Libraries as homeless centers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't really get it... it seems like very different needs than libraries were designed for or librarians have the skill set for (though I know they try their best). My husband had to work with the librarian to call the police in a homeless creeper in the kids section the other day (not saying they all are, but it's two very different populations in a small space). The only solution I can think of is to offer a homeless service station next door. Warming station, social worker,coffee donuts, paper, computer bank, and bathroom to groom in. Thoughts?

Even if you offered those things, which you would never get funding for, there will still be people who prefer to go to the library, the same way that there are shelters and there are still people who prefer the street. I think it's fairly irrelevant whether you think it's two different populations in the same space. It is a public space, and while perhaps the "creeper" in question was actually doing something inappropriate, simply being in the children's section, or the rest of the library, is not inappropriate. Homeless people go to the library because it is quiet and calm and there is stuff to do. When I (a social worker) worked with homeless outreach, what I saw over and over was that there is only so much that you can really do to end homelessness. Many of the people on the streets actively refuse services, often because those "services" come with rules that they are not willing to comply with or safety issues that they are not willing to experience. I knew a lot of people who refused to go to shelters, for example, because others would steal their stuff, or because there were strict no-intoxication rules that didn't exist on the street. I'm not saying that there shouldn't be rules or that stealing is okay, but both of those issues were real enough for the people I worked with that they would not go to the shelter except as a last resort.

This is why the current movement is housing first, with very few rules attached. In other words, you can't expect people to solve their addiction problem before getting a place to live. Give them a place to live, and they are much more likely to be successful in solving their addiction issues.

[Anonymous]

If anyone is found to be taking illegal drugs in library bathrooms, then they should be banned from the public library for life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are programs on the city, county and state level to help homeless people, not to mention churches. Some people just don't want the help or they don't want to do what's required to obtain that help.

Permanent housing is not easy to obtain. Shelters are typically open during the overnight hours leaving all day to fill. Libraries are cool during the summer and warm during the winter. There are a source of entertainment and education.
As long as people are being respectful why should their address, or lack thereof be an issue.

Have some compassion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't many homeless shelters close during the day? That's never made sense to me, but libraries seem to be a temperature-controlled, fairly safe fallback for those on the streets. I agree that there should be other welcoming public facilities open to them during the day, but often there are not.

When homeless get to be "fairly safe" in the library, they make it less safe for everyone else, especially women and children. Great solution.

Some homeless people actually are women and children.

x100 this. The homeless are our fellow community members, i.e., part of the public.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't many homeless shelters close during the day? That's never made sense to me, but libraries seem to be a temperature-controlled, fairly safe fallback for those on the streets. I agree that there should be other welcoming public facilities open to them during the day, but often there are not.

When homeless get to be "fairly safe" in the library, they make it less safe for everyone else, especially women and children. Great solution.

Some homeless people actually are women and children.

x100 this. The homeless are our fellow community members, i.e., part of the public.

Yes, and they still need to follow rules for usage of public space.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't many homeless shelters close during the day? That's never made sense to me, but libraries seem to be a temperature-controlled, fairly safe fallback for those on the streets. I agree that there should be other welcoming public facilities open to them during the day, but often there are not.

When homeless get to be "fairly safe" in the library, they make it less safe for everyone else, especially women and children. Great solution.

Some homeless people actually are women and children.

x100 this. The homeless are our fellow community members, i.e., part of the public.

Yes, and they still need to follow rules for usage of public space.

No one said they shouldn't. The same as if your toddler is going around bugging people and trying to rip the books.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't many homeless shelters close during the day? That's never made sense to me, but libraries seem to be a temperature-controlled, fairly safe fallback for those on the streets. I agree that there should be other welcoming public facilities open to them during the day, but often there are not.

When homeless get to be "fairly safe" in the library, they make it less safe for everyone else, especially women and children. Great solution.

Some homeless people actually are women and children.

x100 this. The homeless are our fellow community members, i.e., part of the public.

Yes, and they still need to follow rules for usage of public space.

No one said they shouldn't. The same as if your toddler is going around bugging people and trying to rip the books.

Nobody said that, but there is a superwoke response that "homeless people have just as many rights to use the library, how dare you!!," which ignores the fact that they indeed pose big challenges to librarians to keep the library safe and clean. avoiding reality doesn't help anyone.

[Anonymous]

I don't side with the woke side of the argument after seeing firsthand the consequences of a homeless presence in a large urban library. They are a detriment to the rest of the library users. They are rarely ever there to, you know, read books. Most of them have some degree of mental illness.

I am not unsympathetic but they have become a nuisance and as a result I have stopped going to the library as often I did in the past. And I'm not the only one either. If I lived in an area with a local branch that didn't have this issue, it would be a different story.

Libraries need to make up their mind whether they're to be come the future daycare centers for homeless people or a genuine community asset.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't side with the woke side of the argument after seeing firsthand the consequences of a homeless presence in a large urban library. They are a detriment to the rest of the library users. They are rarely ever there to, you know, read books. Most of them have some degree of mental illness.

I am not unsympathetic but they have become a nuisance and as a result I have stopped going to the library as often I did in the past. And I'm not the only one either. If I lived in an area with a local branch that didn't have this issue, it would be a different story.

Libraries need to make up their mind whether they're to be come the future daycare centers for homeless people or a genuine community asset.

I can see how it may be possible to set it up so one of your preferred safeguards in effect.
Libraries could, possibly, require all patrons show documentation verifying their ID and address upon entering (valid driver's license, utility bill with the correct address (gas, water, cable, residential phone bill), cell phone bill, pay stub, W2 form, 1099 form, rental lease agreement/house deed, mortgage statement, bank statement, or State ID).
But I'm stumped as to how the other safeguard you want put in place can be implemented.
In addition to metal detectors and the ID Verification Station to deter the homeless are they supposed to set up a psychiatric checkpoint to keep out the mentally ill?
How do you propose they set it up to keep the folks you don't want out of a public library?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't side with the woke side of the argument after seeing firsthand the consequences of a homeless presence in a large urban library. They are a detriment to the rest of the library users. They are rarely ever there to, you know, read books. Most of them have some degree of mental illness.

I am not unsympathetic but they have become a nuisance and as a result I have stopped going to the library as often I did in the past. And I'm not the only one either. If I lived in an area with a local branch that didn't have this issue, it would be a different story.

Libraries need to make up their mind whether they're to be come the future daycare centers for homeless people or a genuine community asset.

I can see how it may be possible to set it up so one of your preferred safeguards in effect.
Libraries could, possibly, require all patrons show documentation verifying their ID and address upon entering (valid driver's license, utility bill with the correct address (gas, water, cable, residential phone bill), cell phone bill, pay stub, W2 form, 1099 form, rental lease agreement/house deed, mortgage statement, bank statement, or State ID).
But I'm stumped as to how the other safeguard you want put in place can be implemented.
In addition to metal detectors and the ID Verification Station to deter the homeless are they supposed to set up a psychiatric checkpoint to keep out the mentally ill?
How do you propose they set it up to keep the folks you don't want out of a public library?

Security staff that removes people who are breaking the rules. Also banning people who are known rule-breakers. Additional homeless day centers where people can use computers would probably be a good idea as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't side with the woke side of the argument after seeing firsthand the consequences of a homeless presence in a large urban library. They are a detriment to the rest of the library users. They are rarely ever there to, you know, read books. Most of them have some degree of mental illness.

I am not unsympathetic but they have become a nuisance and as a result I have stopped going to the library as often I did in the past. And I'm not the only one either. If I lived in an area with a local branch that didn't have this issue, it would be a different story.

Libraries need to make up their mind whether they're to be come the future daycare centers for homeless people or a genuine community asset.

I can see how it may be possible to set it up so one of your preferred safeguards in effect.
Libraries could, possibly, require all patrons show documentation verifying their ID and address upon entering (valid driver's license, utility bill with the correct address (gas, water, cable, residential phone bill), cell phone bill, pay stub, W2 form, 1099 form, rental lease agreement/house deed, mortgage statement, bank statement, or State ID).
But I'm stumped as to how the other safeguard you want put in place can be implemented.
In addition to metal detectors and the ID Verification Station to deter the homeless are they supposed to set up a psychiatric checkpoint to keep out the mentally ill?
How do you propose they set it up to keep the folks you don't want out of a public library?

Security staff that removes people who are breaking the rules. Also banning people who are known rule-breakers. Additional homeless day centers where people can use computers would probably be a good idea as well.

Also - measures that ban loitering, homeless encampments, and being drunk/high around the library might be helpful. That way the library doesn't become a place to congregate for drunk people or drug dealers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't side with the woke side of the argument after seeing firsthand the consequences of a homeless presence in a large urban library. They are a detriment to the rest of the library users. They are rarely ever there to, you know, read books. Most of them have some degree of mental illness.

I am not unsympathetic but they have become a nuisance and as a result I have stopped going to the library as often I did in the past. And I'm not the only one either. If I lived in an area with a local branch that didn't have this issue, it would be a different story.

Libraries need to make up their mind whether they're to be come the future daycare centers for homeless people or a genuine community asset.

I can see how it may be possible to set it up so one of your preferred safeguards in effect.
Libraries could, possibly, require all patrons show documentation verifying their ID and address upon entering (valid driver's license, utility bill with the correct address (gas, water, cable, residential phone bill), cell phone bill, pay stub, W2 form, 1099 form, rental lease agreement/house deed, mortgage statement, bank statement, or State ID).
But I'm stumped as to how the other safeguard you want put in place can be implemented.
In addition to metal detectors and the ID Verification Station to deter the homeless are they supposed to set up a psychiatric checkpoint to keep out the mentally ill?
How do you propose they set it up to keep the folks you don't want out of a public library?

Security staff that removes people who are breaking the rules. Also banning people who are known rule-breakers. Additional homeless day centers where people can use computers would probably be a good idea as well.

Yeah but would that really keep out the homeless? Such an ambiguous sanction could easily result in elementary school kids who are giggling when working on a project getting snatched up by security and thrown out, or retirees who frequently nod off when reading the paper getting banned permanently. Not all rule-breakers are homeless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don't many homeless shelters close during the day? That's never made sense to me, but libraries seem to be a temperature-controlled, fairly safe fallback for those on the streets. I agree that there should be other welcoming public facilities open to them during the day, but often there are not.

When homeless get to be "fairly safe" in the library, they make it less safe for everyone else, especially women and children. Great solution.

Some homeless people actually are women and children.

x100 this. The homeless are our fellow community members, i.e., part of the public.

Yes, and they still need to follow rules for usage of public space.

No one said they shouldn't. The same as if your toddler is going around bugging people and trying to rip the books.

You’re comparing homeless to a 3 year old. Nice. Btw, if you’re trying to persuade people to be more empathetic & helpful, you’re doing a crummy job.

[Anonymous]

Lice lady here. You are not going to catch lice from a homeless guy. Unless you hug him.

[Anonymous]

No one thinks libraries serving as de facto homeless shelters is the best possible path, but the DC government isn't going to build a bunch of space places for those homeless people to go during the day. So kicking them out of the libraries won't help the overall situation.