lax culture from an insider

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So generally speaking are top ayers at Landon, STA, Gtown prep good enough to play division 1 at Harvard, Yale, etc?

STA seniors will be playing at both Harvard and Yale next year.

Not sure about Havard according to this:

http://www.laxpower.com/recruits/recruits.php?action=viewRcd&db=recruits2013

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So generally speaking are top ayers at Landon, STA, Gtown prep good enough to play division 1 at Harvard, Yale, etc?

STA seniors will be playing at both Harvard and Yale next year.

Not sure about Havard according to this:

http://www.laxpower.com/recruits/recruits.php?action=viewRcd&db=recruits2013

The Havard recruit is for 2014

http://www.laxpower.com/recruits/recruits.php?action=viewRcd&db=recruits2014

Prep already has 10 D1 commits for 2014 and some kids in the class of 2015 have already committed.

[Anonymous]

For Girls - Viz has girls playing at Stanford, Yale and Brown

SSSA had 10 recruits - no Ivy

Holton had one recruit

[Anonymous]

So actually they don't compare kids in Ivy vs. non-Ivy. They compare athletes at Ivy's vs. non-athletes and show that those with higher SAT's perform better in the classroom. Do they measure if they perform better out of the classroom. Do they compare athletes to students who have a full time job? That would seem to have more value. Sure if I have less responsibilities and more time to study, I perform better. That is the results of their analysis?

Do they break it down by sport?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So a group of Ivy League and non-Ivy League athletes shared their SAT scores, high school grades, calls rank, etc. and then years later shared their career or post college earnings with the researcher?

It strikes me that no everyone would be willing to share such information. So the sample consists only of those willing to reveal sensitive personal information - in my experience such people are few and far between (do you know what your best friend has earned over the course of her career?) and those who are willing to share the information skew toward the successful in the group. I'd also be wary of a study based on the assumption that SAT scores etc. make two people alike.

But hey if a PRINCETON academic says it is true it must be true.

Found it!
Reclaiming the Game
College Sports and Educational Values

William G. Bowen and Sarah A. Levin
In collaboration with James L. Shulman, Colin G. Campbell, Susanne C. Pichler, & Martin A. Kurzweil

In Reclaiming the Game, William Bowen and Sarah Levin disentangle the admissions and academic experiences of recruited athletes, walk-on athletes, and other students. In a field overwhelmed by reliance on anecdotes, the factual findings are striking--and sobering. Anyone seriously concerned about higher education will find it hard to wish away the evidence that athletic recruitment is problematic even at those schools that do not offer athletic scholarships.

Thanks to an expansion of the College and Beyond database that resulted in the highly influential studies The Shape of the River and The Game of Life, the authors are able to analyze in great detail the backgrounds, academic qualifications, and college outcomes of athletes and their classmates at thirty-three academically selective colleges and universities that do not offer athletic scholarships. They show that recruited athletes at these schools are as much as four times more likely to gain admission than are other applicants with similar academic credentials. The data also demonstrate that the typical recruit is substantially more likely to end up in the bottom third of the college class than is either the typical walk-on or the student who does not play college sports. Even more troubling is the dramatic evidence that recruited athletes "underperform:" they do even less well academically than predicted by their test scores and high school grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For Girls - Viz has girls playing at Stanford, Yale and Brown

SSSA had 10 recruits - no Ivy

Holton had one recruit

Didn't the Holton goalie get recruited to Yale? I think I read that in a girls lax page somewhere on line.

[Anonymous]

It seems to cover football and basketball too. A bit different than laxers from prep schools - don't you think?

Anonymous wrote:So actually they don't compare kids in Ivy vs. non-Ivy. They compare athletes at Ivy's vs. non-athletes and show that those with higher SAT's perform better in the classroom. Do they measure if they perform better out of the classroom. Do they compare athletes to students who have a full time job? That would seem to have more value. Sure if I have less responsibilities and more time to study, I perform better. That is the results of their analysis?

Do they break it down by sport?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So a group of Ivy League and non-Ivy League athletes shared their SAT scores, high school grades, calls rank, etc. and then years later shared their career or post college earnings with the researcher?

It strikes me that no everyone would be willing to share such information. So the sample consists only of those willing to reveal sensitive personal information - in my experience such people are few and far between (do you know what your best friend has earned over the course of her career?) and those who are willing to share the information skew toward the successful in the group. I'd also be wary of a study based on the assumption that SAT scores etc. make two people alike.

But hey if a PRINCETON academic says it is true it must be true.

Found it!
Reclaiming the Game
College Sports and Educational Values

William G. Bowen and Sarah A. Levin
In collaboration with James L. Shulman, Colin G. Campbell, Susanne C. Pichler, & Martin A. Kurzweil

In Reclaiming the Game, William Bowen and Sarah Levin disentangle the admissions and academic experiences of recruited athletes, walk-on athletes, and other students. In a field overwhelmed by reliance on anecdotes, the factual findings are striking--and sobering. Anyone seriously concerned about higher education will find it hard to wish away the evidence that athletic recruitment is problematic even at those schools that do not offer athletic scholarships.

Thanks to an expansion of the College and Beyond database that resulted in the highly influential studies The Shape of the River and The Game of Life, the authors are able to analyze in great detail the backgrounds, academic qualifications, and college outcomes of athletes and their classmates at thirty-three academically selective colleges and universities that do not offer athletic scholarships. They show that recruited athletes at these schools are as much as four times more likely to gain admission than are other applicants with similar academic credentials. The data also demonstrate that the typical recruit is substantially more likely to end up in the bottom third of the college class than is either the typical walk-on or the student who does not play college sports. Even more troubling is the dramatic evidence that recruited athletes "underperform:" they do even less well academically than predicted by their test scores and high school grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
It seems to cover football and basketball too. A bit different than laxers from prep schools - don't you think?

Anonymous wrote:So actually they don't compare kids in Ivy vs. non-Ivy. They compare athletes at Ivy's vs. non-athletes and show that those with higher SAT's perform better in the classroom. Do they measure if they perform better out of the classroom. Do they compare athletes to students who have a full time job? That would seem to have more value. Sure if I have less responsibilities and more time to study, I perform better. That is the results of their analysis?

Do they break it down by sport?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So a group of Ivy League and non-Ivy League athletes shared their SAT scores, high school grades, calls rank, etc. and then years later shared their career or post college earnings with the researcher?

It strikes me that no everyone would be willing to share such information. So the sample consists only of those willing to reveal sensitive personal information - in my experience such people are few and far between (do you know what your best friend has earned over the course of her career?) and those who are willing to share the information skew toward the successful in the group. I'd also be wary of a study based on the assumption that SAT scores etc. make two people alike.

But hey if a PRINCETON academic says it is true it must be true.

Found it!
Reclaiming the Game
College Sports and Educational Values

William G. Bowen and Sarah A. Levin
In collaboration with James L. Shulman, Colin G. Campbell, Susanne C. Pichler, & Martin A. Kurzweil

In Reclaiming the Game, William Bowen and Sarah Levin disentangle the admissions and academic experiences of recruited athletes, walk-on athletes, and other students. In a field overwhelmed by reliance on anecdotes, the factual findings are striking--and sobering. Anyone seriously concerned about higher education will find it hard to wish away the evidence that athletic recruitment is problematic even at those schools that do not offer athletic scholarships.

Thanks to an expansion of the College and Beyond database that resulted in the highly influential studies The Shape of the River and The Game of Life, the authors are able to analyze in great detail the backgrounds, academic qualifications, and college outcomes of athletes and their classmates at thirty-three academically selective colleges and universities that do not offer athletic scholarships. They show that recruited athletes at these schools are as much as four times more likely to gain admission than are other applicants with similar academic credentials. The data also demonstrate that the typical recruit is substantially more likely to end up in the bottom third of the college class than is either the typical walk-on or the student who does not play college sports. Even more troubling is the dramatic evidence that recruited athletes "underperform:" they do even less well academically than predicted by their test scores and high school grades.

Not based on the ones I have seen go off to these schools based on "untimed SATs" because of a flaky LD diagnosis.

The lacrosse teams eat at the same Academic Index trough as the football and basketball teams.

Still grasping for straws, eh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So generally speaking are top ayers at Landon, STA, Gtown prep good enough to play division 1 at Harvard, Yale, etc?

STA seniors will be playing at both Harvard and Yale next year.

Not sure about Havard according to this:

http://www.laxpower.com/recruits/recruits.php?action=viewRcd&db=recruits2013

No. STA has a senior lacrosse player going to Yale. They have a RISING senior who has committed to Harvard.

STA is not a good example. It is a top notch school, but its lacrosse program has been declining for some time. They just don't have the numbers/talent to compete at the highest level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So generally speaking are top ayers at Landon, STA, Gtown prep good enough to play division 1 at Harvard, Yale, etc?

STA seniors will be playing at both Harvard and Yale next year.

Not sure about Havard according to this:

http://www.laxpower.com/recruits/recruits.php?action=viewRcd&db=recruits2013

No. STA has a senior lacrosse player going to Yale. They have a RISING senior who has committed to Harvard.

STA is not a good example. It is a top notch school, but its lacrosse program has been declining for some time. They just don't have the numbers/talent to compete at the highest level.

I think the fact that STA is not a lacrosse powerhouse, but still consistently has boys, year in and year out, going on to play college lacrosse (between 3 and 6), speaks to why parents in these parts are so lacrosse crazy. STA, Landon, and Prep will not have those kind of numbers for any other sport.

[Anonymous]

The lacrosse teams eat at the same Academic Index trough as the football and basketball teams.

Still grasping for straws, eh.

I am not the PP you are addressing but to me it does not look like grasping at straws. It's just that the data is 20 years old and NCAA studies that are done yearly with new data show different results but NCAA does not just look at 15-20 schools.

They wrote a whole book on the premise that children that have higher SATs perform better in school better than those with lower SATs.

I am not sure how impressive that study is, but I am sure it is accurate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So generally speaking are top ayers at Landon, STA, Gtown prep good enough to play division 1 at Harvard, Yale, etc?

STA seniors will be playing at both Harvard and Yale next year.

Not sure about Havard according to this:

http://www.laxpower.com/recruits/recruits.php?action=viewRcd&db=recruits2013

No. STA has a senior lacrosse player going to Yale. They have a RISING senior who has committed to Harvard.

STA is not a good example. It is a top notch school, but its lacrosse program has been declining for some time. They just don't have the numbers/talent to compete at the highest level.

I think the fact that STA is not a lacrosse powerhouse, but still consistently has boys, year in and year out, going on to play college lacrosse (between 3 and 6), speaks to why parents in these parts are so lacrosse crazy. STA, Landon, and Prep will not have those kind of numbers for any other sport.

Having 10-15% of a graduating class recruited for athletics is impressive for any school

[Anonymous]

"Such a thin attempt won't work most places. Do some reading. I recommend you start by understanding the Ivy League Academic Index for athletes and just how low the lowest band is."

The lowest band at Ivies is lower than you'd think, pathetically low. Just google what Tommy Amaker's done with Harvard basketball. However, my guess would have to be that sports like football, basketball and hockey dip much lower on average than lacrosse because lacrosse kids are almost all upper middle class from two parent families who go to top notch schools. It's hard in that situation not to get a 1250 SAT just by showing up. But I'll look at other data/stories if you have them.

[Anonymous]

This is probably the best list:

http://network.laxpower.com/laxforum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=47381&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=780

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The TWO boys drove to school and parked the car for the day. A non-lethal "BB gun" rifle replica was left in the back seat. One boy went to class while the other boy went into the woods. Having never shot a gun. he tried it, put the gun back in the car and went to class. A mom saw the "shooter" in the woods with a 'sniper rifle', and made a 911 call the police. NCS, Sidwell and St. Albans were locked down within minutes. The BB gun was found in the back seat of the car and the car was traced to the boys. The boys were taken out of class in cuffs and the incident was widely reported with dramatic video on the web.

STA acted quickly. The boys were barred from school for the remaining few weeks of the year (the lacrosse season had already ended) but allowed to graduate. Both boys faced DC gun charges. If anything, STA's quick action was deemed too harsh.

STA also put a specific prohibition against these guns in the student guidelines (page 6):

http://www.stalbansschool.org/document.doc?id=493

Guns were prohibited long before that incident.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is probably the best list:

http://network.laxpower.com/laxforum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=47381&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=780

Thanks for posting. So which club teams are represented on this list?