What's the appeal for Amherst?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Tiny, mediocre campus in a lackluster town. No academic highlights (like Williams tutorial, Swarthmore Honors, etc). Racial and socioeconomic diversity on paper, but every group sticks with themselves. Snobby, condescending students who think they're big shots. This struck us because the students we met at Yale and Brown were so much more friendly and humble. They tout small classes but only 62% are under 20 students- every other top ranked SLAC and nearly every top 20 university is ahead of them. They themselves said few utilize the 5 College consortium, so that's a moot benefit.

What is the big hype behind this school? I don't get it.

Hype is mostly created by alumni who get free education which literally changes their lives. Its a great value at $0 cost. Wealthy athletes also get to enjoy an "ivy equivalent" as cost is not an issue for them.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We were seriously interested in liberal arts colleges. I found their faculty in CS and STEM to be second rate (look at how many CS faculty they have).
I know research is not its main focus.. then what’s the difference from good private high schools?

You were seriously interested in LACs and you found Amherst lacking?

Bullshit.

ps I count 8 CS faculty. How many should a liberal arts college with less than 1,800 students have?

Out of 8 CS faculty, two of them are on leave. Amherst certainly can teach introductory CS classes, but what else can they teach? CS is quite broad, but Amherst simply doesn’t have enough faculty to teach advanced CS courses. You might be able to learn more from free online CS classes.
Amherst can be great for majors like English, Philosophy, maybe math.. they say you can take courses at uMass, then why do you pay high tuition if you are going to take classes at state school

Why would someone go to a SLAC for CS? Sounds like a poor fit.

If PP didn't like CS at Amherest, s/he needs to scratch off all the ivies - they are all liberal arts schools.

The ivies are all universities. All are also classified as R1.

They have liberal arts schools within them, as nearly every university in the USA does.

DP. This is a distinction without a difference. Being a university rather than a college does not inherently mean an institution has a stronger computer science program.

It is by no means a distinction without a difference. And your other point is not one anyone is arguing. Swing and a miss.

This tangent is specifically about the computer science program. If you are trying to derail it into something else, that’s a separate issue.

Stop being pedantic. I directly responded to a stupid comment that "the ivies - they are all liberal arts schools."

You are splitting hairs in something you admit does not make a substantive difference in the context of this discussion.

[Anonymous]

I don't get encouragement of self segregation there. Yes, its great if you belong to a group but not so much if you don't.

[Anonymous]

Why does anyone start a thread like this? The OP obviously isn’t interested in anyone’s answers to the question, so why pose the question in the first place?

The preference for one college or another is largely subjective with a few objective facts that are relevant. So, if it almost entirely comes to subjective preference, there’s really nothing to talk about here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why does anyone start a thread like this? The OP obviously isn’t interested in anyone’s answers to the question, so why pose the question in the first place?

The preference for one college or another is largely subjective with a few objective facts that are relevant. So, if it almost entirely comes to subjective preference, there’s really nothing to talk about here.

OP is bitter that their child didn’t get in and is looking to start a pile-on so they will feel better about it. It’s rather childish.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:not a good value for the price.

Since Amherst costs the same as essentially all LACs, and is more generous with need based aid than nearly all, how do you justify this claim?

It has an exceptionally high cost and no merit scholarship so there is no way for a student to afford it themselves with loans if their parent doesn't want to drain their retirement savings. Its only generous to parents with need, not students with need.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why does anyone start a thread like this? The OP obviously isn’t interested in anyone’s answers to the question, so why pose the question in the first place?

The preference for one college or another is largely subjective with a few objective facts that are relevant. So, if it almost entirely comes to subjective preference, there’s really nothing to talk about here.

OP is bitter that their child didn’t get in and is looking to start a pile-on so they will feel better about it. It’s rather childish.

Din't try to dissmiss OP's opinion because yours is different. I'm not OP, my child was accepted and I felt the same.

[Anonymous]

Wealthy people finding a degree for their privilege children

[Anonymous]

I don’t think think anything OP said about Amherst is correct, except the comment about diversity. It is, and always has been, at the top of the pack for SLACs and many kids there turn down lots of other schools. (I was admitted everywhere I applied and chose Amherst.). It’s a gorgeous campus in a great college community with cool college towns, and great professors who are really engaged with the students. Their commitment to diversity is super intense, though, so there’s no way my white UMC kids from MoCo are getting in. So I’m definitely not talking it up to them!
On the “different groups” point….my experience from some decades ago is that the only group that really didn’t mix much was the prep school kids from NYC (the Dalton folks, etc., not the Regis kids). Those are also the guy that go into I-banking so maybe what PP experienced—-but those kids are at every top school. I went to Yale graduate school and I found the Yale undergrads in my program pretty insufferable, but, again, there may be some selection bias there.

At any rate—hope everyone finds a good spot for their particular student!

[Anonymous]

Thank you to PP who explained the issues with the lax team and coach. My kid enjoys lax, but hates the old lax bro culture. I shared the info and DC is glad the president took more forceful steps to change the program's leadership and culture. Our tour guide alluded to some issues with a sports team but didn't get into specifics. That type of behavior tears the fabric of any community, but is much more damaging at a small school. I'm sorry it came to that. It's an excellent school and still on DC's list. I'd love to hear other alum/parent experiences. Thanks again for sharing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think think anything OP said about Amherst is correct, except the comment about diversity. It is, and always has been, at the top of the pack for SLACs and many kids there turn down lots of other schools. (I was admitted everywhere I applied and chose Amherst.). It’s a gorgeous campus in a great college community with cool college towns, and great professors who are really engaged with the students. Their commitment to diversity is super intense, though, so there’s no way my white UMC kids from MoCo are getting in. So I’m definitely not talking it up to them!
On the “different groups” point….my experience from some decades ago is that the only group that really didn’t mix much was the prep school kids from NYC (the Dalton folks, etc., not the Regis kids). Those are also the guy that go into I-banking so maybe what PP experienced—-but those kids are at every top school. I went to Yale graduate school and I found the Yale undergrads in my program pretty insufferable, but, again, there may be some selection bias there.

At any rate—hope everyone finds a good spot for their particular student!

True story - admissions director from Amherst visited my NoVa public many years ago, at a time when Amherst was looking to diversify its admissions pool beyond New England and Mid-Atlantic prep schools.

He made a presentation to a group of seniors the counselors had decided might be Amherst material, and then invited questions. Crickets.

He then pointed to me and said I must have a question. I asked him whether a middle-class kid from a NoVa public might feel out of place at a school with so many private-school kids. For whatever reason, the question triggered the AD and he started yelling about how there were kids from Harlem and from all different stations and walks of life there. In retrospect, it was a softball question for an admissions director, but he appeared to be seriously angry and offended.

About two hours after the presentation, I got a call to come see my guidance counselor. I thought he was going to chew me out for offending the AD, but he said that he'd gone over the grades and activities of some of the invited students with the AD and that the AD had indicated that he could essentially guarantee that three of us would be admitted, if we chose to apply. I don't know if the AD had any idea I was the kid who had set him off during the Q&A session.

I did not apply to Amherst, but one of the others did and ended up going there (I ended up going to an Ivy, as did the third student). My classmate who went to Amherst ended up making loads of money in Silicon Valley. He had nothing but good things to say about Amherst. We used to give him a hard time about a famous person in his fraternity.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We were seriously interested in liberal arts colleges. I found their faculty in CS and STEM to be second rate (look at how many CS faculty they have).
I know research is not its main focus.. then what’s the difference from good private high schools?

You were seriously interested in LACs and you found Amherst lacking?

Bullshit.

ps I count 8 CS faculty. How many should a liberal arts college with less than 1,800 students have?

Out of 8 CS faculty, two of them are on leave. Amherst certainly can teach introductory CS classes, but what else can they teach? CS is quite broad, but Amherst simply doesn’t have enough faculty to teach advanced CS courses. You might be able to learn more from free online CS classes.
Amherst can be great for majors like English, Philosophy, maybe math.. they say you can take courses at uMass, then why do you pay high tuition if you are going to take classes at state school

Why would someone go to a SLAC for CS? Sounds like a poor fit.

If PP didn't like CS at Amherest, s/he needs to scratch off all the ivies - they are all liberal arts schools.

The ivies are all universities. All are also classified as R1.

They have liberal arts schools within them, as nearly every university in the USA does.

DP. This is a distinction without a difference. Being a university rather than a college does not inherently mean an institution has a stronger computer science program.

It is by no means a distinction without a difference. And your other point is not one anyone is arguing. Swing and a miss.

This tangent is specifically about the computer science program. If you are trying to derail it into something else, that’s a separate issue.

Stop being pedantic. I directly responded to a stupid comment that "the ivies - they are all liberal arts schools."

You are splitting hairs in something you admit does not make a substantive difference in the context of this discussion.

No I do not admit that. You are a horrible serial-strawmanner. Leave me alone please.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:not a good value for the price.

Since Amherst costs the same as essentially all LACs, and is more generous with need based aid than nearly all, how do you justify this claim?

It has an exceptionally high cost and no merit scholarship so there is no way for a student to afford it themselves with loans if their parent doesn't want to drain their retirement savings. Its only generous to parents with need, not students with need.

You fail to answer the substance of the question - how is it different from other LACs? Amherst is one of the most generous LACs there is. What you describe applies to virtually every small private college.

And the cost is not “exceptionally high”. It’s normal. All private colleges cost about that, which while i agree is too much, does not distinguish Amherst as unusually egregious. In fact, the exact opposite because of their high endowment per student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't get encouragement of self segregation there. Yes, its great if you belong to a group but not so much if you don't.

How is this any different from any other college out there? Or high school for that matter. This is the human condition. Everyone learns to deal with this, some with healthier coping mechanisms than others so teach your children well.

[Anonymous]

I get that but doesn’t see the need of having separate forms for blacks and athletes and gays, everyone is a human and a student, mix them up and let them learn from each other.