Harvard and the elite grade inflation

[Anonymous]

Shame on Harvard and any of the ivies who already admit students for $$$$$$$

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2017/09/19/how-harvard-helps-its-richest-and-most-arrogant-students-get-ahead/

[Anonymous]

I have a child at Harvard who is doing a science concentration. This quote stood out to me in particular for being inaccurate from her experiences.

Three biochemistry graduate students I knew and trusted all had an identical story. In the introductory course they taught, undergraduates weren’t required to show up at a single lecture or section; they could score in the teens on the final and still pass. The professor’s basis for leniency, they said, was that “they pay too much tuition for us to fail them.”

In lecture based courses, students are given exams with expectations set to slightly inflated standards (A = 90+, A- = 87-90, B+ = 83-87, B = 80-83, B- = 75-80, etc). The more difficult classes, like organic chemistry, have higher curves (A = 85+, B = 70+, C = 55+), but this is the case at many universities as well (Berkeley O'Chem, A= 80+, B = 70+, C = 60+). In general, students do extremely well, with a median consistently around the 90 range. This is not because they make the tests easier, but rather because the students are exceptionally capable and hard-working. The notion of scoring in the teens and passing seems unimaginable.

[Anonymous]

We have kids going to Harvard from our prep school who graduated without any distinction where around 50% of the class did. These kids got in due to $$$$ and connections. I can see this happening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a child at Harvard who is doing a science concentration. This quote stood out to me in particular for being inaccurate from her experiences.

Three biochemistry graduate students I knew and trusted all had an identical story. In the introductory course they taught, undergraduates weren’t required to show up at a single lecture or section; they could score in the teens on the final and still pass. The professor’s basis for leniency, they said, was that “they pay too much tuition for us to fail them.”

In lecture based courses, students are given exams with expectations set to slightly inflated standards (A = 90+, A- = 87-90, B+ = 83-87, B = 80-83, B- = 75-80, etc). The more difficult classes, like organic chemistry, have higher curves (A = 85+, B = 70+, C = 55+), but this is the case at many universities as well (Berkeley O'Chem, A= 80+, B = 70+, C = 60+). In general, students do extremely well, with a median consistently around the 90 range. This is not because they make the tests easier, but rather because the students are exceptionally capable and hard-working. The notion of scoring in the teens and passing seems unimaginable.

I don't understand what you are trying to point out. You can set grades based on scores but the markings of the paper for the elites could be skewed - I could mark a paper to be 90 when it actually should be a 75. So student gets an A. But was the marking honest? No.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Shame on Harvard and any of the ivies who already admit students for $$$$$$$

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2017/09/19/how-harvard-helps-its-richest-and-most-arrogant-students-get-ahead/

It's the "Matthew Effect" of accumulated advantage.

Unfair, unsurprising and very true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a child at Harvard who is doing a science concentration. This quote stood out to me in particular for being inaccurate from her experiences.

Three biochemistry graduate students I knew and trusted all had an identical story. In the introductory course they taught, undergraduates weren’t required to show up at a single lecture or section; they could score in the teens on the final and still pass. The professor’s basis for leniency, they said, was that “they pay too much tuition for us to fail them.”

In lecture based courses, students are given exams with expectations set to slightly inflated standards (A = 90+, A- = 87-90, B+ = 83-87, B = 80-83, B- = 75-80, etc). The more difficult classes, like organic chemistry, have higher curves (A = 85+, B = 70+, C = 55+), but this is the case at many universities as well (Berkeley O'Chem, A= 80+, B = 70+, C = 60+). In general, students do extremely well, with a median consistently around the 90 range. This is not because they make the tests easier, but rather because the students are exceptionally capable and hard-working. The notion of scoring in the teens and passing seems unimaginable.

Berkeley students complain of "grade deflation" so please do not imply Berkeley has grade inflation like some of the Ivies. Plenty of students at Berkeley receive Bs, Cs, and Ds since there are no grade inflation at all! They may curve exams grades etc. but 80+ is not an A.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a child at Harvard who is doing a science concentration. This quote stood out to me in particular for being inaccurate from her experiences.

Three biochemistry graduate students I knew and trusted all had an identical story. In the introductory course they taught, undergraduates weren’t required to show up at a single lecture or section; they could score in the teens on the final and still pass. The professor’s basis for leniency, they said, was that “they pay too much tuition for us to fail them.”

In lecture based courses, students are given exams with expectations set to slightly inflated standards (A = 90+, A- = 87-90, B+ = 83-87, B = 80-83, B- = 75-80, etc). The more difficult classes, like organic chemistry, have higher curves (A = 85+, B = 70+, C = 55+), but this is the case at many universities as well (Berkeley O'Chem, A= 80+, B = 70+, C = 60+). In general, students do extremely well, with a median consistently around the 90 range. This is not because they make the tests easier, but rather because the students are exceptionally capable and hard-working. The notion of scoring in the teens and passing seems unimaginable.

Harvard has the biggest grade inflation amongst the ivies, this is well documented and known. They only people who consistently deny it are Harvard students and parents.

[Anonymous]

I thought Brown had the most inflation? And Cornell and Princeton have hardest curves?

[Anonymous]

Look at how many Harvard students graduate with Latin honors...

Entitlement is rampant. We busted a Harvard student for falsifying a reference (actually impersonated a professor in a phone call--we tracked down the real professor.) Harvard was like, what are you gonna do? The professor told us the kid had plagiarized a paper and he had been told to give him an A. At least Harvard couldn't make me give the kid a job. But I don't consider resumes from Harvard undergrad anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look at how many Harvard students graduate with Latin honors...

Entitlement is rampant. We busted a Harvard student for falsifying a reference (actually impersonated a professor in a phone call--we tracked down the real professor.) Harvard was like, what are you gonna do? The professor told us the kid had plagiarized a paper and he had been told to give him an A. At least Harvard couldn't make me give the kid a job. But I don't consider resumes from Harvard undergrad anymore.

^^I didn't mean Harvard sounded threatening. It was more like, "Kids these days!" Shrug.

[Anonymous]

Trump, a Wharton grad, is an idiot -- his kids Ivanka and Jr have Wharton degrees and are obviously idiots -- Kushner has a Harvard BA and NYU JD and he's an idiot.

But it's not just rich kids -- look at the athletes. I bet most of Stanford's football team couldn't pass ONE genuine Stanford course, yet some of them are on campus for a few years. Sometimes they receive degrees!

[Anonymous]

Why should kids that get into these elite colleges get Bs? A curve at schools <1% of teens in the nation can get into is stupid.

Instead of obsessing over the As these elite kids get, maybe you should obsess over the As and Bs all these worthless colleges give everyone who's breathing. Baristas at Starbucks have bachelors degrees and struggle to read The Times they sell.

[Anonymous]

I know quite a few idiot sorority girls and frat boys with straight As at their state school.

[Anonymous]

I'm probably actually one of the few people that attended both Berkeley and Harvard undergrad.

Harvard is not this grade-inflated free for all and Berkeley is not this impossible pressure-cooker. At both schools, there are higher level classes that are notoriously tough for those who want to go on to a PhD (usually) where many people leave early on while you can drop a class. At both schools, there were also notoriously easy fluff classes and majors.

Actually, at Harvard, it was harder to get a 4.0 than at Berkeley. I knew quite a few 4.0s at Berkeley, but nobody at Harvard had one in my graduating class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Trump, a Wharton grad, is an idiot -- his kids Ivanka and Jr have Wharton degrees and are obviously idiots -- Kushner has a Harvard BA and NYU JD and he's an idiot.

But it's not just rich kids -- look at the athletes. I bet most of Stanford's football team couldn't pass ONE genuine Stanford course, yet some of them are on campus for a few years. Sometimes they receive degrees!

Trump was a joke while at Penn. All his classmates have said he was nothing special and a douche. Ivanka on the other hand has been described as very serious and hard-working by her classmates at Penn. But yeah who knows if she would have been able to transfer to Penn from GTown without Daddy's legacy and money. Kushner is obviously a tool, and his younger brother an bigger tool. Both Harvard grads.