Is it common to have 30+ kids in class in MCPS ES?

[Anonymous]

The MCPS Board rejected a request from the principal of my child's ES for additional staffing for the 18-19 school year. So, given current enrollment numbers, there are going to be 30-31 students in my child's fourth grade class, as well as in a few other grades, which exceeds MCPS's own guidelines. And typically we get a few additional students in the class during the school year, so that number will get even higher. Do other MCPS ES classrooms have 30+ students?

[Anonymous]

I have never seen a class that size at our ES. I thought there was a cap of 27 students per class, but maybe i’m mistaken.

[Anonymous]

Yes our school had this in the first grade. MCPS response - doesn't matter kids are already testing above grade level before the start day one so there can be no adverse effect. MCPS central office also claimed that the "cap" is a guideline and not a hard cut off so for some schools they go over. It gets worse because staffing increases don't happen during the year - or so they said. So when new kids joined the class size became even bigger.

[Anonymous]

We had 31 in a 5th grade class, but I've never seen it in 4th. That seems CRAZY. (It is also crazy in 5th.)

[Anonymous]

Our ES typically has 18 to 21.

[Anonymous]

No, it's not common. Sometimes they create a class that combines two grades to avoid it.

It is more likely to happen at small ES compared to large ES.

But there are over 130 ES in MCPS and over 700 grades across those ES so not common could mean it happens 30 or 50 or even 70 times a year.

[Anonymous]

No. I’ve seen 23-27

[Anonymous]

What do the classes in the other grade levels look like? Did the principal decide to make class sizes in other grade levels smaller? That would be pretty much the only reason why central office wouldn't approve an additional allocation. That, or there is literally no space in the building.

[Anonymous]

Its common in Potomac ES schools where the over all enrollment is low and the scores are off the charts - the lowest reading group is a year above grade level, less than 5% of the kids get under 90% on MAP tests etc. MCPS doesn't care about these kids, in fact they hurt the achievement gap numbers for performing so well.

[Anonymous]

According to the August enrollment #s, it looks like our school will have 30 kids in 5th grade, 28 in 3rd and 4th, 25 in 2nd, and about 22-23 in K and 1st. I would really love if MoCo could use the billions it spends on education to hire a few paraprofessionals so our kids don't get lost in the shuffle.

[Anonymous]

More common in small schools with special ed programs because those kids don’t count (don’t get me started...).

[Anonymous]

What do the classes in the other grade levels look like? Did the principal decide to make class sizes in other grade levels smaller? That would be pretty much the only reason why central office wouldn't approve an additional allocation. That, or there is literally no space in the building.

Parents really complain about combining different grades even if it gets to a smaller class size. Its often easier for a principal to just throw up there hands that they can't get more staff than face the angry complaints from parents of the older kids in a combined class.

In reality, for the high performing schools those kids are all already easily working 2 years above grade and the curriculum only goes so far. From a teaching perspective, its much easier to teach a combined 1st-2nd grade class in a high performing school where there is less academic range than in a smaller focus classroom with kids several years behind grade level and kids above grade level. However, this argument doesn't go over well with parents who are frustrated that the system has achievement capped so low.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

What do the classes in the other grade levels look like? Did the principal decide to make class sizes in other grade levels smaller? That would be pretty much the only reason why central office wouldn't approve an additional allocation. That, or there is literally no space in the building.

Parents really complain about combining different grades even if it gets to a smaller class size. Its often easier for a principal to just throw up there hands that they can't get more staff than face the angry complaints from parents of the older kids in a combined class.

In reality, for the high performing schools those kids are all already easily working 2 years above grade and the curriculum only goes so far. From a teaching perspective, its much easier to teach a combined 1st-2nd grade class in a high performing school where there is less academic range than in a smaller focus classroom with kids several years behind grade level and kids above grade level. However, this argument doesn't go over well with parents who are frustrated that the system has achievement capped so low.

That's not what I meant. Schools get a total number of classroom teacher allocations and the principal decides how to divide them by grade level. I was asking if it's possible that the principal decided to, let's say, make all of the 2nd grade classes much smaller this year because it's a tough group for behaviors and therefore other grade levels have to make do with larger class sizes. It's totally a made up example but it can happen like that.

[Anonymous]

Not in Title I or Focus schools. Everybody else, common in 3th or 5th, not the lower grades. Ours is a big/overcrowded school, and that is the norm, not the exception. But, usually not until mid-year, not at the start of the year!

Let me guess, one of the many new Principals who does what MCPS tells them and doesn't know how to finesse the system to get what they need?

[Anonymous]

Not sure if it's common, but it does happen.

I think it's too big. But, I also think 27 kids in K with no aide is ridiculous. And, MCPS disagrees.