what is the craziest reasons your family members have become estranged?

[Anonymous]

NP. I am thinking it would be a bad idea to take any family member into real therapy but if your nephew was having marital issues, and you had interpersonal relationship expertise, you might counsel him. Just like millions of under qualified moms, dad, uncles etc "counsel" young people all the time. At least this time a young man got good advice to get tf out of a dysfunctional family.

TEAM UNCLE WHO COUNSELED NEPHEW OUT

[Anonymous]

3 of my 5 half siblings refused to speak to our dad (or my mom) for years after they told them they were having a baby (me). My parents had met 4 years after my dad and their mom got amicably divorced, and I was born 7 years after my parents married. They were all in their 20s when I was born.

I’m now in my 30s and have a distant and strange relationship with 4/5 of them - the other one sadly had a stroke several years ago and is incapacitated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My uncle refused to drive my mother to the airport because he was tired, he just got home from his shift at the hospital. He called her a taxi. She didn't talk to him for FIFTEEN YEARS after that. FIFTEEN.

My FIL arrived 2 hours early to a brunch at our house. We were not ready (understandably). I had a young baby who wasn't dressed, I hadn't showered, we hadn't finished cooking. My DH nicely asked his FIL to go to a coffee shop for at least an hour until we could get ready.

FIL was so, so, so pissed!! He left and came back, but he was angry, and stayed angry for about 10 years. Then he disinherited DH in his will!

Insane, but that's my FIL.

Holy sh!t you made him LEAVE?!? He couldn’t sit and watch tv? Read a newspaper? Help?
I’m pissed for him. That is INCREDIBLY rude.
(Yes, I know showing up 2 hours early is rude, but your reaction is on a whole other level.)

Yeah, the FIL was right in this case. This is beyond crazy. I would never kick a guest out of my home even though they arrived 2 hours early. That was not petty. The FIL just realized what hateful undeserving people. I hope he left the money to strangers or distant relatives.

+2 I agree. I cannot imagine not letting my FIL in the house. That's crazy!!! Wow.

Unless you were in a studio apartment this is insane. I would disinherit you too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry-legal and ethical are not one in the same. No idea if legal, but definitely violates ethics code.

It seems like if you’re so sure of the ethics, you’d have an idea about the legality. It makes me wonder if you’re confusing ethics with your feelings, and in “it feels to me like it would be unethical to treat anyone you’re remotely related to.”

I have served on boards to review this. We review ethical guidelines. There is something called a "Dual Relationship" and what your father did falls under that. If anyone in the family reported him for this he could be subject to anything from a sanction to losing his license. You can lose your license for something that while legal, violates the ethical guidelines of your profession.

Ok, well you can help the "It's an ethical code violation" poster out (or you're that poster. Simply link to the ethical code of a state or municipality where this situation would make this something one could lose their license over. I really will believe if you post the code (with the cite of course, not just some language with no basis) so post the link to the actual code so we can see where it is.

NP. I'm a licensed clinic psychologist. It's is absolutely a violation of the ethics code for a psychologist to see a family member for counseling. 3.05 Multiple Relationships and also 3.06 Conflict of Interest.

My dad is a marital counselor and offered to help his nephew with counseling. Nephew and his parents were expecting my dad to side with him and tell the wife she was in the wrong and needed to just do what her husband said. When dad refused (and actually encouraged her to leave this abusive dynamic), dad’s entire family cut us all off.

This is exactly why. Your dad was already an uncle. The nephew expected that relationship to take precedence in the counseling relationship. It did not, and the nephew felt hurt by that. Regardless of whether he was an abusive jerk, and regardless of whether your dad gave the "correct" advice, he never should have entered into that role in the first place. The nephews reactions was completely predictable, and there is no excuse for your dad doing it. The only times it's allowed is when the therapist provides a very specialized service AND it would create hardship for the client to try to find another therapist providing that same service AND the therapist takes great pains, such as seeking ongoing peer consultation, to make sure the relationship provides more help than harm to the client.

If this situation was brought before our ethics board, given what you have stated here, he would absolutely be sanctioned. It would depend on the specifics as to whether he would lose his license (I'm guessing no...that' usually more for people who sleep with clients)

Did you say you were a student? You still have a lot to learn.


https://www.apa.org/ethics/code

3.05 Multiple Relationships

(a) A multiple relationship occurs when a psychologist is in a professional role with a person and (1) at the same time is in another role with the same person, (2) at the same time is in a relationship with a person closely associated with or related to the person with whom the psychologist has the professional relationship, or (3) promises to enter into another relationship in the future with the person or a person closely associated with or related to the person.

A psychologist refrains from entering into a multiple relationship if the multiple relationship could reasonably be expected to impair the psychologist's objectivity, competence, or effectiveness in performing his or her functions as a psychologist, or otherwise risks exploitation or harm to the person with whom the professional relationship exists.

Multiple relationships that would not reasonably be expected to cause impairment or risk exploitation or harm are not unethical.

(b) If a psychologist finds that, due to unforeseen factors, a potentially harmful multiple relationship has arisen, the psychologist takes reasonable steps to resolve it with due regard for the best interests of the affected person and maximal compliance with the Ethics Code.

(c) When psychologists are required by law, institutional policy, or extraordinary circumstances to serve in more than one role in judicial or administrative proceedings, at the outset they clarify role expectations and the extent of confidentiality and thereafter as changes occur. (See also Standards 3.04, Avoiding Harm , and 3.07, Third-Party Requests for Services .)

3.06 Conflict of Interest
Psychologists refrain from taking on a professional role when personal, scientific, professional, legal, financial, or other interests or relationships could reasonably be expected to (1) impair their objectivity, competence, or effectiveness in performing their functions as psychologists or (2) expose the person or organization with whom the professional relationship exists to harm or exploitation.

Nowhere in this does it say it's prohibited.

Do you know what the word "refrain" means?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry-legal and ethical are not one in the same. No idea if legal, but definitely violates ethics code.

It seems like if you’re so sure of the ethics, you’d have an idea about the legality. It makes me wonder if you’re confusing ethics with your feelings, and in “it feels to me like it would be unethical to treat anyone you’re remotely related to.”

I have served on boards to review this. We review ethical guidelines. There is something called a "Dual Relationship" and what your father did falls under that. If anyone in the family reported him for this he could be subject to anything from a sanction to losing his license. You can lose your license for something that while legal, violates the ethical guidelines of your profession.

Ok, well you can help the "It's an ethical code violation" poster out (or you're that poster. Simply link to the ethical code of a state or municipality where this situation would make this something one could lose their license over. I really will believe if you post the code (with the cite of course, not just some language with no basis) so post the link to the actual code so we can see where it is.

NP. I'm a licensed clinic psychologist. It's is absolutely a violation of the ethics code for a psychologist to see a family member for counseling. 3.05 Multiple Relationships and also 3.06 Conflict of Interest.

My dad is a marital counselor and offered to help his nephew with counseling. Nephew and his parents were expecting my dad to side with him and tell the wife she was in the wrong and needed to just do what her husband said. When dad refused (and actually encouraged her to leave this abusive dynamic), dad’s entire family cut us all off.

This is exactly why. Your dad was already an uncle. The nephew expected that relationship to take precedence in the counseling relationship. It did not, and the nephew felt hurt by that. Regardless of whether he was an abusive jerk, and regardless of whether your dad gave the "correct" advice, he never should have entered into that role in the first place. The nephews reactions was completely predictable, and there is no excuse for your dad doing it. The only times it's allowed is when the therapist provides a very specialized service AND it would create hardship for the client to try to find another therapist providing that same service AND the therapist takes great pains, such as seeking ongoing peer consultation, to make sure the relationship provides more help than harm to the client.

If this situation was brought before our ethics board, given what you have stated here, he would absolutely be sanctioned. It would depend on the specifics as to whether he would lose his license (I'm guessing no...that' usually more for people who sleep with clients)

Did you say you were a student? You still have a lot to learn.


https://www.apa.org/ethics/code

3.05 Multiple Relationships

(a) A multiple relationship occurs when a psychologist is in a professional role with a person and (1) at the same time is in another role with the same person, (2) at the same time is in a relationship with a person closely associated with or related to the person with whom the psychologist has the professional relationship, or (3) promises to enter into another relationship in the future with the person or a person closely associated with or related to the person.

A psychologist refrains from entering into a multiple relationship if the multiple relationship could reasonably be expected to impair the psychologist's objectivity, competence, or effectiveness in performing his or her functions as a psychologist, or otherwise risks exploitation or harm to the person with whom the professional relationship exists.

Multiple relationships that would not reasonably be expected to cause impairment or risk exploitation or harm are not unethical.

(b) If a psychologist finds that, due to unforeseen factors, a potentially harmful multiple relationship has arisen, the psychologist takes reasonable steps to resolve it with due regard for the best interests of the affected person and maximal compliance with the Ethics Code.

(c) When psychologists are required by law, institutional policy, or extraordinary circumstances to serve in more than one role in judicial or administrative proceedings, at the outset they clarify role expectations and the extent of confidentiality and thereafter as changes occur. (See also Standards 3.04, Avoiding Harm , and 3.07, Third-Party Requests for Services .)

3.06 Conflict of Interest
Psychologists refrain from taking on a professional role when personal, scientific, professional, legal, financial, or other interests or relationships could reasonably be expected to (1) impair their objectivity, competence, or effectiveness in performing their functions as psychologists or (2) expose the person or organization with whom the professional relationship exists to harm or exploitation.

Nowhere in this does it say it's prohibited.

Do you know what the word "refrain" means?

I never said it was a good idea, I said it was left up to the practitioner's judgement. AGAIN, that is the language in the code you posted:

"if the multiple relationship could reasonably be expected to impair the psychologist's..."

[Anonymous]

^^ nowhere does it say "under no circumstances"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My uncle refused to drive my mother to the airport because he was tired, he just got home from his shift at the hospital. He called her a taxi. She didn't talk to him for FIFTEEN YEARS after that. FIFTEEN.

My FIL arrived 2 hours early to a brunch at our house. We were not ready (understandably). I had a young baby who wasn't dressed, I hadn't showered, we hadn't finished cooking. My DH nicely asked his FIL to go to a coffee shop for at least an hour until we could get ready.

FIL was so, so, so pissed!! He left and came back, but he was angry, and stayed angry for about 10 years. Then he disinherited DH in his will!

Insane, but that's my FIL.

Holy sh!t you made him LEAVE?!? He couldn’t sit and watch tv? Read a newspaper? Help?
I’m pissed for him. That is INCREDIBLY rude.
(Yes, I know showing up 2 hours early is rude, but your reaction is on a whole other level.)

Yeah, the FIL was right in this case. This is beyond crazy. I would never kick a guest out of my home even though they arrived 2 hours early. That was not petty. The FIL just realized what hateful undeserving people. I hope he left the money to strangers or distant relatives.

Huh. My reaction was the opposite. You don't show up at someone's house TWO HOURS early. Nothing wrong with a coffee shop. Disinheriting is a WAY over reaction.

I get the pain. I was always stuck with hosting both my family and the ils for events. One sibling and spouse would show up early just to piss me off. They would laugh about it then complain that we didn't have food out. One year we let them in but walked away and ignored them. The next year we didn't answer the doorbell and let them sit outside for 30 minutes - still hours early. Anyone who does this kind of thing and ignores basic consideration and decency doesn't get much of anything from me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This doesn’t happen in healthy families. I am estranged from my three siblings who are also estranged from each other who are also estranged from cousins aunts uncles etc. There were estrangements in the generation before us as well, or at very least distant very cool relationships, so we come by it honestly.

I participate in support groups for adult children of alcoholics and for adult children of narcissists. In my own experience and from observation of others, most true estrangements don’t happen for crazy reasons. They happen because people reach a breaking point with sick family dynamics and to preserve/improve their mental health they have to remove themselves from further exposure to a toxic family atmosphere, from ongoing emotional abuse.

+1,000,000

Often there is a lot of untreated mental illness-especially personality disorders, but also alcoholism, drug abuse, depression and anxiety. There may be a small or big event where afterwards a cut-off happens, but it had been brewing for years, even decades.

[phone] also sometimes just stay stuck in the past. I have relatives who cannot be in the same room without drinking which inevitably leads to arguments, hurt feelings, resentment and the cycle begins anew. At some point you have to hop off the crazy train.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone in my family is estranged from each other, ha. LOTS of drama. Here’s how it happened:

- My dad is a marital counselor and offered to help his nephew with counseling. Nephew and his parents were expecting my dad to side with him and tell the wife she was in the wrong and needed to just do what her husband said. When dad refused (and actually encouraged her to leave this abusive dynamic), dad’s entire family cut us all off.

- When I left my NPD husband, my mom and siblings all sided with him against me. He’s very charming and persuasive. They gave him a ton of info to use against me to gain custody (which didn’t work, judges don’t care I took SSRIs as a teen) and xH convinced them to sabotage my job and any relationship I tried to have after him. Things like contacting clients to tell them I don’t know what I’m doing and harassing a man I was dating by calling repeatedly, calling his job, etc. So I don’t talk to mom and siblings anymore.

- Mom’s sister hooked up with her husband, so my stepdad. They obviously don’t talk anymore.

- Mom has 4 sisters (5 girls total) who were all very close their whole lives. Then 2 of the sisters left their husbands after the kids were grown. Mom went crazy on them for divorcing - thought it was the wrong thing for them to do - everyone else was pressured into picking sides and eventually just stopped talking to each other because of all the drama.

- Mom and stepdad are still married but basically estranged/separated. She got tired of his crap and bought him a house in another state so she wouldn’t have to deal with him.

So the only people I talk to are my dad (who is awesome), and one aunt who calls me about once a year when drunk, rambles on, then hangs up without saying bye.

First off, your dad could have lost his license. You do NOT do counseling with family members. Totally unethical.

First off? Was there supposed to be more?

It’s legal to counsel family as long as you remain objective. You don’t lose a license over it.

No. Completely unacceptable.

Completely unacceptable to the licensing board? Or you?

I don't know why anyone is defending the dad marital counselor here. Whether the term is legal or ethical, we know when something feels and looks wrong. One could argue that it is a conflict of interest to professionally counsel a family member. He should have stayed out of it and made some supportive referrals to colleagues who could help the couple. Common sense-wise, he should have known he was wading into a family minefield so... the guy has poor judgment so for many reasons he should not be practicing.

[Anonymous]

My cousin’s husband didn’t talk to my cousin’s parents for a few years because he claimed they stole salmon from his freezer when he was out of town. I wish I was lying but I’m not.

My entire family doesn’t talk to a different cousin because he dropped my elderly great uncle off at his house after dinner one night and refused to help him up the stairs. The cousin drove away and a neighbor found my uncle at the bottom of the stairs and helped him in the house. But that cousin has always been one of the most awful people I’ve ever met, so good riddance.