Is it time for private school vouchers in Montgomery County?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would you take your child out of MCPS if there was a private school voucher program so Montgomery County residents had school choice?

Sure, if you want to ruin any chance of an average family getting their kids a great education.

yeah, giving families MORE choice really ruins that

Again, please provide a list of secular private schools that will accept the voucher for the entire tuition.
Maybe add to that the number of available openings.
Are you really suggesting that if ALL families want private school choices, the options are there?

why would there be a list for something that does not yet exist?

How about this just give us a list of secular schools that have a tuition that is less than or equal to $16,000. Most private schools in the area are super expensive if they're not being subsidized by the Catholic church

This. And even the Catholic Church subsidized ones are in the 20-25k range. Also there is additional cost for lunch and transportation. Also tuition rises each year by about 3%(this year some rose 5-7%. While some privates address a range of special needs, many do not address much beyond mild ADHD and possibly dyslexia.

It be real interesting to watch even more families wade through the application and interview process for this small number of seats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would you take your child out of MCPS if there was a private school voucher program so Montgomery County residents had school choice?

Sure, if you want to ruin any chance of an average family getting their kids a great education.

yeah, giving families MORE choice really ruins that

Go lurk on the DCPS board and tell me if more choice is creating better outcomes. I lived and worked in DC and I did not see a lot of positive outcomes from charters /school lottery unless you got a really good number or sibling preference. There was also a lot of situations where parents would be hopping from one school to the other or school is playing Hot potato to try and get rid of students

This describes our entire experience with DCPS. I don't blame the families seeking the best outcomes for their kids, but every year my child was in school there, their friends left for better lottery picks. Every single year. And of the half of their class that remained in their charter school? Half again mysteriously vanished mid-year.

I remember one kid, I used to volunteer and he and I were friends. He was really smart but he wasn't doing well academically and he had some behavior stuff--nothing worse than my own ASD kid, really. (Who at the time was undxed) But he was less blonde and his parents were less rich. One day he came up to me. He looked like he'd been crying.

"I wanted to say good-bye," he said.

I didn't really get it. The principal (who would be fired herself n six months) was hovering behind him and so were his parents. I smiled and said bye. I think I knew, but I wanted to be wrong.

That was his last day. I never found out why.

I think of him and the other kids that left that school mid-year a lot, actually. I also think of my daughter's classmates who graduated with her. We moved to MD. They all ended up at T3 charter middle schools. A few of those schools were closed in the next few years, meaning they'd change again. One girl did lottery into Latin.

She got the golden ticket.

Sorry, I said DCPS, but I meant DCCS or whatever it's called, actually. Before the charter school thing we ourselves did one year with DCPS too. It was also a hot garbage fire, although I have to admit the academics were good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Great way to shift wealth towards the wealthy while reducing effectiveness for the rest by decimating economies of scale. It's a win-win for the self-centered, with the added bonuses of 1) being able to note the resulting degradation of public education as a support for the "need" to continue voucher programs and 2) being able to subsidize single-view religious teaching.

But, hey, there's always one or two edge cases from the rest to whom they can point as benefitting. "See, in America, anyone can get ahead. Let the invisible hand of the market do its thing!"

What a crock...

Ha ha! What are the "economies of scale" that provide benefits to MCPS consumers? The top notch curriculum generated by their Central Office? School lunches? Of, never mind, subsidized by the Feds. HR? Talk to the applicants who don't hear back for months. Etc. Your whole logic is disjointed. If public schools are left with fewer high needs students perhaps they can specialize.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:yes please!!!!

Sorry. Not happening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would you take your child out of MCPS if there was a private school voucher program so Montgomery County residents had school choice?

It would hollow out public education so that private would be the only option but the right loves to privatize everything.

But the really fun part is that even if they have room — a big IF — no private school is in any way obligated to admit or to keep any student. Some of the wealthier parents eager to use public funds for specialized services for their kids might be in for a double shock — first if their kid doesn’t get all that they’re hoping for, and then, when the then-decimated and under-funded public systems won’t be able to provide services either.

In practice, this is little different from the segregation academies that were created when schools were legally supposed to integrate. The twist here is that the less expensive private schools are more likely to be religiously affiliated, thus scamming the public by using public funds to pay for private, and private religious education. Meanwhile, those without means will be left whatever the then-underfunded public schools can scrape up for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is clear that MCPS doesn’t care one iota about keeping our kids safe in school buildings.

I hope parents demand change and if that doesn’t happen, we should fight for vouchers.

“Demand” whatever you want. You’re still not getting vouchers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hell no. I don't want a single dime of my tax dollars supporting religious schools given the hatred and bigotry that organized religions espouse. People who want to send their kids to private schools, especially religious schools of any creed, can suck it up and do whatever they need to do to pay for that purely personal choice.

I'm also opposed to vouchers for charter schools, as many of those are run by for-profit companies.

+1, keep religion and profit out of education.

Funny, lots of people see anti-racist, anti-Christian, anti-biology secular humanism as a state-funded religion. And lots of people see public sector unions that are run as jobs programs as the same thing as for profit institutions, just without any incentive to actually provide good services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. I don't think that private schools are better than MCPS.

However, if there are private magnet schools under the supervision of MCPS and state education department, and if they can take MCPS kids who are magnet material but are rejected because they have a cohort in their home school, and MCPS can demonstrate quantitatively that they are top students - I am all for the voucher for these students.

Also, if there is a private special ed school that is extremely good and under MCPS supervision and state education department, and MCPS can objectively demonstrate that some MCPS student will be well served in such a school - I am all for the voucher for these students too.

In the case of both kinds of students - there has to be also a high income threshold of perhaps 300K. And a voucher of not more than 10K.

Each year, MCPS and MD dept of educatuon, must evaluate the student as well as the school to give out the voucher.

If you’re capping the voucher at 10 k, you’re basically saying that no kids will be able to use vouchers unless there parent already have quirpte a bit of money to spend on their education.

Maybe the third time will be the charm: My ask is for someone to tell me the names of a few secular private schools that cost the amount of whatever you imagine the vouchers will be. If you want to cap it at 10k, do you know of an actual, secular school that charges 10 k — all-inclusive? If not, you’re just using the tax dollars — including dollars from poorer households and households without kids — to subsidize private education for wealthier families. And that is unconscionable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would you take your child out of MCPS if there was a private school voucher program so Montgomery County residents had school choice?

It would hollow out public education so that private would be the only option but the right loves to privatize everything.

This is such a facile argument. Let's see... number of students goes down, so yes, we don't need as many buildings (those will be sold to privates) and don't need as many teachers, so they'll have to compete for their jobs or go look elsewhere. But, the smaller number of students still has the right amount of buildings, teachers, buses, a proportionate amount of funding AND they have an administration and teachers who will actually try to meet their needs, so their parents don't pull them out next year. Yup, sounds hollowed out to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. I don't think that private schools are better than MCPS.

However, if there are private magnet schools under the supervision of MCPS and state education department, and if they can take MCPS kids who are magnet material but are rejected because they have a cohort in their home school, and MCPS can demonstrate quantitatively that they are top students - I am all for the voucher for these students.

Also, if there is a private special ed school that is extremely good and under MCPS supervision and state education department, and MCPS can objectively demonstrate that some MCPS student will be well served in such a school - I am all for the voucher for these students too.

In the case of both kinds of students - there has to be also a high income threshold of perhaps 300K. And a voucher of not more than 10K.

Each year, MCPS and MD dept of educatuon, must evaluate the student as well as the school to give out the voucher.

If you’re capping the voucher at 10 k, you’re basically saying that no kids will be able to use vouchers unless there parent already have quirpte a bit of money to spend on their education.

Maybe the third time will be the charm: My ask is for someone to tell me the names of a few secular private schools that cost the amount of whatever you imagine the vouchers will be. If you want to cap it at 10k, do you know of an actual, secular school that charges 10 k — all-inclusive? If not, you’re just using the tax dollars — including dollars from poorer households and households without kids — to subsidize private education for wealthier families. And that is unconscionable.

Sorry: “….no kids will be able to use vouchers unless THEIR parents already have QUITE a bit of money…”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. I don't think that private schools are better than MCPS.

However, if there are private magnet schools under the supervision of MCPS and state education department, and if they can take MCPS kids who are magnet material but are rejected because they have a cohort in their home school, and MCPS can demonstrate quantitatively that they are top students - I am all for the voucher for these students.

Also, if there is a private special ed school that is extremely good and under MCPS supervision and state education department, and MCPS can objectively demonstrate that some MCPS student will be well served in such a school - I am all for the voucher for these students too.

In the case of both kinds of students - there has to be also a high income threshold of perhaps 300K. And a voucher of not more than 10K.

Each year, MCPS and MD dept of educatuon, must evaluate the student as well as the school to give out the voucher.

If you’re capping the voucher at 10 k, you’re basically saying that no kids will be able to use vouchers unless there parent already have quirpte a bit of money to spend on their education.

Maybe the third time will be the charm: My ask is for someone to tell me the names of a few secular private schools that cost the amount of whatever you imagine the vouchers will be. If you want to cap it at 10k, do you know of an actual, secular school that charges 10 k — all-inclusive? If not, you’re just using the tax dollars — including dollars from poorer households and households without kids — to subsidize private education for wealthier families. And that is unconscionable.

Montgomery County ------------ $16,005

With changes in regulations, and no need to pay top dollar for public employees, parents could pool that money and create pods, so could churches, etc. That's what charters are supposed to be, but of course Montgomery County shot down every attempt at creating a charter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This topic always makes me laugh. What is the most liberal place on the planet? Many would say the Netherlands. Legalized pot. Prostitution, legal. Free needles for addicts. And yep - direct pay (vouchers) for parents to choose their schools. The takoma Park crowd never takes liberalism to its logical conclusion with education. If you simply voucher the 16,000 per student MCPS supposedly pays to educate our kids in a supersized, filthy school (here’s looking at you Wootton) kids would largely be better off. But it proves MCPS is a Democratic Party jobs program more than an education system. Hard to fathom 3 billion a year to fund such a poor excuse of an education system but here we are. Public schools need to exist but be much smaller and more responsive. Never going to happen with powers that be in the county.

Boom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. I don't think that private schools are better than MCPS.

However, if there are private magnet schools under the supervision of MCPS and state education department, and if they can take MCPS kids who are magnet material but are rejected because they have a cohort in their home school, and MCPS can demonstrate quantitatively that they are top students - I am all for the voucher for these students.

Also, if there is a private special ed school that is extremely good and under MCPS supervision and state education department, and MCPS can objectively demonstrate that some MCPS student will be well served in such a school - I am all for the voucher for these students too.

In the case of both kinds of students - there has to be also a high income threshold of perhaps 300K. And a voucher of not more than 10K.

Each year, MCPS and MD dept of educatuon, must evaluate the student as well as the school to give out the voucher.

If you’re capping the voucher at 10 k, you’re basically saying that no kids will be able to use vouchers unless there parent already have quirpte a bit of money to spend on their education.

Maybe the third time will be the charm: My ask is for someone to tell me the names of a few secular private schools that cost the amount of whatever you imagine the vouchers will be. If you want to cap it at 10k, do you know of an actual, secular school that charges 10 k — all-inclusive? If not, you’re just using the tax dollars — including dollars from poorer households and households without kids — to subsidize private education for wealthier families. And that is unconscionable.

Montgomery County ------------ $16,005

With changes in regulations, and no need to pay top dollar for public employees, parents could pool that money and create pods, so could churches, etc. That's what charters are supposed to be, but of course Montgomery County shot down every attempt at creating a charter.

$16,005 would be enough for our family to pull our special needs child out of MCPS. We would be able to make up the difference.

The alternative is taking MCPS to Due Process after two years of neglecting my child’s needs. MCPS does not have the staff the IEP requires. Because of regression during online learning, he now needs more than MCPS has on his IEP. MCPS would save the staffing expenses for the service providers. My son would get the service at a private who has the staffing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This topic always makes me laugh. What is the most liberal place on the planet? Many would say the Netherlands. Legalized pot. Prostitution, legal. Free needles for addicts. And yep - direct pay (vouchers) for parents to choose their schools. The takoma Park crowd never takes liberalism to its logical conclusion with education. If you simply voucher the 16,000 per student MCPS supposedly pays to educate our kids in a supersized, filthy school (here’s looking at you Wootton) kids would largely be better off. But it proves MCPS is a Democratic Party jobs program more than an education system. Hard to fathom 3 billion a year to fund such a poor excuse of an education system but here we are. Public schools need to exist but be much smaller and more responsive. Never going to happen with powers that be in the county.

Boom.

This is not the own you think it is. For so many reasons.

The Netherlands heavily subsidize and regulate their "private" schools . It's hardly a capitalist paradise. True of every well-run European country.

I know that you, Kenny-the-Intern-at-the-Federalist think $16,000 per kid is a lot of money for those greedy schools, but schools in the 1980s were routinely getting 10k or more in many places and there's been some wee inflation since then.

How will you hire qualified teachers? How will you pay them? What oversight will any of these schools have? None? And magically the free market will erase all grift and abuses from the system? No private school coaches will ever molest students. No private school students will ever bring guns or knives to school. No private schools will ever be without their trusty resource officers, because there is also an infinite number of THEM who are willing to work for a small hourly fee on a contract basis so you don't have to worry about benefits....

It must be so comforting to believe in such a magic universe, Kenny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. I don't think that private schools are better than MCPS.

However, if there are private magnet schools under the supervision of MCPS and state education department, and if they can take MCPS kids who are magnet material but are rejected because they have a cohort in their home school, and MCPS can demonstrate quantitatively that they are top students - I am all for the voucher for these students.

Also, if there is a private special ed school that is extremely good and under MCPS supervision and state education department, and MCPS can objectively demonstrate that some MCPS student will be well served in such a school - I am all for the voucher for these students too.

In the case of both kinds of students - there has to be also a high income threshold of perhaps 300K. And a voucher of not more than 10K.

Each year, MCPS and MD dept of educatuon, must evaluate the student as well as the school to give out the voucher.

If you’re capping the voucher at 10 k, you’re basically saying that no kids will be able to use vouchers unless there parent already have quirpte a bit of money to spend on their education.

Maybe the third time will be the charm: My ask is for someone to tell me the names of a few secular private schools that cost the amount of whatever you imagine the vouchers will be. If you want to cap it at 10k, do you know of an actual, secular school that charges 10 k — all-inclusive? If not, you’re just using the tax dollars — including dollars from poorer households and households without kids — to subsidize private education for wealthier families. And that is unconscionable.

Montgomery County ------------ $16,005

With changes in regulations, and no need to pay top dollar for public employees, parents could pool that money and create pods, so could churches, etc. That's what charters are supposed to be, but of course Montgomery County shot down every attempt at creating a charter.

$16,005 would be enough for our family to pull our special needs child out of MCPS. We would be able to make up the difference.

The alternative is taking MCPS to Due Process after two years of neglecting my child’s needs. MCPS does not have the staff the IEP requires. Because of regression during online learning, he now needs more than MCPS has on his IEP. MCPS would save the staffing expenses for the service providers. My son would get the service at a private who has the staffing.

You are delusional or imaginary and it's probably cruel of me to say if it's the former.

If you can afford private school why did you sit on your ass for two years and let your child regress? Will be the question you will be asked. I suspect. To which you will respond, why doesn't MCPS have the staff he needs? Where is their magical staff summoning wand? Can't they borrow it from the magical private school that will admit your son and has all the resources it needs to admit 3,000 kids just like him?