Wooton Accident- Civil Suit Filed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

He did drive himself and others away, though. Why are you exploring these hypotheticals when we have facts we can discuss?

What if he didn't DRIVE HIMSELF AWAY when he left, but got in the driver's seat at a later point? Would you still think the party hosts should be responsible for anything more than hosting a party? This isn't hypothetical. I'm truly curious about whether people think the party dad is responsible.

If you give underage people alcohol you should assume they are going to do something stupid that night, so you don't serve children alcohol

Even though some kids left the party shit faced with a designated driver, the adult that knew ey were dripunl should have let some parent know their kid was shit faced so they could make sure he did not make a drunk decision like take a car from his house.

Also, the Holton parent should joy kick drunks out of his house to go drive home. They should have gotten their names and called their parents.

I was at a NYE party and teens stole alcohol. The parents were called and a clean hand off was done, adult to adult.

Ok, THIS (the parts that didn't get autocorrected into oblivion) is reasonable and responsible.

I agree.

[Anonymous]

I was going to edit but "joy kick kids" sounded too good to change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have been following this situation for afar, but could people in the know answer a few questions for me. Because it just doesn't seem clear.

Did the dad provide the alcohol any of the kids, including the one that was driving? Or did they furnish their own and he just turned a blind eye?

Were the kids that were in the accident invited to the Saltzman's house, or did they just show up? And were they already drunk/drinking when they did so?

Salzmann did not provide the alcohol for this party (he supposedly has had in the past by I can not be certain on this - just from kids mentioning it)

One child had a fake ID and another used their older sibling or cousin (can't remember which but it was documented in police report.)

One 16yr old was bringing in two 30 pack and Salzman said "Is one for all of you and one is for me right? Haha"

He was aware there was bottles of vodka and multiple cases of beer.

The kids were invited by his daughter. She was leaving for a community service trip the next day.

They have had multiple drinking parties. The kids know their house is one of the party houses. Mom was out of town but has been there at previous parties.

They have never taken away the keys.

The party was getting late and some of the kids were getting obnoxious.

Salzmann told his daughter to tell all of the kids to go home.

The driver and his friends left.

Accident occurred.

When police arrived at Salzman's house after accident for questioning there were still kids out on the front lawn that did not leave yet and were intoxicated.

Utterly shameful. All for what???

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

He did drive himself and others away, though. Why are you exploring these hypotheticals when we have facts we can discuss?

What if he didn't DRIVE HIMSELF AWAY when he left, but got in the driver's seat at a later point? Would you still think the party hosts should be responsible for anything more than hosting a party? This isn't hypothetical. I'm truly curious about whether people think the party dad is responsible.

Yes, I would, which is why I phrased it the way I did. Most kids meet up and carpool to parties. They then have to collect their vehicles. It doesn't matter who is driving when they leave the party, the assumption is that every single one of them with access to a car might be driving drunk that night.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe not manslaughter, but criminal negligence? He made the kids leave, and did nothing to see that they left safely.

Maybe not liable in the eyes of the law, but morally - he could have prevented this tragedy. He has to live with the fact that he is partially responsible for what happened that night. He should have taken their keys and let them sleep it off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe not manslaughter, but criminal negligence? He made the kids leave, and did nothing to see that they left safely.

Maybe not liable in the eyes of the law, but morally - he could have prevented this tragedy. He has to live with the fact that he is partially responsible for what happened that night. He should have taken their keys and let them sleep it off.

I wonder if he even feels it. The trip to Mexico suggests otherwise.

[Anonymous]

What are they suing for? I heard the passenger was fine.

[Anonymous]

They probably both come from severely dysfunctional childhoods, those two Saltzman parents. They need some no-nonsense family counseling to get straightened out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They probably both come from severely dysfunctional childhoods, those two Saltzman parents. They need some no-nonsense family counseling to get straightened out.

They have to want it. They probably numb themselves quite well with booze and who knows what else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe not manslaughter, but criminal negligence? He made the kids leave, and did nothing to see that they left safely.

Maybe not liable in the eyes of the law, but morally - he could have prevented this tragedy. He has to live with the fact that he is partially responsible for what happened that night. He should have taken their keys and let them sleep it off.

I wonder if he even feels it. The trip to Mexico suggests otherwise.

And the public social media accounts of his drunk daughter not caring either.

[Anonymous]

NO, NO, NO.

He did not just let underage kids drink at his house. He supplied it. Maybe not specifically to the ones in the crash but kids at the party that night. He is the post from the charges.


Charge and Disposition Information


(Each Charge is listed separately. The disposition is listed below the Charge)



Charge No: 001Description:FURNISH ALCOHOL TO MINOR

Statute: Description:
Amended Date: CJIS Code:MO/PLL:XProbable Cause:

Incident Date From: 06/26/2015 To: 06/26/2015 Victim Age:

Disposition

Plea: GUILTY
Disposition: GUILTYDisposition Date:12/10/2015
Fine:$2,500.00Court Costs:$22.50CICF:$35.00
Amt Suspended: Fine:$0.00Court Costs:$0.00CICF:$0.00
PBJ EndDate: Probation End Date:Restitution Amount:$0.00
Jail Term: Yrs:Mosays:
Suspended Term: Yrs:Mosays:

[Anonymous]

Presumably insurance will cover it. It will settle.

[Anonymous]

Furnishing alcohol to a minor doesn't mean he bought it. It can mean he allowed it to happen under his watch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Furnishing alcohol to a minor doesn't mean he bought it. It can mean he allowed it to happen under his watch.

No, furnishing meaning giving it to minors, buying it for them, serving at your house. The charge for allowing it to happen is Contributing to delinquency.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NO, NO, NO.

He did not just let underage kids drink at his house. He supplied it. Maybe not specifically to the ones in the crash but kids at the party that night. He is the post from the charges.


Charge and Disposition Information


(Each Charge is listed separately. The disposition is listed below the Charge)



Charge No: 001Description:FURNISH ALCOHOL TO MINOR

Statute: Description:
Amended Date: CJIS Code:MO/PLL:XProbable Cause:

Incident Date From: 06/26/2015 To: 06/26/2015 Victim Age:

Disposition

Plea: GUILTY
Disposition: GUILTYDisposition Date:12/10/2015
Fine:$2,500.00Court Costs:$22.50CICF:$35.00
Amt Suspended: Fine:$0.00Court Costs:$0.00CICF:$0.00
PBJ EndDate: Probation End Date:Restitution Amount:$0.00
Jail Term: Yrs:Mosays:
Suspended Term: Yrs:Mosays:

Thanks for posting the details, but can you shed some light on why he didn't get charged for each under-aged kid drinking at his house?