Anyone BTDT? Autism/Not-Autism? Starting Kindergarten Next Year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all,

I'm just looking to hear from any parents that can relate to my current position and any advice/tips you'd suggest as we go through the process of figuring out where to place my son for Kindergarten next year. At 3 years old, my son had a significant speech delay (only occasionally combining two words) and was showing signs of autism (rigidity, meltdowns, and not really wanting to socialize or socialize appropriately with peers). He was diagnosed with ASD. Shortly after diagnosis, we discovered he had fluid in his ears which was affecting his hearing. After placing tubes, my son began to develop more speech.

At 4.5 years old, we finally got the speech explosion we were hoping for and this school year, we placed him in a reverse mainstream classroom (half typical kids, half kids with IEPs) where he is doing very well - making friends, initiating play, demonstrating empathy, following directions, engaging in circle time, demonstrating flexibility, etc. In other words, a lot of the signs of autism seem to have disappeared as my son's language has developed closer to typical levels. He still has some work to do on the language side of things but we no longer get any complaints about behavioral issues at school.

I've decided to take him in for a new autism evaluation with a developmental psychologist to see if she agrees with his current diagnosis. And I'm stressing about what to do about Kindergarten next year. I would like to see him mainstreamed and would prefer to send him to a small private school in our neighborhood but am concerned about how they would pre-judge him if they see the autism diagnosis.

Anyone been through anything similar?

I'll be watching this thread with you OP. My DS situation is very similar to what you describe except for the fluid in ears /and tubes. My DS was diagnosed with autism at 21 months but largely due to speech delay, lack of empathy and not initiating play or making eye contact. All of these disappeared right at 4.5 mark. He has an early October b-day so I am considering testing for early admit kindergarten because he already reading and his teachers now consider him within typical range and he actually would no longer qualify for the special program he is in now for next year.

So interesting that your son is in a similar situation. Maybe 4.5 is the magic age to make progress.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, I don't know that the school would judge him for his diagnosis. I'm concerned that they might.

Does anyone have a kid whose symptoms mostly disappeared? Did you get a new diagnosis or just keep ASD?

Happens all the time on the MERLD boards. I've met several of those kids -- when their language comes in, their "autism" goes away.

What are the MERLD boards? I would love to be able to chat with parents going through the same thing. Do you have a link you could provide?

Op, just FYI there are a lot of parents whose kids actually have autism. Intervention works. You don't need these folks to tell you this.

[Anonymous]

Hi OP. Am I correct to read that your child has "graduated" (for lack of a better term) from everything outlined as goals in the IEP except for speech? So the only services that you are still receiving are speech? Thats amazing--congrats!!

My son had speech delays which have driven other social, etc. delays (because, obviously, if you can't talk to other kids you can't play with them, etc.). As a result, he also has an ASD diagnosis which has resulted in more insurance coverage for speech therapy than we would receive otherwise (as well as ABA which has helped him "catch up" re: how to interact with peers). He doesn't have the social challenges any more (he learned to talk, he learned how to play with kids), and I wanted to get him re-evaluated. Mostly tbh because I wanted the diagosis off of his record. DH disagrees--he feels that *just in case* we need more services (additional ST, something else) its easier to get them, and insurance covers more with the ASD diagnosis than without.

Granted, our situation is different than yours: DS is 4.5 and is currently in private preschool with services coming in via FCPS/we go to private speech/ABA but are about to finish that due to catching up to age appropriate levels. While I'm concerned about the class sizes at the local FCPS ES just like you are, at this point I feel that FCPS will offer better overall IEP support if needed moving forward than a private will. And, is much cheaper. So we are going to start with public elementary and see how it goes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am sort of in your shoes, OP. Who made the autism diagnosis?

Our preschool's therapist thought our son had ASD at 2 but we pursued an eval from an excellent Autism Center, and they did not think he was autistic. A lot of his autism-like behaviors were social anxiety-based.

We placed him in private speech therapy and an excellent preschool that would help him with small group play, and he is doing great (also 4.5). We are sending him to a private K next year. We shall see.

Ours has caught up on speech but we are keeping him in therapy to make sure all his sounds develop properly and because his therapist is so good with helping reduce his anxiety (because he can express himself). That is what the Director of the Autism Center suggested.

I would probably switch to the private and supplement with speech if there is any reason at all to do so. Good luck, it is stressful trying to make the right choice.

OP here.

A nurse practitioner at Nemours DuPont made the original diagnosis. She used mostly data from his IEP and my responses to questions to make the diagnosis. When I asked her about re-evaluating, she is the one that referred me to a developmental psychologist.

My son also has an educational diagnosis of autism through the school district which allows him to qualify for services. Just based on his delays at this point, he would probably no longer qualify. Our service coordinator made it pretty clear that we should not ask to reevaluate his educational diagnosis if we still wanted our speech therapy through them.

Thank you for the good luck wishes! I never realized how stressful making these decisions would be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP. Am I correct to read that your child has "graduated" (for lack of a better term) from everything outlined as goals in the IEP except for speech? So the only services that you are still receiving are speech? Thats amazing--congrats!!

My son had speech delays which have driven other social, etc. delays (because, obviously, if you can't talk to other kids you can't play with them, etc.). As a result, he also has an ASD diagnosis which has resulted in more insurance coverage for speech therapy than we would receive otherwise (as well as ABA which has helped him "catch up" re: how to interact with peers). He doesn't have the social challenges any more (he learned to talk, he learned how to play with kids), and I wanted to get him re-evaluated. Mostly tbh because I wanted the diagosis off of his record. DH disagrees--he feels that *just in case* we need more services (additional ST, something else) its easier to get them, and insurance covers more with the ASD diagnosis than without.

Granted, our situation is different than yours: DS is 4.5 and is currently in private preschool with services coming in via FCPS/we go to private speech/ABA but are about to finish that due to catching up to age appropriate levels. While I'm concerned about the class sizes at the local FCPS ES just like you are, at this point I feel that FCPS will offer better overall IEP support if needed moving forward than a private will. And, is much cheaper. So we are going to start with public elementary and see how it goes.

OP again. Thank you for sharing your experience! Yes, my son is only receiving speech at this point. His IEP goals are both speech and social skill-related and he is progressing well towards them.

Did you end up going through with the re-evaluation?

Your reasons for choosing public are basically the ones that have me not 100% on board with going with the private school. We have some other considerations as well. Our younger child could do preschool at the private and both would be in the same aftercare which they're very much enjoying this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, I don't know that the school would judge him for his diagnosis. I'm concerned that they might.

Does anyone have a kid whose symptoms mostly disappeared? Did you get a new diagnosis or just keep ASD?

Happens all the time on the MERLD boards. I've met several of those kids -- when their language comes in, their "autism" goes away.

What are the MERLD boards? I would love to be able to chat with parents going through the same thing. Do you have a link you could provide?

Op, just FYI there are a lot of parents whose kids actually have autism. Intervention works. You don't need these folks to tell you this.

OP again. Early intervention has done wonders for me son's progress for sure! From what I understand though, you don't ever grow out of autism if you actually have it. Is that right? My son never did ABA or any formal social skills classes. As his language developed, he's naturally figured the social piece out on his own. That's what's making me question his ASD diagnosis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP. Am I correct to read that your child has "graduated" (for lack of a better term) from everything outlined as goals in the IEP except for speech? So the only services that you are still receiving are speech? Thats amazing--congrats!!

My son had speech delays which have driven other social, etc. delays (because, obviously, if you can't talk to other kids you can't play with them, etc.). As a result, he also has an ASD diagnosis which has resulted in more insurance coverage for speech therapy than we would receive otherwise (as well as ABA which has helped him "catch up" re: how to interact with peers). He doesn't have the social challenges any more (he learned to talk, he learned how to play with kids), and I wanted to get him re-evaluated. Mostly tbh because I wanted the diagosis off of his record. DH disagrees--he feels that *just in case* we need more services (additional ST, something else) its easier to get them, and insurance covers more with the ASD diagnosis than without.

Granted, our situation is different than yours: DS is 4.5 and is currently in private preschool with services coming in via FCPS/we go to private speech/ABA but are about to finish that due to catching up to age appropriate levels. While I'm concerned about the class sizes at the local FCPS ES just like you are, at this point I feel that FCPS will offer better overall IEP support if needed moving forward than a private will. And, is much cheaper. So we are going to start with public elementary and see how it goes.

OP again. Thank you for sharing your experience! Yes, my son is only receiving speech at this point. His IEP goals are both speech and social skill-related and he is progressing well towards them.

Did you end up going through with the re-evaluation?

Your reasons for choosing public are basically the ones that have me not 100% on board with going with the private school. We have some other considerations as well. Our younger child could do preschool at the private and both would be in the same aftercare which they're very much enjoying this year.

PP here. We have not re-evaluated yet. We will if it gets to the point that we "need" to, but for now, we dont. So no need to rock the boat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am sort of in your shoes, OP. Who made the autism diagnosis?

Our preschool's therapist thought our son had ASD at 2 but we pursued an eval from an excellent Autism Center, and they did not think he was autistic. A lot of his autism-like behaviors were social anxiety-based.

We placed him in private speech therapy and an excellent preschool that would help him with small group play, and he is doing great (also 4.5). We are sending him to a private K next year. We shall see.

Ours has caught up on speech but we are keeping him in therapy to make sure all his sounds develop properly and because his therapist is so good with helping reduce his anxiety (because he can express himself). That is what the Director of the Autism Center suggested.

I would probably switch to the private and supplement with speech if there is any reason at all to do so. Good luck, it is stressful trying to make the right choice.

OP here.

A nurse practitioner at Nemours DuPont made the original diagnosis. She used mostly data from his IEP and my responses to questions to make the diagnosis. When I asked her about re-evaluating, she is the one that referred me to a developmental psychologist.

My son also has an educational diagnosis of autism through the school district which allows him to qualify for services. Just based on his delays at this point, he would probably no longer qualify. Our service coordinator made it pretty clear that we should not ask to reevaluate his educational diagnosis if we still wanted our speech therapy through them.

Thank you for the good luck wishes! I never realized how stressful making these decisions would be.

Your service coordinator did you a big favor by providing you with that piece of info. They are professionals who know what they are talking about. If you like the current SST provider, do not rock the boat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP. Am I correct to read that your child has "graduated" (for lack of a better term) from everything outlined as goals in the IEP except for speech? So the only services that you are still receiving are speech? Thats amazing--congrats!!

My son had speech delays which have driven other social, etc. delays (because, obviously, if you can't talk to other kids you can't play with them, etc.). As a result, he also has an ASD diagnosis which has resulted in more insurance coverage for speech therapy than we would receive otherwise (as well as ABA which has helped him "catch up" re: how to interact with peers). He doesn't have the social challenges any more (he learned to talk, he learned how to play with kids), and I wanted to get him re-evaluated. Mostly tbh because I wanted the diagosis off of his record. DH disagrees--he feels that *just in case* we need more services (additional ST, something else) its easier to get them, and insurance covers more with the ASD diagnosis than without.

Granted, our situation is different than yours: DS is 4.5 and is currently in private preschool with services coming in via FCPS/we go to private speech/ABA but are about to finish that due to catching up to age appropriate levels. While I'm concerned about the class sizes at the local FCPS ES just like you are, at this point I feel that FCPS will offer better overall IEP support if needed moving forward than a private will. And, is much cheaper. So we are going to start with public elementary and see how it goes.

OP again. Thank you for sharing your experience! Yes, my son is only receiving speech at this point. His IEP goals are both speech and social skill-related and he is progressing well towards them.

Did you end up going through with the re-evaluation?

Your reasons for choosing public are basically the ones that have me not 100% on board with going with the private school. We have some other considerations as well. Our younger child could do preschool at the private and both would be in the same aftercare which they're very much enjoying this year.

I can't remember if you stated this above, but how does the private deal with kids who need support such as ST, etc.?

Also, the progress your child has made. Is this progress compared to an NT kid, or compared to where they used to be? Because I thought my kid was making ALL SORTS of progress and was coming along nicely. Which he was compared to where he was coming from. But compared to other kids, he is still not an average kid, if that makes sense.

How would this private deal with a kid who isn't an average kid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am sort of in your shoes, OP. Who made the autism diagnosis?

Our preschool's therapist thought our son had ASD at 2 but we pursued an eval from an excellent Autism Center, and they did not think he was autistic. A lot of his autism-like behaviors were social anxiety-based.

We placed him in private speech therapy and an excellent preschool that would help him with small group play, and he is doing great (also 4.5). We are sending him to a private K next year. We shall see.

Ours has caught up on speech but we are keeping him in therapy to make sure all his sounds develop properly and because his therapist is so good with helping reduce his anxiety (because he can express himself). That is what the Director of the Autism Center suggested.

I would probably switch to the private and supplement with speech if there is any reason at all to do so. Good luck, it is stressful trying to make the right choice.

OP here.

A nurse practitioner at Nemours DuPont made the original diagnosis. She used mostly data from his IEP and my responses to questions to make the diagnosis. When I asked her about re-evaluating, she is the one that referred me to a developmental psychologist.

My son also has an educational diagnosis of autism through the school district which allows him to qualify for services. Just based on his delays at this point, he would probably no longer qualify. Our service coordinator made it pretty clear that we should not ask to reevaluate his educational diagnosis if we still wanted our speech therapy through them.

Thank you for the good luck wishes! I never realized how stressful making these decisions would be.

Your service coordinator did you a big favor by providing you with that piece of info. They are professionals who know what they are talking about. If you like the current SST provider, do not rock the boat.

Yeah, but medical diagnosis does not actually affect educational diagnosis. They are two separate processes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP. Am I correct to read that your child has "graduated" (for lack of a better term) from everything outlined as goals in the IEP except for speech? So the only services that you are still receiving are speech? Thats amazing--congrats!!

My son had speech delays which have driven other social, etc. delays (because, obviously, if you can't talk to other kids you can't play with them, etc.). As a result, he also has an ASD diagnosis which has resulted in more insurance coverage for speech therapy than we would receive otherwise (as well as ABA which has helped him "catch up" re: how to interact with peers). He doesn't have the social challenges any more (he learned to talk, he learned how to play with kids), and I wanted to get him re-evaluated. Mostly tbh because I wanted the diagosis off of his record. DH disagrees--he feels that *just in case* we need more services (additional ST, something else) its easier to get them, and insurance covers more with the ASD diagnosis than without.

Granted, our situation is different than yours: DS is 4.5 and is currently in private preschool with services coming in via FCPS/we go to private speech/ABA but are about to finish that due to catching up to age appropriate levels. While I'm concerned about the class sizes at the local FCPS ES just like you are, at this point I feel that FCPS will offer better overall IEP support if needed moving forward than a private will. And, is much cheaper. So we are going to start with public elementary and see how it goes.

OP again. Thank you for sharing your experience! Yes, my son is only receiving speech at this point. His IEP goals are both speech and social skill-related and he is progressing well towards them.

Did you end up going through with the re-evaluation?

Your reasons for choosing public are basically the ones that have me not 100% on board with going with the private school. We have some other considerations as well. Our younger child could do preschool at the private and both would be in the same aftercare which they're very much enjoying this year.

I can't remember if you stated this above, but how does the private deal with kids who need support such as ST, etc.?

Also, the progress your child has made. Is this progress compared to an NT kid, or compared to where they used to be? Because I thought my kid was making ALL SORTS of progress and was coming along nicely. Which he was compared to where he was coming from. But compared to other kids, he is still not an average kid, if that makes sense.

How would this private deal with a kid who isn't an average kid?

He's now testing low average in speech, so technically within the typical range but given his cognitive scores and abilities in other areas obviously low for where he "should" be. We're still working on mixing up pronouns and also random word ordering issues, which typical kids would have down by now.

The private school would not provide speech so we would have to do that privately, which our insurance covers. We're told that his current speech issues are not actually affecting how he's performing in the classroom - he responds to questions fine, participates in circle time, etc.

So I'm not even sure what I'd want from the school. I guess just to make sure kids aren't mean to him if he messes up a sentence or accidentally calls a girl "he." He's been able to make friends in his preschool but I don't know if it would be an issue in the new school or not.

[Anonymous]

I'd do the private for Kindergarten, then reevaluate for 1st grade. Why? Because what is helping him right now is two things:
1. being in a mixed NT and SN preschool and
2. being in a small group of 12 children and 2 teachers

Re: #1 - you say he isn't receiving anything excdept for speech twice a week. And that's technically true, but believe me, the teachers who work with 1/2 SN and 1/2 NT children at that preschool know how to work with children who need more time, who are slightly rigid, who need more transition, know how to help children learn social skills they don't "pick up" etc. So they are working in a different manner than a kindergarten teacher would with 22 children and 1 teacher (or perhaps 1.5 teachers, as some have a 1/2 day paraprofessional - which is really just an assistant)

#2 - you're right, a smaller group of children allows him to be more successful as he can get to know all the children better (and they him), he isn't as overwhelmed in a larger, louder, classroom, etc.

So I think I'd stay go to private for Kindergarten, where your younger child can do PreK, and not do any other testing right now. You would have to get your own speech therapist because privates won't offer anything like that and IEPs are for if he's at a public.

Then by spring 2019 (his kindergarten) you'll have a better sense of whether he's caught up with NT children and could go to public OR would do better at this smaller school for a few more years OR whether he really does need additional assistance that can only happen by reactivating his IEP at a public school.

I think you just don't know, and if you can afford it and it makes your life easier with pickup/drop off for both kids (bonus!) then I'd do the private school. You do NOT need to tell them anything about any diagnosis - although if he needs support then telling them why he acts in specific ways or needs specific supports is important - leaving them in the dark doesn't help him or them. But you could say he has a significant speech delay that has gotten a lot better, and he continues to have speech therapy to address this.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like you never actually got a differential diagnosis of his delays. Since this is a case where it looks like hearing loss may have produced social delays, it is even more important to figure it out. I would absolutely go to a reputable autism clinic to get a thorough evaluation.

As for the schools - I think you may not be seeing how much specialized support he's actually getting in his inclusion program, that he won't get at a private school. It may be that a public with an IEP provides more support than a small private with no services. The fact that the private is smaller does not by itself mean that it will be the same as the inclusion program. Possibly far from it. I don't think you should hide anything from the private, but rather ask how they support learning differences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd do the private for Kindergarten, then reevaluate for 1st grade. Why? Because what is helping him right now is two things:
1. being in a mixed NT and SN preschool and
2. being in a small group of 12 children and 2 teachers

Re: #1 - you say he isn't receiving anything excdept for speech twice a week. And that's technically true, but believe me, the teachers who work with 1/2 SN and 1/2 NT children at that preschool know how to work with children who need more time, who are slightly rigid, who need more transition, know how to help children learn social skills they don't "pick up" etc. So they are working in a different manner than a kindergarten teacher would with 22 children and 1 teacher (or perhaps 1.5 teachers, as some have a 1/2 day paraprofessional - which is really just an assistant)

#2 - you're right, a smaller group of children allows him to be more successful as he can get to know all the children better (and they him), he isn't as overwhelmed in a larger, louder, classroom, etc.

So I think I'd stay go to private for Kindergarten, where your younger child can do PreK, and not do any other testing right now. You would have to get your own speech therapist because privates won't offer anything like that and IEPs are for if he's at a public.

Then by spring 2019 (his kindergarten) you'll have a better sense of whether he's caught up with NT children and could go to public OR would do better at this smaller school for a few more years OR whether he really does need additional assistance that can only happen by reactivating his IEP at a public school.

I think you just don't know, and if you can afford it and it makes your life easier with pickup/drop off for both kids (bonus!) then I'd do the private school. You do NOT need to tell them anything about any diagnosis - although if he needs support then telling them why he acts in specific ways or needs specific supports is important - leaving them in the dark doesn't help him or them. But you could say he has a significant speech delay that has gotten a lot better, and he continues to have speech therapy to address this.

This was super helpful. You're absolutely right re: #1 - the teachers are excellent with kids with special needs even if they aren't technically special education teachers. I like your point that the kindergarten decision does not have to be a final decision. We could go private next year and if we find he does need more support in the classroom, we could switch him back to public for 1st grade. That actually makes the whole thing less scary!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you never actually got a differential diagnosis of his delays. Since this is a case where it looks like hearing loss may have produced social delays, it is even more important to figure it out. I would absolutely go to a reputable autism clinic to get a thorough evaluation.

As for the schools - I think you may not be seeing how much specialized support he's actually getting in his inclusion program, that he won't get at a private school. It may be that a public with an IEP provides more support than a small private with no services. The fact that the private is smaller does not by itself mean that it will be the same as the inclusion program. Possibly far from it. I don't think you should hide anything from the private, but rather ask how they support learning differences.

To be clear, I don't want to hide anything from the private. That's why I'd like to make sure I have the appropriate diagnosis, because I plan to share with them that he has special needs.

I'll also add that his current teacher attended our most recent team meeting a couple weeks ago so she did share with the whole IEP team what kind of supports they are using for my son in particular. They use a warning system (two minutes left of art, then it's time for snack) because he is fine with transitions if he gets his warning but can have trouble leaving a preferred activity with no warning (not every time, but sometimes). Otherwise, she said that they do not have to adapt anything else for him. She said he follows directions well and participates, etc. I'm not discounting that these teachers in general probably run the classroom in a way that is more special needs friendly than a regular old classroom.