Study: "Discussions of D.C. public school options in an online forum" (yes, this one)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OK, I'll boil it down. Don't be selfish.

What's selfish?

A constantly shifting metric. It’s selfish for a white parent whose IB school is struggling to lottery into a charter, but it’s NOT selfish for a white parent whose IB school is doing well to send their kid there. Any affirmative act to better your situation is selfish, but if you just find yourself in a good situation by virtue of just happening to live IB for a good school, then obviously you can’t be selfish for sending your kid to your neighborhood school.

It is a rigged game.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OK, I'll boil it down. Don't be selfish.

What's selfish?

A constantly shifting metric. It’s selfish for a white parent whose IB school is struggling to lottery into a charter, but it’s NOT selfish for a white parent whose IB school is doing well to send their kid there. Any affirmative act to better your situation is selfish, but if you just find yourself in a good situation by virtue of just happening to live IB for a good school, then obviously you can’t be selfish for sending your kid to your neighborhood school.

It is a rigged game.

It's easier to scream at the white parents closest in socioeconomic status and held values. Very inefficient use of energy and passion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think the point is that white parents should be seen and not heard. If you are WOTP, give up your IB preference and go EOTP to a DCPS. Don't join the PTA, but write large checks. Mouths shut, wallets open.

If you are EOTP, go to your IB. No charters. Mouths shut, wallets open.

Charters should for BIPOC children only.
Language immersion for BIPOC only.
TAG programming for BIPOC only.

Celebrate BIPOC excellence.
Acknowledge white mediocrity.
Coach your children to accept their own mediocrity and acknowledge BIPOC excellence.

If you play the lottery, you are a racist and segregationist.

If you go to school OOB to go to school WOTP, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you allow your child to go to an IB WOTP school, and your child is white, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go private, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you move to MoCo or NoVa, obvi racist and segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school. and advocate for TAG, immersion, special programming - you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school and do not adhere to "mouths shut, wallets open" you are a racist and segregationist.

If you encourage others to attend high-performing schools dominated by BIPOC children, you are resource hoarding, because you are racist.

If you use the phrase "hidden gems," you are racist and encourage resource hoarding.

If any of this seems unfair - your white fragility is a fatal condition.

Everything you do is racist.

I'm an AfAm mom of a Pre-K bi-racial kid and I'm not sending my DS to DCPS schools going forward.
What we got a taste of with virtual learning from our so-okay IB school turned me off. The more I learned and researched what DCPS has to offer middle class POC boys the more pissed off I got. The reading scores and the math scores for POC boys is horrifying. It doesn't matter if Nice White Parents (a podcast I've hate-listened to along with the Integrated Schools podcast) show up or don't show up to our IB the responsibility of the suckitude of the school falls on DCPS.

And "Resource Hoarding" is utter BS. Apparently failure to handicap your kids, like DCPS is handicapping Black boys, is resource hoarding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The main thing this thread has proved is that young, liberal women with no kids never ever *ever* get tired of accusing other white people of being racist.

Interesting. I had been assuming the racist-calling posters were actually Black or POC women. That's not conscious but that's what I just realized. If it's just a bunch of holier than thou white moms whose kids probably attend some school on the Hill, omg I wasted a lot of energy reading this, because screw you.

The ones calling everyone racist who have Larlo at a "hidden gem" are indeed white, or at least not Black or Latino/a. It's completely in line with the DCUM ethos of dunking on other parents you feel superior to.

The race war is just a bunch of self loathing white women calling each other racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the point is that white parents should be seen and not heard. If you are WOTP, give up your IB preference and go EOTP to a DCPS. Don't join the PTA, but write large checks. Mouths shut, wallets open.

If you are EOTP, go to your IB. No charters. Mouths shut, wallets open.

Charters should for BIPOC children only.
Language immersion for BIPOC only.
TAG programming for BIPOC only.

Celebrate BIPOC excellence.
Acknowledge white mediocrity.
Coach your children to accept their own mediocrity and acknowledge BIPOC excellence.

If you play the lottery, you are a racist and segregationist.

If you go to school OOB to go to school WOTP, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you allow your child to go to an IB WOTP school, and your child is white, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go private, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you move to MoCo or NoVa, obvi racist and segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school. and advocate for TAG, immersion, special programming - you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school and do not adhere to "mouths shut, wallets open" you are a racist and segregationist.

If you encourage others to attend high-performing schools dominated by BIPOC children, you are resource hoarding, because you are racist.

If you use the phrase "hidden gems," you are racist and encourage resource hoarding.

If any of this seems unfair - your white fragility is a fatal condition.

Everything you do is racist.

I'm an AfAm mom of a Pre-K bi-racial kid and I'm not sending my DS to DCPS schools going forward.
What we got a taste of with virtual learning from our so-okay IB school turned me off. The more I learned and researched what DCPS has to offer middle class POC boys the more pissed off I got. The reading scores and the math scores for POC boys is horrifying. It doesn't matter if Nice White Parents (a podcast I've hate-listened to along with the Integrated Schools podcast) show up or don't show up to our IB the responsibility of the suckitude of the school falls on DCPS.

And "Resource Hoarding" is utter BS. Apparently failure to handicap your kids, like DCPS is handicapping Black boys, is resource hoarding.

Best summary of SJW white women I've ever seen in my life. Bookmarking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Nice White Parents podcast is helpful on paradigm setting.

Yes, go to your local schools.

No, don’t act like you are a “pioneer” or own or direct them just because you are part of the class with money, ability to donate or fundraise, etc.

Act like you’re joining a group project that needs effort but NOT a new boss! Be helpful not screamy. Don’t show up and then try to create a new magic cohort for your child on day 2. Join, reach out, etc.

Here's my issue with this:

In DC, your "local" school might be Garrison or Deal or Ludlow-Taylor or another well-regarded DCPS. Going to a school like that and not getting a white savior complex is honestly pretty easy.

But if your IB is a genuinely struggling DCPS, it is much, much harder said than done. If you go to a school with high truancy rates, broken facilities, and a completely unfunded PTA, how do you navigate this as a "nice white parent" who both doesn't want special treatment for your kid but does want a baseline level of quality in your kids education. You aren't advocating for a brand new bilingual program or a G&T program that is really just a way to self-segregate the white kids or whatever. But can you advocate for anything without being seen as a "pioneer"? Is your job to accept the quality of your local school even if it impacts your kid? Even if no one in your kid's class reads at grade level?

So many of the people I know who say "Just got to your local school and don't play white savior" go to schools that are already heavily gentrified. Do you really know what it's like to send your kid to a truly struggling DCPS? I'm talking about the schools that can't even fill their classes with IB parents because so many local parents (of every race) simply lottery out. Do you actually know what that looks like?

I don't think you do, or you wouldn't talk about this like it's easy. It's not. It sucks. You are simply rich enough to live IB for a good school. Sure, your school might be diverse and might have a sizable at-risk population. That is very different than being at a school where 90%+ are at-risk. You have no idea.

The other problem I have with this is that the whole theory for why integration improves educational quality is precisely because affluent parents can advocate to improve, and in DC at least, can actually directly fund improvements at schools. It seems frankly insane to argue that the only way to be is to enroll in a poorly performing school, and then do nothing to help it? Plus, the advocacy is with the school administration and DCPS - which is a system we're all part of; there's nothing pioneering about it. This kind of advocacy benefits everybody as long as parents are minimally attentive to the needs of the school as a whole. Sure there are examples of PTAs doing eye-rolling stuff (like fixating on after school snacks) but overall the DC PTAs do things like fund teachers' aides, which benefits everyone. I think I remember hearing that at Brent the PTA funded a behavioral tech, which can be a HUGE huge benefit to the whole school.

Not only a behavioral tech, mainly to improve playground management at recess and lunch, but a PTA-funded after-care program to serve kids facing the most dire academic challenges that includes tutoring and sports. Pre-Covid, the program was a big improvement over DCPS funded tutoring. The authors of this study want to throw the baby out with the bath water in diverse schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Nice White Parents podcast is helpful on paradigm setting.

Yes, go to your local schools.

No, don’t act like you are a “pioneer” or own or direct them just because you are part of the class with money, ability to donate or fundraise, etc.

Act like you’re joining a group project that needs effort but NOT a new boss! Be helpful not screamy. Don’t show up and then try to create a new magic cohort for your child on day 2. Join, reach out, etc.

Here's my issue with this:

In DC, your "local" school might be Garrison or Deal or Ludlow-Taylor or another well-regarded DCPS. Going to a school like that and not getting a white savior complex is honestly pretty easy.

But if your IB is a genuinely struggling DCPS, it is much, much harder said than done. If you go to a school with high truancy rates, broken facilities, and a completely unfunded PTA, how do you navigate this as a "nice white parent" who both doesn't want special treatment for your kid but does want a baseline level of quality in your kids education. You aren't advocating for a brand new bilingual program or a G&T program that is really just a way to self-segregate the white kids or whatever. But can you advocate for anything without being seen as a "pioneer"? Is your job to accept the quality of your local school even if it impacts your kid? Even if no one in your kid's class reads at grade level?

So many of the people I know who say "Just got to your local school and don't play white savior" go to schools that are already heavily gentrified. Do you really know what it's like to send your kid to a truly struggling DCPS? I'm talking about the schools that can't even fill their classes with IB parents because so many local parents (of every race) simply lottery out. Do you actually know what that looks like?

I don't think you do, or you wouldn't talk about this like it's easy. It's not. It sucks. You are simply rich enough to live IB for a good school. Sure, your school might be diverse and might have a sizable at-risk population. That is very different than being at a school where 90%+ are at-risk. You have no idea.

The other problem I have with this is that the whole theory for why integration improves educational quality is precisely because affluent parents can advocate to improve, and in DC at least, can actually directly fund improvements at schools. It seems frankly insane to argue that the only way to be is to enroll in a poorly performing school, and then do nothing to help it? Plus, the advocacy is with the school administration and DCPS - which is a system we're all part of; there's nothing pioneering about it. This kind of advocacy benefits everybody as long as parents are minimally attentive to the needs of the school as a whole. Sure there are examples of PTAs doing eye-rolling stuff (like fixating on after school snacks) but overall the DC PTAs do things like fund teachers' aides, which benefits everyone. I think I remember hearing that at Brent the PTA funded a behavioral tech, which can be a HUGE huge benefit to the whole school.

Not only a behavioral tech, mainly to improve playground management at recess and lunch, but a PTA-funded after-care program to serve kids facing the most dire academic challenges that includes tutoring and sports. Pre-Covid, the program was a big improvement over DCPS funded tutoring. The authors of this study want to throw the baby out with the bath water in diverse schools.

I am the PP saying that the problem with “just go to your local school and don’t act like a pioneer” is that it’s very hard to do at a truly struggling school.

Brent is a perfect example of what I’m saying. Brent is a mostly high SES school with some at-risk students. And it’s 60% white! In D.C. Brent is only diverse in that white person way where white patents can feel good that their white kids go to school with *some* POC. But it’s a majority white school in a wealthy neighborhood. It is EASY to be a white parent at Brent and not accidentally step on toes or stress about doing either too much or too little. You will get the benefit of the doubt from your fellow white parents and besides, it’s a school where nearly three-quarters of students are at or above grade level. They can focus money and attention on the small minority of students who are struggling, and feel benevolent about it.

I’m talking about having an IB school that is 99% at risk, and being one of a handful of the lower-grade white parents (because there are no upper grade white parents). To say to someone in that situation: you HAVE to go to your IB, but once there you should treat it like a group project, don’t talk too much, don’t align with other parents in your situation, just let others take the lead? That might keep you from getting called racist and keep anyone from making a podcast about you, specifically. But it won’t improve the school at all. It also pretty much guaranteed that the white parents and a good portion of families with ANY other options will leave the school at the first opportunity.

Until someone can explain to me how I can contribute to a truly struggling IB school as a minority white parent in a way that actually helps, without being racist, I’m going to go ahead and ignore everything else you have to say. “This is what we do at Brent” is not helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the point is that white parents should be seen and not heard. If you are WOTP, give up your IB preference and go EOTP to a DCPS. Don't join the PTA, but write large checks. Mouths shut, wallets open.

If you are EOTP, go to your IB. No charters. Mouths shut, wallets open.

Charters should for BIPOC children only.
Language immersion for BIPOC only.
TAG programming for BIPOC only.

Celebrate BIPOC excellence.
Acknowledge white mediocrity.
Coach your children to accept their own mediocrity and acknowledge BIPOC excellence.

If you play the lottery, you are a racist and segregationist.

If you go to school OOB to go to school WOTP, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you allow your child to go to an IB WOTP school, and your child is white, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go private, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you move to MoCo or NoVa, obvi racist and segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school. and advocate for TAG, immersion, special programming - you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school and do not adhere to "mouths shut, wallets open" you are a racist and segregationist.

If you encourage others to attend high-performing schools dominated by BIPOC children, you are resource hoarding, because you are racist.

If you use the phrase "hidden gems," you are racist and encourage resource hoarding.

If any of this seems unfair - your white fragility is a fatal condition.

Everything you do is racist.

I'm an AfAm mom of a Pre-K bi-racial kid and I'm not sending my DS to DCPS schools going forward.
What we got a taste of with virtual learning from our so-okay IB school turned me off. The more I learned and researched what DCPS has to offer middle class POC boys the more pissed off I got. The reading scores and the math scores for POC boys is horrifying. It doesn't matter if Nice White Parents (a podcast I've hate-listened to along with the Integrated Schools podcast) show up or don't show up to our IB the responsibility of the suckitude of the school falls on DCPS.

And "Resource Hoarding" is utter BS. Apparently failure to handicap your kids, like DCPS is handicapping Black boys, is resource hoarding.

Thank you for this rational view. I would do the same I’m afraid (get my nonwhite boy out of dcps asap).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the point is that white parents should be seen and not heard. If you are WOTP, give up your IB preference and go EOTP to a DCPS. Don't join the PTA, but write large checks. Mouths shut, wallets open.

If you are EOTP, go to your IB. No charters. Mouths shut, wallets open.

Charters should for BIPOC children only.
Language immersion for BIPOC only.
TAG programming for BIPOC only.

Celebrate BIPOC excellence.
Acknowledge white mediocrity.
Coach your children to accept their own mediocrity and acknowledge BIPOC excellence.

If you play the lottery, you are a racist and segregationist.

If you go to school OOB to go to school WOTP, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you allow your child to go to an IB WOTP school, and your child is white, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go private, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you move to MoCo or NoVa, obvi racist and segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school. and advocate for TAG, immersion, special programming - you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school and do not adhere to "mouths shut, wallets open" you are a racist and segregationist.

If you encourage others to attend high-performing schools dominated by BIPOC children, you are resource hoarding, because you are racist.

If you use the phrase "hidden gems," you are racist and encourage resource hoarding.

If any of this seems unfair - your white fragility is a fatal condition.

Everything you do is racist.

I'm an AfAm mom of a Pre-K bi-racial kid and I'm not sending my DS to DCPS schools going forward.
What we got a taste of with virtual learning from our so-okay IB school turned me off. The more I learned and researched what DCPS has to offer middle class POC boys the more pissed off I got. The reading scores and the math scores for POC boys is horrifying. It doesn't matter if Nice White Parents (a podcast I've hate-listened to along with the Integrated Schools podcast) show up or don't show up to our IB the responsibility of the suckitude of the school falls on DCPS.

And "Resource Hoarding" is utter BS. Apparently failure to handicap your kids, like DCPS is handicapping Black boys, is resource hoarding.

Thank you for this rational view. I would do the same I’m afraid (get my nonwhite boy out of dcps asap).

+1.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the point is that white parents should be seen and not heard. If you are WOTP, give up your IB preference and go EOTP to a DCPS. Don't join the PTA, but write large checks. Mouths shut, wallets open.

If you are EOTP, go to your IB. No charters. Mouths shut, wallets open.

Charters should for BIPOC children only.
Language immersion for BIPOC only.
TAG programming for BIPOC only.

Celebrate BIPOC excellence.
Acknowledge white mediocrity.
Coach your children to accept their own mediocrity and acknowledge BIPOC excellence.

If you play the lottery, you are a racist and segregationist.

If you go to school OOB to go to school WOTP, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you allow your child to go to an IB WOTP school, and your child is white, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go private, you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you move to MoCo or NoVa, obvi racist and segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school. and advocate for TAG, immersion, special programming - you are a racist and a segregationist.

If you go to a majority BIPOC school and do not adhere to "mouths shut, wallets open" you are a racist and segregationist.

If you encourage others to attend high-performing schools dominated by BIPOC children, you are resource hoarding, because you are racist.

If you use the phrase "hidden gems," you are racist and encourage resource hoarding.

If any of this seems unfair - your white fragility is a fatal condition.

Everything you do is racist.

I'm an AfAm mom of a Pre-K bi-racial kid and I'm not sending my DS to DCPS schools going forward.
What we got a taste of with virtual learning from our so-okay IB school turned me off. The more I learned and researched what DCPS has to offer middle class POC boys the more pissed off I got. The reading scores and the math scores for POC boys is horrifying. It doesn't matter if Nice White Parents (a podcast I've hate-listened to along with the Integrated Schools podcast) show up or don't show up to our IB the responsibility of the suckitude of the school falls on DCPS.

And "Resource Hoarding" is utter BS. Apparently failure to handicap your kids, like DCPS is handicapping Black boys, is resource hoarding.

A comment and a question (as always I’m assuming you’re a real parent and not one of the conservative trolls that come here to divide us.)

First, virtual PreK has been a total joke for everyone. Give in person K a shot before you throw DCPS out. That said I agree DCPS Central really does not do a good job.

Question: when you say “DCPS handicaps Black boys”, what do you mean? That they don’t care about creating and supporting top schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The main thing this thread has proved is that young, liberal women with no kids never ever *ever* get tired of accusing other white people of being racist.

42 pages and counting.

And you know PPs’ ages, races, political persuasions and whether they have children how?[/quote

Are you kidding? Young liberal women who don't have school-age kids are the *only* people who make these arguments.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The main thing this thread has proved is that young, liberal women with no kids never ever *ever* get tired of accusing other white people of being racist.

Interesting. I had been assuming the racist-calling posters were actually Black or POC women. That's not conscious but that's what I just realized. If it's just a bunch of holier than thou white moms whose kids probably attend some school on the Hill, omg I wasted a lot of energy reading this, because screw you.

The ones calling everyone racist who have Larlo at a "hidden gem" are indeed white, or at least not Black or Latino/a. It's completely in line with the DCUM ethos of dunking on other parents you feel superior to.

The race war is just a bunch of self loathing white women calling each other racist.

A circular firing squad of Karens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The main thing this thread has proved is that young, liberal women with no kids never ever *ever* get tired of accusing other white people of being racist.

Interesting. I had been assuming the racist-calling posters were actually Black or POC women. That's not conscious but that's what I just realized. If it's just a bunch of holier than thou white moms whose kids probably attend some school on the Hill, omg I wasted a lot of energy reading this, because screw you.

The ones calling everyone racist who have Larlo at a "hidden gem" are indeed white, or at least not Black or Latino/a. It's completely in line with the DCUM ethos of dunking on other parents you feel superior to.

The race war is just a bunch of self loathing white women calling each other racist.

A circular firing squad of Karens.

It always comes back to misogyny and racism, doesn’t it? So gross.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The main thing this thread has proved is that young, liberal women with no kids never ever *ever* get tired of accusing other white people of being racist.

42 pages and counting.

And you know PPs’ ages, races, political persuasions and whether they have children how?

People with kids generally aren't this mean to other parents. Parenting is hard, and it teaches you to have empathy for people going through the same thing. Also, people who don't have kids are just really kind of clueless about what it's like. They're like virgins lecturing porn stars on sex.

[Anonymous]

School segregation is not good.

In an ideal world, our neighborhoods and schools would be naturally diverse, with a mix of housing types and a population with a mix of income levels. This is true in some parts of D.C. -- there are neighborhoods and schools with natural diversity. Maybe that's the one situation where you can find white people who don't feel guilty about their choices.

School segregation is inextricably tied up with housing segregation.

Housing segregation has long-standing racist roots (redling, racially restrictive covenants). The segregation continues bc
people see that the schools in some areas are "better" and then move there and the schools get even better and the problem compounds.

At the root, we need to eliminate single-family zoning. Then this whole conversation will feel less insane and unsolvable.