Anyone BTDT? Autism/Not-Autism? Starting Kindergarten Next Year

[Anonymous]

I went through all of this with my son (who is now 15.) He didn't talk much as a preschooler but what he did say was clear and age appropriate and he taught himself to read at age 3, so I just assumed that he wasn't a talker. In K, his teachers began giving us a lot of feedback about poor eye contact and poor social skills and lagging language skills. We started the evaluation process when he was 5. We have seen a psychologist who specializes in learning disabilities, a developmental pediatrician, a neuropsychologist, school psychologists, and several speech/language therapists. He has been variously diagnosed with Mixed Expressive-Receptive Language disorder, Semantic-Pragmatic Language Disorder, and Autism Spectrum Disorder.

We tried him in private school and paid OOP for speech therapy and social skills classes and drama therapy. We found that the private school just didn't have the resources or the staff trained to help him enough. We moved him to public school and it worked much better. Our public school had more resources: a school psychologist and an ST and a special education resource teacher and a resource room for when he needed breaks. The special education resource teacher, the school psychologist, and the ST were able to help his teacher in the regular classroom with managing him and his special needs in the classroom. It worked much better. He was in the regular classroom about 75% -80% of the time and in pull-outs the rest of the time. He progressed beautifully and in 8th grade he no longer needed an IEP. He continues to have a 504 in high school, just in case, but he does very well without much special education support now. We did some behavior therapy with him, but did not do an ABA program per se because it wasn't appropriate for him.

As far as diagnosis goes, I would just address the deficits in front of you without worrying too much about labels. My kid seemed more MERLD than ASD when he was 5, but as his language skills improved, he seemed much more ASD. Lots of kids seem more ASD, but then as they progress it becomes clear they aren't autistic, but have some language disorder instead. It will work itself out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP again. Not sure I'm following all this discussion on types of evaluations. My son has had an IEP since he was 3 years old and we've had regular educational evaluations as he's progressed to update his placements and IEP goals.

Would we already see the language-based LD issues? My son is doing well with letter sounds and has started with sight words, can sound out two and three letter combos, etc. He's also doing basic addition. Academically he's doing very well and that's never been an issue to this point. Is the idea that an issue will crop up in the future?

He's doing great. There are a few or one poster who insists all kids with language disorders have LD issues but they don't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here.

Are there any signs, right now, that make you think he would receive an ASD diagnosis if tested by someone else?

This is the OP. He's still working on typical language - he can have back and forth conversations now but not to the level of typical kids - his sentences are shorter, words are sometimes in the wrong order, it may take him a little bit longer to respond to a question or get a sentence out. Otherwise, he shows interest in peers, engages in imaginative play with peers (getting more and more complex as he gets more language), responds when someone talks to him and makes eye contact, etc.

For the repetitive/restrictive behaviors, he will jump up and down when he's very excited. Otherwise, he's never had a fixation on just one topic and his rigidity is almost gone. One of his therapists actually said in our last meeting that she thought his flexibility was one of his strengths.

Sensory-wise he seems to be a super taster. We tried to hide his medicine in things and even my husband couldn't taste it but somehow my son could.

The way he talks does sound the way some kids with autism speak.

OP, I am the poster who asked this. He sounds strikingly similar to my son, 4.5 years old. My DS does not have autism. I hope some of this is helpful.

My DS never really showed any "red flags," but even as in infant, it was clear he was a tense, anxious little guy. We bent over backwards for his sleep schedule. He didn't like large groups/gatherings, and as he aged closer to 3 it was clear his speech was behind peers. He was excruciatingly shy, though eye contact and play was always appropriate. He would throw epic meltdowns and tantrums, and for a while, it seemed like we walked on eggshells around his behavior. (He was never aggressive or misbehaved, but was rigid and freaked out very easily. He was moody).

We began twice weekly speech therapy and everything improved by leaps and bounds. His anxiety lessened to a degree, and he began showing interest in playing with other children. He "lightened up" considerably, and began taking more of an interest in the world around him. Once he had the language to ask questions, I think he felt a bit more in control. His language is delayed: we are currently working on pronouns, increasing sentence length, and appropriate word order (on occasion). He is conversational with peers, family, and teachers though it is obvious he speaks more like a 3 year-old. He can not keep up in a zippy, quick conversation with other 4 year-olds, often taking a bit longer to answer questions and follow along. Many of his friends don't really seem to notice, and if they do, are sweet enough to keep just playing along. He does well on 1:1 playdates, especially when he can sit with a friend and do a project, play trains, etc.

He may never be the life of the party; he is an introvert. He needs a lot more reassurance than other children his age. I still prompt correct sentence formation, and help him "keep up" when an adult may be speaking too rapidly. We worried for a very long time about autism, but he was always in a "grey area." He flaps and jumps when excited, had/has the language delay, was rigid, etc. However, he did not have any restricted interests, was completely comfortable with family members, always had normal joint attention, etc.

We are still working on the language. We are also working on the anxiety. One thing to ask yourself and/or his doctor: "If the speech delay was removed, what else about his behavior leads you to an autism diagnosis?" Autism can be a subjective diagnosis. We recently went to a child psychiatrist to get the ball rolling on his anxiety. Within half an hour, he mentioned "Of course he doesn't have autism, look at his fantastic eye contact and pretend play." Two years ago, we were dancing around the diagnosis of MERLD or Social Pragmatic Communication Disorder, though again, neither seemed to quite fit him. His psychiatrist is confident he truly just has/had a speech delay (and anxiety).

My family insists he is just like I was as a child: I often kept to myself, seemed oblivious as to whether or not I had friends, didn't care for groups, and was extremely shy. I was eventually asked to leave preschool because I didn't interact with others. (I am a completely normal, outgoing adult). We have debated the private vs. public kindergarten issue for next year, and have ultimately decided to go public. For many reasons: I won't have to drive him to private speech therapy (I have younger children), and should he need an accommodation, it will be in place. (Private schools are never "required" to do anything. I am not sure if some of his rigidity will reappear once he starts kindergarten, and I imagine it will be an anxious time for him). My DS has come so, so far.

School speech therapy is very different from private. You may want to consider keeping him in private as well. Don't prematuraly remove speech therapy for your convince. It really depends on the private. We had a great experience with the private. Far far far better than public.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here.

Are there any signs, right now, that make you think he would receive an ASD diagnosis if tested by someone else?

This is the OP. He's still working on typical language - he can have back and forth conversations now but not to the level of typical kids - his sentences are shorter, words are sometimes in the wrong order, it may take him a little bit longer to respond to a question or get a sentence out. Otherwise, he shows interest in peers, engages in imaginative play with peers (getting more and more complex as he gets more language), responds when someone talks to him and makes eye contact, etc.

For the repetitive/restrictive behaviors, he will jump up and down when he's very excited. Otherwise, he's never had a fixation on just one topic and his rigidity is almost gone. One of his therapists actually said in our last meeting that she thought his flexibility was one of his strengths.

Sensory-wise he seems to be a super taster. We tried to hide his medicine in things and even my husband couldn't taste it but somehow my son could.

The way he talks does sound the way some kids with autism speak.

OP, I am the poster who asked this. He sounds strikingly similar to my son, 4.5 years old. My DS does not have autism. I hope some of this is helpful.

My DS never really showed any "red flags," but even as in infant, it was clear he was a tense, anxious little guy. We bent over backwards for his sleep schedule. He didn't like large groups/gatherings, and as he aged closer to 3 it was clear his speech was behind peers. He was excruciatingly shy, though eye contact and play was always appropriate. He would throw epic meltdowns and tantrums, and for a while, it seemed like we walked on eggshells around his behavior. (He was never aggressive or misbehaved, but was rigid and freaked out very easily. He was moody).

We began twice weekly speech therapy and everything improved by leaps and bounds. His anxiety lessened to a degree, and he began showing interest in playing with other children. He "lightened up" considerably, and began taking more of an interest in the world around him. Once he had the language to ask questions, I think he felt a bit more in control. His language is delayed: we are currently working on pronouns, increasing sentence length, and appropriate word order (on occasion). He is conversational with peers, family, and teachers though it is obvious he speaks more like a 3 year-old. He can not keep up in a zippy, quick conversation with other 4 year-olds, often taking a bit longer to answer questions and follow along. Many of his friends don't really seem to notice, and if they do, are sweet enough to keep just playing along. He does well on 1:1 playdates, especially when he can sit with a friend and do a project, play trains, etc.

He may never be the life of the party; he is an introvert. He needs a lot more reassurance than other children his age. I still prompt correct sentence formation, and help him "keep up" when an adult may be speaking too rapidly. We worried for a very long time about autism, but he was always in a "grey area." He flaps and jumps when excited, had/has the language delay, was rigid, etc. However, he did not have any restricted interests, was completely comfortable with family members, always had normal joint attention, etc.

We are still working on the language. We are also working on the anxiety. One thing to ask yourself and/or his doctor: "If the speech delay was removed, what else about his behavior leads you to an autism diagnosis?" Autism can be a subjective diagnosis. We recently went to a child psychiatrist to get the ball rolling on his anxiety. Within half an hour, he mentioned "Of course he doesn't have autism, look at his fantastic eye contact and pretend play." Two years ago, we were dancing around the diagnosis of MERLD or Social Pragmatic Communication Disorder, though again, neither seemed to quite fit him. His psychiatrist is confident he truly just has/had a speech delay (and anxiety).

My family insists he is just like I was as a child: I often kept to myself, seemed oblivious as to whether or not I had friends, didn't care for groups, and was extremely shy. I was eventually asked to leave preschool because I didn't interact with others. (I am a completely normal, outgoing adult). We have debated the private vs. public kindergarten issue for next year, and have ultimately decided to go public. For many reasons: I won't have to drive him to private speech therapy (I have younger children), and should he need an accommodation, it will be in place. (Private schools are never "required" to do anything. I am not sure if some of his rigidity will reappear once he starts kindergarten, and I imagine it will be an anxious time for him). My DS has come so, so far.

I am another poster who responded above and this sounds so much like my kid too. Another anxiety/speech delay combo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here.

Are there any signs, right now, that make you think he would receive an ASD diagnosis if tested by someone else?

This is the OP. He's still working on typical language - he can have back and forth conversations now but not to the level of typical kids - his sentences are shorter, words are sometimes in the wrong order, it may take him a little bit longer to respond to a question or get a sentence out. Otherwise, he shows interest in peers, engages in imaginative play with peers (getting more and more complex as he gets more language), responds when someone talks to him and makes eye contact, etc.

For the repetitive/restrictive behaviors, he will jump up and down when he's very excited. Otherwise, he's never had a fixation on just one topic and his rigidity is almost gone. One of his therapists actually said in our last meeting that she thought his flexibility was one of his strengths.

Sensory-wise he seems to be a super taster. We tried to hide his medicine in things and even my husband couldn't taste it but somehow my son could.

The way he talks does sound the way some kids with autism speak.

OP, I am the poster who asked this. He sounds strikingly similar to my son, 4.5 years old. My DS does not have autism. I hope some of this is helpful.

My DS never really showed any "red flags," but even as in infant, it was clear he was a tense, anxious little guy. We bent over backwards for his sleep schedule. He didn't like large groups/gatherings, and as he aged closer to 3 it was clear his speech was behind peers. He was excruciatingly shy, though eye contact and play was always appropriate. He would throw epic meltdowns and tantrums, and for a while, it seemed like we walked on eggshells around his behavior. (He was never aggressive or misbehaved, but was rigid and freaked out very easily. He was moody).

We began twice weekly speech therapy and everything improved by leaps and bounds. His anxiety lessened to a degree, and he began showing interest in playing with other children. He "lightened up" considerably, and began taking more of an interest in the world around him. Once he had the language to ask questions, I think he felt a bit more in control. His language is delayed: we are currently working on pronouns, increasing sentence length, and appropriate word order (on occasion). He is conversational with peers, family, and teachers though it is obvious he speaks more like a 3 year-old. He can not keep up in a zippy, quick conversation with other 4 year-olds, often taking a bit longer to answer questions and follow along. Many of his friends don't really seem to notice, and if they do, are sweet enough to keep just playing along. He does well on 1:1 playdates, especially when he can sit with a friend and do a project, play trains, etc.

He may never be the life of the party; he is an introvert. He needs a lot more reassurance than other children his age. I still prompt correct sentence formation, and help him "keep up" when an adult may be speaking too rapidly. We worried for a very long time about autism, but he was always in a "grey area." He flaps and jumps when excited, had/has the language delay, was rigid, etc. However, he did not have any restricted interests, was completely comfortable with family members, always had normal joint attention, etc.

We are still working on the language. We are also working on the anxiety. One thing to ask yourself and/or his doctor: "If the speech delay was removed, what else about his behavior leads you to an autism diagnosis?" Autism can be a subjective diagnosis. We recently went to a child psychiatrist to get the ball rolling on his anxiety. Within half an hour, he mentioned "Of course he doesn't have autism, look at his fantastic eye contact and pretend play." Two years ago, we were dancing around the diagnosis of MERLD or Social Pragmatic Communication Disorder, though again, neither seemed to quite fit him. His psychiatrist is confident he truly just has/had a speech delay (and anxiety).

My family insists he is just like I was as a child: I often kept to myself, seemed oblivious as to whether or not I had friends, didn't care for groups, and was extremely shy. I was eventually asked to leave preschool because I didn't interact with others. (I am a completely normal, outgoing adult). We have debated the private vs. public kindergarten issue for next year, and have ultimately decided to go public. For many reasons: I won't have to drive him to private speech therapy (I have younger children), and should he need an accommodation, it will be in place. (Private schools are never "required" to do anything. I am not sure if some of his rigidity will reappear once he starts kindergarten, and I imagine it will be an anxious time for him). My DS has come so, so far.

Thank you so much for posting!! Our sons do sound very, very similar. To be honest, we hadn't considered anxiety but my husband has anxiety so that might be something we need to think more about. And my aunt keeps saying that my son is exactly like my dad was at his age. My dad is a successful professional who is definitely an introvert but is appropriately outgoing and conversational.

It seems like a lot of families have chosen public. We will definitely see what the school district offers us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went through all of this with my son (who is now 15.) He didn't talk much as a preschooler but what he did say was clear and age appropriate and he taught himself to read at age 3, so I just assumed that he wasn't a talker. In K, his teachers began giving us a lot of feedback about poor eye contact and poor social skills and lagging language skills. We started the evaluation process when he was 5. We have seen a psychologist who specializes in learning disabilities, a developmental pediatrician, a neuropsychologist, school psychologists, and several speech/language therapists. He has been variously diagnosed with Mixed Expressive-Receptive Language disorder, Semantic-Pragmatic Language Disorder, and Autism Spectrum Disorder.

We tried him in private school and paid OOP for speech therapy and social skills classes and drama therapy. We found that the private school just didn't have the resources or the staff trained to help him enough. We moved him to public school and it worked much better. Our public school had more resources: a school psychologist and an ST and a special education resource teacher and a resource room for when he needed breaks. The special education resource teacher, the school psychologist, and the ST were able to help his teacher in the regular classroom with managing him and his special needs in the classroom. It worked much better. He was in the regular classroom about 75% -80% of the time and in pull-outs the rest of the time. He progressed beautifully and in 8th grade he no longer needed an IEP. He continues to have a 504 in high school, just in case, but he does very well without much special education support now. We did some behavior therapy with him, but did not do an ABA program per se because it wasn't appropriate for him.

As far as diagnosis goes, I would just address the deficits in front of you without worrying too much about labels. My kid seemed more MERLD than ASD when he was 5, but as his language skills improved, he seemed much more ASD. Lots of kids seem more ASD, but then as they progress it becomes clear they aren't autistic, but have some language disorder instead. It will work itself out.

Thank you for sharing your son's story! It's so good to hear how well he's progressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here.

Are there any signs, right now, that make you think he would receive an ASD diagnosis if tested by someone else?

This is the OP. He's still working on typical language - he can have back and forth conversations now but not to the level of typical kids - his sentences are shorter, words are sometimes in the wrong order, it may take him a little bit longer to respond to a question or get a sentence out. Otherwise, he shows interest in peers, engages in imaginative play with peers (getting more and more complex as he gets more language), responds when someone talks to him and makes eye contact, etc.

For the repetitive/restrictive behaviors, he will jump up and down when he's very excited. Otherwise, he's never had a fixation on just one topic and his rigidity is almost gone. One of his therapists actually said in our last meeting that she thought his flexibility was one of his strengths.

Sensory-wise he seems to be a super taster. We tried to hide his medicine in things and even my husband couldn't taste it but somehow my son could.

The way he talks does sound the way some kids with autism speak.

OP, I am the poster who asked this. He sounds strikingly similar to my son, 4.5 years old. My DS does not have autism. I hope some of this is helpful.

My DS never really showed any "red flags," but even as in infant, it was clear he was a tense, anxious little guy. We bent over backwards for his sleep schedule. He didn't like large groups/gatherings, and as he aged closer to 3 it was clear his speech was behind peers. He was excruciatingly shy, though eye contact and play was always appropriate. He would throw epic meltdowns and tantrums, and for a while, it seemed like we walked on eggshells around his behavior. (He was never aggressive or misbehaved, but was rigid and freaked out very easily. He was moody).

We began twice weekly speech therapy and everything improved by leaps and bounds. His anxiety lessened to a degree, and he began showing interest in playing with other children. He "lightened up" considerably, and began taking more of an interest in the world around him. Once he had the language to ask questions, I think he felt a bit more in control. His language is delayed: we are currently working on pronouns, increasing sentence length, and appropriate word order (on occasion). He is conversational with peers, family, and teachers though it is obvious he speaks more like a 3 year-old. He can not keep up in a zippy, quick conversation with other 4 year-olds, often taking a bit longer to answer questions and follow along. Many of his friends don't really seem to notice, and if they do, are sweet enough to keep just playing along. He does well on 1:1 playdates, especially when he can sit with a friend and do a project, play trains, etc.

He may never be the life of the party; he is an introvert. He needs a lot more reassurance than other children his age. I still prompt correct sentence formation, and help him "keep up" when an adult may be speaking too rapidly. We worried for a very long time about autism, but he was always in a "grey area." He flaps and jumps when excited, had/has the language delay, was rigid, etc. However, he did not have any restricted interests, was completely comfortable with family members, always had normal joint attention, etc.

We are still working on the language. We are also working on the anxiety. One thing to ask yourself and/or his doctor: "If the speech delay was removed, what else about his behavior leads you to an autism diagnosis?" Autism can be a subjective diagnosis. We recently went to a child psychiatrist to get the ball rolling on his anxiety. Within half an hour, he mentioned "Of course he doesn't have autism, look at his fantastic eye contact and pretend play." Two years ago, we were dancing around the diagnosis of MERLD or Social Pragmatic Communication Disorder, though again, neither seemed to quite fit him. His psychiatrist is confident he truly just has/had a speech delay (and anxiety).

My family insists he is just like I was as a child: I often kept to myself, seemed oblivious as to whether or not I had friends, didn't care for groups, and was extremely shy. I was eventually asked to leave preschool because I didn't interact with others. (I am a completely normal, outgoing adult). We have debated the private vs. public kindergarten issue for next year, and have ultimately decided to go public. For many reasons: I won't have to drive him to private speech therapy (I have younger children), and should he need an accommodation, it will be in place. (Private schools are never "required" to do anything. I am not sure if some of his rigidity will reappear once he starts kindergarten, and I imagine it will be an anxious time for him). My DS has come so, so far.

Thank you so much for posting!! Our sons do sound very, very similar. To be honest, we hadn't considered anxiety but my husband has anxiety so that might be something we need to think more about. And my aunt keeps saying that my son is exactly like my dad was at his age. My dad is a successful professional who is definitely an introvert but is appropriately outgoing and conversational.

It seems like a lot of families have chosen public. We will definitely see what the school district offers us.

Most families choose public due to cost and many privates not willing or able to handle SN. But, we had a great experience at one so I would say look around vs. rule it out. We thought it was very helpful the first few years and are glad we did it. We were lucky to find such a welcoming school that didn't mind the special needs. They were a school I ruled out as one review online said they were not SN friendly. They are depending on the SN.