Montgmery County approves $15 an hour. Does this = ByeBye to reliabe hours for part timers (my kids)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What about the rite of passage for teens working all summer to save up for a used car?

Gas money?

Money to go out with their friends?

Money for clothes?

Does the bank of mom & dad now have to cover these expenses as well?

Newsflash: Babysitting.

We pay our teenage sitter $15/hour cash. We use a handful of neighborhood teens as after school sitters. They make great money.
Boys can babysit, too. Our friends hired a neighborhood teen boy to hang out with their son after school and do homework.

At the risk of pointing out the obvious: a teen can earn far more babysitting for cash than working at McDonalds. And let's face it: your teen was never going to work at McDonalds.

All of the summer jobs currently held by teens will still be available (pools, camps, etc.). And the reality is that pools have been importing workers from Eastern Europe for years...because your teens didn't want those crummy, low paying jobs. Ditto for most seasonal beach towns.

This exactly. With the increase of the minimum wage, there will probably be less need to import workers from overseas for seasonal work. Even Donald Trump's Mar a Lago just filed a visa to get seasonal workers because they 'couldn't find' enough people to work there for cheap enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My teenager works full-time in the summers at a private school camp in DC and makes $15/hour. The OP's concerns will go the way of the "Ohmigod, the plastic bag tax will mean that DC residents will never grocery shop again!" and "Ohmigod, the smoking ban will mean that all bars and restaurants in DC will close!"

+1. My 16 yo made the DC minimum wage last summer.

How much does that camp charge? look at your typical small business, they are year round, pay year round employees, have slow times of the year and have to pay rent and other operating costs. A camp is 8-10 weeks long, do you think that same business or camp would pay your kid or anyone $15 an hour for 2080 hours? no not a chance.

Teens who do not work 90 consecutive days are exempt from minimum wage laws.

DC area summer camps charge parents an arm and a leg. In return, among other things, they get teenage junior counselors who are super smart and motivated, and who go through a ton of training, including several days of mandatory (paid) professional development every year and regular recertification in first aid and CPR. Many of the teens have specialized skills (for their ages), including being bilingual or extremely good at a sport or at acting, for example. These kids more than earn $15/hour. They work hard and will go on to much better jobs later on. And BTW, they wouldn't take these jobs if they didn't pay well, because they could easily be doing unpaid internships instead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What about the rite of passage for teens working all summer to save up for a used car?

Gas money?

Money to go out with their friends?

Money for clothes?

Does the bank of mom & dad now have to cover these expenses as well?

Newsflash: Babysitting.

We pay our teenage sitter $15/hour cash. We use a handful of neighborhood teens as after school sitters. They make great money.
Boys can babysit, too. Our friends hired a neighborhood teen boy to hang out with their son after school and do homework.

At the risk of pointing out the obvious: a teen can earn far more babysitting for cash than working at McDonalds. And let's face it: your teen was never going to work at McDonalds.

All of the summer jobs currently held by teens will still be available (pools, camps, etc.). And the reality is that pools have been importing workers from Eastern Europe for years...because your teens didn't want those crummy, low paying jobs. Ditto for most seasonal beach towns.

Yeah, Newsflash: in this area most teens are overbooked with 100 afterschool activities and you can't find decent responsible teens/high schoolers who will babysit regularly.

Huh. We've had regular HS sitters for the last 5 years without any issue. They trade off days based on their schedules/activities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My teenager works full-time in the summers at a private school camp in DC and makes $15/hour. The OP's concerns will go the way of the "Ohmigod, the plastic bag tax will mean that DC residents will never grocery shop again!" and "Ohmigod, the smoking ban will mean that all bars and restaurants in DC will close!"

+1. My 16 yo made the DC minimum wage last summer.

How much does that camp charge? look at your typical small business, they are year round, pay year round employees, have slow times of the year and have to pay rent and other operating costs. A camp is 8-10 weeks long, do you think that same business or camp would pay your kid or anyone $15 an hour for 2080 hours? no not a chance.

Teens who do not work 90 consecutive days are exempt from minimum wage laws.

DC area summer camps charge parents an arm and a leg. In return, among other things, they get teenage junior counselors who are super smart and motivated, and who go through a ton of training, including several days of mandatory (paid) professional development every year and regular recertification in first aid and CPR. Many of the teens have specialized skills (for their ages), including being bilingual or extremely good at a sport or at acting, for example. These kids more than earn $15/hour. They work hard and will go on to much better jobs later on. And BTW, they wouldn't take these jobs if they didn't pay well, because they could easily be doing unpaid internships instead.

But the law is the law.

Your kids are not as impressive as you think they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My teenager works full-time in the summers at a private school camp in DC and makes $15/hour. The OP's concerns will go the way of the "Ohmigod, the plastic bag tax will mean that DC residents will never grocery shop again!" and "Ohmigod, the smoking ban will mean that all bars and restaurants in DC will close!"

+1. My 16 yo made the DC minimum wage last summer.

How much does that camp charge? look at your typical small business, they are year round, pay year round employees, have slow times of the year and have to pay rent and other operating costs. A camp is 8-10 weeks long, do you think that same business or camp would pay your kid or anyone $15 an hour for 2080 hours? no not a chance.

Teens who do not work 90 consecutive days are exempt from minimum wage laws.

DC area summer camps charge parents an arm and a leg. In return, among other things, they get teenage junior counselors who are super smart and motivated, and who go through a ton of training, including several days of mandatory (paid) professional development every year and regular recertification in first aid and CPR. Many of the teens have specialized skills (for their ages), including being bilingual or extremely good at a sport or at acting, for example. These kids more than earn $15/hour. They work hard and will go on to much better jobs later on. And BTW, they wouldn't take these jobs if they didn't pay well, because they could easily be doing unpaid internships instead.

But the law is the law.

Your kids are not as impressive as you think they are.

Don't care what you think about my kid, and it's immaterial what I think. The parents who pay for these camps want qualified counselors, so the schools HIRE qualified counselors, and to get them, they need to pay at least $15/hour. There you go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also, everywhere I've ever worked, the mail delivery guy is mentally challenged. But he's being productive, building his self-esteem, and enjoying the camaraderie of his office mates. Better that he should do that at $9 to $10 an hour than be let go because $30,000 a year, plus health insurance, is just not worth it to an employer.

That's another part of the millions this will cost the county. The developmentally disabled have special job programs and they're allowed to be paid lower wages (even per-piece wages if it's assembly work) given the special situation that they can't be as productive due to their disability. Now they'll be forced to be paid minimum wage. Since many of these programs are run by the County, they'll be paying for it. In other cases, the jobs will just disappear since the non-profits can't afford that.

People in that situation (my brother is one of them) don't actually need the money as they already receive social security, housing, etc through other programs, as they are a ward of the state essentially. What they do need is the work experience and self-esteem.

First PP here, who brought up the example of the mentally challenged mail guy.

I just got back from the grocery store. The young man putting items in bags was obviously mentally disabled, but he is engaged with the community and seemed to enjoy chatting up the customers. Honestly, he is not worth much to the employer, and if he is to paid $15 an hour, his job will be eliminated.

On a related note, I feel a little guilty that I wasn't as friendly with him as I usually am. That's because I was annoyed. Why? Because out of 20 lines, only two were open - and each had five or six people with full carts. Took me nearly 20 minutes to check out. Raise the rate, and we'll see more of that.

[Anonymous]

I'm shocked that some of you seriously think that increased minimum wage is to blame for automated kiosks. The two are not related at all. Technology is what is driving automated kiosks. It is *always* going to be cheaper, in the long run, for large chains to utilize technology when possible. Hence the Giant, Panera, Safeway, etc. automated kiosks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also, everywhere I've ever worked, the mail delivery guy is mentally challenged. But he's being productive, building his self-esteem, and enjoying the camaraderie of his office mates. Better that he should do that at $9 to $10 an hour than be let go because $30,000 a year, plus health insurance, is just not worth it to an employer.

That's another part of the millions this will cost the county. The developmentally disabled have special job programs and they're allowed to be paid lower wages (even per-piece wages if it's assembly work) given the special situation that they can't be as productive due to their disability. Now they'll be forced to be paid minimum wage. Since many of these programs are run by the County, they'll be paying for it. In other cases, the jobs will just disappear since the non-profits can't afford that.

People in that situation (my brother is one of them) don't actually need the money as they already receive social security, housing, etc through other programs, as they are a ward of the state essentially. What they do need is the work experience and self-esteem.

First PP here, who brought up the example of the mentally challenged mail guy.

I just got back from the grocery store. The young man putting items in bags was obviously mentally disabled, but he is engaged with the community and seemed to enjoy chatting up the customers. Honestly, he is not worth much to the employer, and if he is to paid $15 an hour, his job will be eliminated.

On a related note, I feel a little guilty that I wasn't as friendly with him as I usually am. That's because I was annoyed. Why? Because out of 20 lines, only two were open - and each had five or six people with full carts. Took me nearly 20 minutes to check out. Raise the rate, and we'll see more of that.

Yes we will unfortunately.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's far cheaper for McDonalds to install touchscreen ordering kiosks than to employ humans.

Supermarkets will be 90% self checkout.

Office phone lines will all go mostly automated.

Say goodbye to most mom & pop stores.

Seattle made this same mistake and now regrets it.

This.

Companies will just find a way to do the work without paying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not worried about teens. I’m worried about single adults trying to afford a one bedroom apartment on 40 hours a week, so they have time to go to MC or a training school. I’m worried about the young married couple with a baby trying to afford an apartment, daycare, diapers, and formula with both parents working only 40 hours a week. Those folks need $15/hour.

This makes a very compelling case for why a $15 minimum wage is just as laughable as the current one. Nothing will change, nothing will be helped by going to $15.

If we really want it to be a workable, living wage that gives a single parent a fighting chance, it needs to be in the $35-hr range. And even that is bare bones when you take into account daycare costing $1,500/mo. But $35 would at least be fair. $15 is a complete joke

$35 an hour as a MINUMUM wage?

REALLY?!?!

You're completely out of your mind.


If that were the case, guys driving trucks should be making $200,000 a year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also, everywhere I've ever worked, the mail delivery guy is mentally challenged. But he's being productive, building his self-esteem, and enjoying the camaraderie of his office mates. Better that he should do that at $9 to $10 an hour than be let go because $30,000 a year, plus health insurance, is just not worth it to an employer.

That's another part of the millions this will cost the county. The developmentally disabled have special job programs and they're allowed to be paid lower wages (even per-piece wages if it's assembly work) given the special situation that they can't be as productive due to their disability. Now they'll be forced to be paid minimum wage. Since many of these programs are run by the County, they'll be paying for it. In other cases, the jobs will just disappear since the non-profits can't afford that.

People in that situation (my brother is one of them) don't actually need the money as they already receive social security, housing, etc through other programs, as they are a ward of the state essentially. What they do need is the work experience and self-esteem.

First PP here, who brought up the example of the mentally challenged mail guy.

I just got back from the grocery store. The young man putting items in bags was obviously mentally disabled, but he is engaged with the community and seemed to enjoy chatting up the customers. Honestly, he is not worth much to the employer, and if he is to paid $15 an hour, his job will be eliminated.

On a related note, I feel a little guilty that I wasn't as friendly with him as I usually am. That's because I was annoyed. Why? Because out of 20 lines, only two were open - and each had five or six people with full carts. Took me nearly 20 minutes to check out. Raise the rate, and we'll see more of that.

Disabled workers are exempt from minimum wage, so your example is meaningless.

[Anonymous]

If $15/hr means one smart person vs. 3 pathetic workers, I am all for it. I go to Home Depot and walk the aisles looking for stuff because the three people I ask for help have no clue how to help me. I go to Harris Teeter and some cashiers are so slow I go to a longer line just to avoid them (and still finish quicker).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If $15/hr means one smart person vs. 3 pathetic workers, I am all for it. I go to Home Depot and walk the aisles looking for stuff because the three people I ask for help have no clue how to help me. I go to Harris Teeter and some cashiers are so slow I go to a longer line just to avoid them (and still finish quicker).

Are you in Reston by chance? There is an older woman there who moves at a glacier's pace. I also go to a longer line to steer around her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What about the rite of passage for teens working all summer to save up for a used car?

Gas money?

Money to go out with their friends?

Money for clothes?

Does the bank of mom & dad now have to cover these expenses as well?

Raking leaves, Lawn mowing, babysitting, snow shoveling, house sitting............. Most of the other teen jobs of yesteryear have gone away anyway.

But why? When I was growing up, the teen boys (and some girls) went door-to-door looking for job shoveling snow and mowing lawns. Now, upper-middle class parents consider these jobs "beneath" their kids, and in the process are raising a other generation of entitled, arrogant snowflakes.

[Anonymous]

"But why? When I was growing up, the teen boys (and some girls) went door-to-door looking for job shoveling snow and mowing lawns. Now, upper-middle class parents consider these jobs "beneath" their kids, and in the process are raising a other generation of entitled, arrogant snowflakes. "

I would LOVE to hire teenagers when it snows - but only once have they come around knocking on doors. I don't really get why that is. They must have way too generous allowances. It's not so much about the parents telling the kids NOT to do the work; it's about making their lives too generous/easy if they choose not to do any work.