's an extracurricular they're not signed up for.

I'm a PP and see this happening more broadly, not just in Girl Scouts. See many of the summer swim threads with parents complaining about volunteering and asking why the team can't just pay for people to run concessions or serve as timers. Our neighborhood for years has had events that were organized by parents, and they aren't happening as much because newer families with young kids want to attend but not plan them. Our church has tons of families sign their kids up for Sunday school but it's already September and they still can't find enough parent volunteers to teach all the grade levels.

It's a model that has worked and does work for many families. However, it culturally appears that at least in this area of the country families have the resources that they'd rather give of their money than their time for children's extracurriculars. This becomes a personal decision for each family whether they prioritize a particular activity enough to make it happen.

I am the OP. I am fine paying money and also volunteering. I just don’t want to be the troup leader and be responsible for training and monthly meetings. I would be happy to be involved and organize activities. My daughter is five and eager to make friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is just something about the GSUSA business model that makes its program more impacted by these factors. Other programs are challenged by similar things, but I don’t see the same level of operating difficulty and volunteer membership churn. I know we are especially busy people in the DMV, but we are probably not as unique as we think we are. Organization program and business approaches need to adapt in order to thrive, and with the exception of the cookie finance strategy, GSUSA volunteers just appear to be trudging an uphill path — and being told everything is okay. Well, enough from me, as I am not informed enough to say much more.

I agree and will go one step further and say part of the problem is that GSUSA model creates too many disincentives for volunteers. The amount of required training and the procedures they have in place are excessive. Of course we all want competent and knowledgeable adults to supervise kids, particularly when camping or participating in "high risk" activities. In my experience, though, the GSUSA trainings and requirements went well beyond that and were largely a waste of a time. There are many opportunities to streamline the training and volunteer requirements without raising legal liabilities.

It would be way less daunting if more troops had multi-age models, so that parents with older kids could more directly mentor and assist the families just getting started in Girl Scouts. Some volunteers do this anyway, they volunteer more of their time to answer questions and share documents. I think it would be better for everyone to have older and younger kids working in the same group so that they can pool resources and more efficiently transfer knowledge.