S/O If you have a pit bull...why?

[Anonymous]

1. ALL dogs can bite, maim or kill (small dogs have killed infants, for ex).

2. Focusing on the breed is a red herring, because there are lines in each breed that can have very different personalities.

3. Focus on the lineage of each individual dog. Some lines have been bred to fight, and those dogs are the most dangerous, because their escalation time from warning signs to killer lunge can be less than a second.

4. Focus on the environment of the puppy. Bite inhibition develops only when the dog is part of a litter that stays with its mother for at least 6 weeks, because that is when puppies learn that hard bites are socially unacceptable and will be met with pain and maternal correction.

5. Conclusion: adopt or rescue at your own risk and advocate for spaying and neutering. If you don't know the parents of the dog, and the puppy history, or worse, if you know that the dog was bred as a fighting dog or that the dog was born in a puppy mill and never socialized, you are putting people at risk. The risk is greater if you adopt a supposedly aggressive breed, but again, this is a red herring. A Golden can kill as well.

6. In a perfect world, people would get their companions from reputable breeders who breed not only to the physical standard, but also for mellow personalities.

[Anonymous]

Any breed can have a mean/bad temperament.

My in-laws have a min pin and she's awful, bites, growls, nips and humps your leg.

I have a min pin mix who acts like a cat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
1. ALL dogs can bite, maim or kill (small dogs have killed infants, for ex).

2. Focusing on the breed is a red herring, because there are lines in each breed that can have very different personalities.

3. Focus on the lineage of each individual dog. Some lines have been bred to fight, and those dogs are the most dangerous, because their escalation time from warning signs to killer lunge can be less than a second.

4. Focus on the environment of the puppy. Bite inhibition develops only when the dog is part of a litter that stays with its mother for at least 6 weeks, because that is when puppies learn that hard bites are socially unacceptable and will be met with pain and maternal correction.

5. Conclusion: adopt or rescue at your own risk and advocate for spaying and neutering. If you don't know the parents of the dog, and the puppy history, or worse, if you know that the dog was bred as a fighting dog or that the dog was born in a puppy mill and never socialized, you are putting people at risk. The risk is greater if you adopt a supposedly aggressive breed, but again, this is a red herring. A Golden can kill as well.

6. In a perfect world, people would get their companions from reputable breeders who breed not only to the physical standard, but also for mellow personalities.

Yet you would be hard-pressed to find an example of that, unlike the many horrifying examples with pits. Breed does matter, and anyone owning a pit is taking a risk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is mind-boggling to me that people are willing to take this risk. I hope they are completely banned in the near future.

Herding dogs herd - it is in their genetic make up and intrinsically makes them happy. Why are breeds known for agression any different? It's genetic and under the right circumstances that lovable, wouldn't hurt anyone pit will kill. For those who think agression isn't a function of genetics I encourage you to read this articles. Research now shows the argument "“That aggression is not heritable is not tenable"

http://www.animals24-7.org/2015/11/10/the-science-of-how-behavior-is-inherited-in-aggressive-dogs/

This was fascinating, thank you.
from the article:
"The heritability of abnormal aggression in certain breeds of dogs can no longer be denied. The bodies of these dogs have been selected to execute a killing bite more efficiently than other breeds. These dogs share physical conformation to the task of killing, including exaggerated jaw muscles, heavy necks and shoulders, and body mass that makes defense against an attack much more difficult. Among people who want dogs who can kill, these are the breeds of choice because they are physically more fit for it than other breeds."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
1. ALL dogs can bite, maim or kill (small dogs have killed infants, for ex).

2. Focusing on the breed is a red herring, because there are lines in each breed that can have very different personalities.

3. Focus on the lineage of each individual dog. Some lines have been bred to fight, and those dogs are the most dangerous, because their escalation time from warning signs to killer lunge can be less than a second.

4. Focus on the environment of the puppy. Bite inhibition develops only when the dog is part of a litter that stays with its mother for at least 6 weeks, because that is when puppies learn that hard bites are socially unacceptable and will be met with pain and maternal correction.

5. Conclusion: adopt or rescue at your own risk and advocate for spaying and neutering. If you don't know the parents of the dog, and the puppy history, or worse, if you know that the dog was bred as a fighting dog or that the dog was born in a puppy mill and never socialized, you are putting people at risk. The risk is greater if you adopt a supposedly aggressive breed, but again, this is a red herring. A Golden can kill as well.

6. In a perfect world, people would get their companions from reputable breeders who breed not only to the physical standard, but also for mellow personalities.

Yet you would be hard-pressed to find an example of that, unlike the many horrifying examples with pits. Breed does matter, and anyone owning a pit is taking a risk.

I was just coming to say this. Pit bull defenders love to point out that there are other breeds with stronger jaws, etc... but I don't see any news stories about them killing their owners. Capability does not translate to reality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ so did the Goocheland woman who was just eaten. There is a reason why 700 cities have outlawed pitbulls.

Every article that I have seen about the woman in Goocheland states that the dogs were being neglected.

So? How many breeds of dog would turn on someone who "raised them From puppies" because they were "indoor dogs were moved outside where they stayed "in the cold." Stephens visited about five times per week so the dogs subsequently became more isolated". They were eating her rib cage when they found them. There are many dogs who would fit this description of neglect (left outside in the cold, visited 5x a week) but they sure as heck wouldn't turn on the person that raised them and eat them!

Just because she owned the dogs as puppies does not mean that she took care of them. Who dumps their dogs on someone who wont even feed them and comes by a few times a week ? How well-trained and socialized do you think those dogs were? Since legal standards of care for pets are pretty low, in order to be described as 'neglect' there is more wrong than just living outdoors. If you want examples of 'nice family dogs' that kill people, you can find plenty, but that story isn't one of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ so did the Goocheland woman who was just eaten. There is a reason why 700 cities have outlawed pitbulls.

Every article that I have seen about the woman in Goocheland states that the dogs were being neglected.

So? How many breeds of dog would turn on someone who "raised them From puppies" because they were "indoor dogs were moved outside where they stayed "in the cold." Stephens visited about five times per week so the dogs subsequently became more isolated". They were eating her rib cage when they found them. There are many dogs who would fit this description of neglect (left outside in the cold, visited 5x a week) but they sure as heck wouldn't turn on the person that raised them and eat them!

Just because she owned the dogs as puppies does not mean that she took care of them. Who dumps their dogs on someone who wont even feed them and comes by a few times a week ? How well-trained and socialized do you think those dogs were? Since legal standards of care for pets are pretty low, in order to be described as 'neglect' there is more wrong than just living outdoors. If you want examples of 'nice family dogs' that kill people, you can find plenty, but that story isn't one of them.

Yet it's the same old story- Friends had questioned what would have led the pit bulls to kill their owner who had raised them since they were puppies.
One friend told local media that the dogs were gentle. "They'd kill you with kisses," ...hmm, sound familiar?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ so did the Goocheland woman who was just eaten. There is a reason why 700 cities have outlawed pitbulls.

Every article that I have seen about the woman in Goocheland states that the dogs were being neglected.

So? How many breeds of dog would turn on someone who "raised them From puppies" because they were "indoor dogs were moved outside where they stayed "in the cold." Stephens visited about five times per week so the dogs subsequently became more isolated". They were eating her rib cage when they found them. There are many dogs who would fit this description of neglect (left outside in the cold, visited 5x a week) but they sure as heck wouldn't turn on the person that raised them and eat them!

Just because she owned the dogs as puppies does not mean that she took care of them. Who dumps their dogs on someone who wont even feed them and comes by a few times a week ? How well-trained and socialized do you think those dogs were? Since legal standards of care for pets are pretty low, in order to be described as 'neglect' there is more wrong than just living outdoors. If you want examples of 'nice family dogs' that kill people, you can find plenty, but that story isn't one of them.

You're missing the point. You never hear stories about neglected labs and goldens killing their owners. Pits are inherently aggressive -- which makes it more likely for them to be neglected, and then more likely for them to injure people and other dogs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:By nature, pit bulls are not great guard dogs, they are not territorial, they engage in far less resource guarding (food, toys, chew bones) than a lovable lab or Golden retriever does. Pits are naturally friendly towards humans. Aggression against humans is not the norm for them although they can be protective of their human families.

Yes, there are exceptions and when they happen they are horrible. But the reality is, Pits - as a breed - are not naturally aggressive against humans. Quite the opposite.

Just read through the most recent years.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ so did the Goocheland woman who was just eaten. There is a reason why 700 cities have outlawed pitbulls.

Every article that I have seen about the woman in Goocheland states that the dogs were being neglected.

So? How many breeds of dog would turn on someone who "raised them From puppies" because they were "indoor dogs were moved outside where they stayed "in the cold." Stephens visited about five times per week so the dogs subsequently became more isolated". They were eating her rib cage when they found them. There are many dogs who would fit this description of neglect (left outside in the cold, visited 5x a week) but they sure as heck wouldn't turn on the person that raised them and eat them!

Just because she owned the dogs as puppies does not mean that she took care of them. Who dumps their dogs on someone who wont even feed them and comes by a few times a week ? How well-trained and socialized do you think those dogs were? Since legal standards of care for pets are pretty low, in order to be described as 'neglect' there is more wrong than just living outdoors. If you want examples of 'nice family dogs' that kill people, you can find plenty, but that story isn't one of them.

You're missing the point. You never hear stories about neglected labs and goldens killing their owners. Pits are inherently aggressive -- which makes it more likely for them to be neglected, and then more likely for them to injure people and other dogs.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Agree that all dogs can bite but there are characteristics of pit bulls that make them more dangerous than the average dog.

A study in the 2007 American Journal of Forensic Medicine and Pathology pointed out pit bulls are a particular problem because they usually don’t give warning signs before attacking.

“They tend not to make threatening gestures, such as snarling or baring of teeth, prior to attacking and so there may be no warning of impending aggressive behavior,” the study said. “Pit bulls also take multiple bites and have greater jaw pressures than most other dogs, reaching 1,800 pounds per square inch.”

They also attack continuously, as compared to other breeds that may just bite once. Combining all of those features with aggressive personalities and large sizes makes them “highly dangerous to children,” the study said.

Read more here: http://www.sunherald.com/news/local/article115943753.html#storylink=cpy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ so did the Goocheland woman who was just eaten. There is a reason why 700 cities have outlawed pitbulls.

Every article that I have seen about the woman in Goocheland states that the dogs were being neglected.

So? How many breeds of dog would turn on someone who "raised them From puppies" because they were "indoor dogs were moved outside where they stayed "in the cold." Stephens visited about five times per week so the dogs subsequently became more isolated". They were eating her rib cage when they found them. There are many dogs who would fit this description of neglect (left outside in the cold, visited 5x a week) but they sure as heck wouldn't turn on the person that raised them and eat them!

Just because she owned the dogs as puppies does not mean that she took care of them. Who dumps their dogs on someone who wont even feed them and comes by a few times a week ? How well-trained and socialized do you think those dogs were? Since legal standards of care for pets are pretty low, in order to be described as 'neglect' there is more wrong than just living outdoors. If you want examples of 'nice family dogs' that kill people, you can find plenty, but that story isn't one of them.

You're missing the point. You never hear stories about neglected labs and goldens killing their owners. Pits are inherently aggressive -- which makes it more likely for them to be neglected, and then more likely for them to injure people and other dogs.

You keep singing this same tune. There are plenty of pits who have unfortunately suffered abuse and neglect and have not turned on their owners. The shelters are full of forgiving animals that have done nothing wrong.

The dogs in this situation had gone into some sort of survival mode. I suspect that this had been going on for awhile and they had simply become unsocialized with humans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess I just don't understand the reasoning or appeal here. Is it a self-defense thing??

It's a mental illness thing.

[Anonymous]

My aunt and uncle had an adorable tan and white pit with a pink nose. Raised from a puppy, snuggled with all of us on the couch, ran miles with my uncle every day. Never saw anything aggressive in her, rarely even heard her bark. I also wondered how people could malign the entire breed and assumed it was dogs who were abused or mishandled that attacked. My uncle was talking to a neighbor in his yard about sports or something where the neighbor was speaking animatedly and gesturing with his hands. Out of nowhere the dog jumped up and attacked him and clamped onto his arm. It took both my aunt and uncle hitting her with a chair to get her off of him and my uncle finally was able to confine her to the garage. The neighbor required hundreds of stitches and my aunt and uncle had the dog euthanized.

We were all truly shocked and saddened by it - it changed my opinion on dogs in general, to be honest, and I'm hesitant to have one as a pet (I know this is super paranoid). Meanwhile my aunt and uncle's daughters were really traumatized by the whole thing and went the other direction - they both rescue pits and post pictures of them with their kids, insist that they are still great family dogs. It's insane.

[Anonymous]

A friend of mine was recently mauled by a pit at work, of all places. A co-worker had brought it into their "pet-friendly" office. Same thing as all these other stories--the dog was supposedly a sweetheart, had never been aggressive, etc etc. And then just snapped and attacked out of nowhere.

I didn't love pits before this but really go out of my way to avoid them now.

Also, frankly, it makes me rethink the wisdom of the whole bring-your-pet-to-work trend.