High school math courses for College entrance

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Or Discrete Math. Sadly, the top universities want to see calculus finished and with an A too, before appication whic means by end of jr. year. DC did that and is now taking college chemistry so to hit the chemistry subject matter test hard in the fall. It's a brutal college app. world out there.

It's only brutal if that's the path you take. There are plenty of good universities, or colleges and majors within certain universities, which are perfectly fine with completion of pre-calculus before college. Unless your DC is applying for engineering at a Top 10-15 school, they can probably do just fine if they take Algebra I in 8th grade. My DD took Algebra I in 8th grade, didn't take honors math at all, has never gotten an A in a math course, and is not taking calculus in high school (although she will take AP Stats as a senior). As tragic as this is, I fully expect her to be able to attend a decent school.

He is. Va Tech said they want to see calculus finished by end of jr. year. Yale and Princeton want four subject matter tests, one of which has to be math. I'm not justifying the system - I think it's broken - but this is what the schools want to see. And four years of language. And preferably a second language, and on and on.

Pardon my ignorance, but what do you mean by "four subject matter tests"? Are you talking about AP tests?

[Anonymous]

NP here. I assume this refers to SAT II subject test - each are one hour long focussed on a specific subject -- math (2 levels), US History, foreign languages, bio, chem , etc. However, Yale and Princeton require do not require four. No schools require more than three, and very few more than two -- I just went through the college process a year ago

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD is far from college but has to decide whether to take Algebra 1 this Fall in 7th grade. (I know there are threads on DCUM about kids taking Algebra now in 6th grade!) DD has easily met the criteria but she won't be 12 until Nov and is not the most organized person. Math comes easily to her but she is not a math lover. I have read that good colleges want a certain number of math credits from HS itself and look for math in the senior year.. Any comments from those whose kids started Algebra 1 in 7th?

If you want her to go straight to college out of high school, I would definitely have her take Algebra 1 in 8th grade. When I was in school, the kids who took Calculus sophomore or junior year of high school were the ones most likely to go straight to college after high school AND graduate in 4 years. Going to college and getting a degree is no longer a walk in the park like it used to be. Even state colleges are extremely tough to get into, and will only take the very best students. After this year, I would have her take Geometry the summer she is entering 8th grade, so that way, she can take Algebra 2 in 8th grade, Pre-Calculus in 9th grade, and Calculus in 10th grade. These days, it's the only sure way of being to go to college.

[Anonymous]

That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

I don't know anyone who has a Bachelor's that didn't take Calculus before their senior year of high school. But I know plenty of people who took Calculus their sophomore or junior years who don't have a Bachelor's Degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD is far from college but has to decide whether to take Algebra 1 this Fall in 7th grade. (I know there are threads on DCUM about kids taking Algebra now in 6th grade!) DD has easily met the criteria but she won't be 12 until Nov and is not the most organized person. Math comes easily to her but she is not a math lover. I have read that good colleges want a certain number of math credits from HS itself and look for math in the senior year.. Any comments from those whose kids started Algebra 1 in 7th?

If you want her to go straight to college out of high school, I would definitely have her take Algebra 1 in 8th grade. When I was in school, the kids who took Calculus sophomore or junior year of high school were the ones most likely to go straight to college after high school AND graduate in 4 years. Going to college and getting a degree is no longer a walk in the park like it used to be. Even state colleges are extremely tough to get into, and will only take the very best students. After this year, I would have her take Geometry the summer she is entering 8th grade, so that way, she can take Algebra 2 in 8th grade, Pre-Calculus in 9th grade, and Calculus in 10th grade. These days, it's the only sure way of being to go to college.

I hope this is a troll. Do not have her take Geometry during summer school. This is terrible advice, but sadly seems to be the new tiger mom FCPS fad. Geometry is a foundational math class, just like Algebra. Your child will never learn it as well online as in classroom, and certainly not if it is compressed into 5-8 weeks over the summer. Plus what do you gain, exactly? After DC has taken Multivariable & linear algebra in 11th, your only non-TJ option is, what? AP Stats? Which is a joke that almost everyone considers to be the less rigorous alternative of AP Calculus-- it's certainly not more advanced than 11th grade Multivariable/linear. And if your DC really wants AP stats they can take it as an elective in 10th-12th, FFS and end up with the same math transcript (probably better, because they will actually understand Geometry and be ready for more advanced math).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

I don't know anyone who has a Bachelor's that didn't take Calculus before their senior year of high school. But I know plenty of people who took Calculus their sophomore or junior years who don't have a Bachelor's Degree.

Then you know very, very few people or the people you know are all so burned out that they gave up (or you are not sampling US colleges). I know plenty of successful people with graduate degrees who did not take Calculus until college (or in some cases, at all). I went to a top 25 college on full academic scholarship with 12th grade calculus-- AB. dThese days, a kid planning to attend a selective college probably should aim for Calculus. And maybe potential engineering and math majors should look at accelerating a year beyond that. But stop the insanity. Your average Doctor/lawyer/MBA/psychologist PHd, etc does not need linear algebra and Multivariable calculus in high school to get into and succeed at a top tier college. Signed, a successful lawyer who has looked at a differential equation since HS. Calculus has no relevance for 90+% of real life "successful" jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What math courses do kids take if they take algebra I in 6th grade?

7th: Geometry Honors
8th Algebra II Honors
9th Precalc Honors
10th AP Calc BC
11th Multivacalc and Matrix Algebra
12th AP Statistics

Unless they go to TJ or NOVA for more math options in 11/12th grade.

This doesn't get you anywhere new. My DC took Algebra I Honors in 7th and took AP Stats as an elective sophomore year and will take Multi and Matrix his senrio year. So taking Algebra I in 6th doesn't buy you anything but bragging rights. He is not unusual.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Or Discrete Math. Sadly, the top universities want to see calculus finished and with an A too, before appication whic means by end of jr. year. DC did that and is now taking college chemistry so to hit the chemistry subject matter test hard in the fall. It's a brutal college app. world out there.

It's only brutal if that's the path you take. There are plenty of good universities, or colleges and majors within certain universities, which are perfectly fine with completion of pre-calculus before college. Unless your DC is applying for engineering at a Top 10-15 school, they can probably do just fine if they take Algebra I in 8th grade. My DD took Algebra I in 8th grade, didn't take honors math at all, has never gotten an A in a math course, and is not taking calculus in high school (although she will take AP Stats as a senior). As tragic as this is, I fully expect her to be able to attend a decent school.

He is. Va Tech said they want to see calculus finished by end of jr. year. Yale and Princeton want four subject matter tests, one of which has to be math. I'm not justifying the system - I think it's broken - but this is what the schools want to see. And four years of language. And preferably a second language, and on and on.

Tech may say they want it, but they accept kids who take BC Calc senior year- even in Engineering. DC got in to tech engineering last year taking BC in his senior year. (HS class of 2015 McLean).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

I don't know anyone who has a Bachelor's that didn't take Calculus before their senior year of high school. But I know plenty of people who took Calculus their sophomore or junior years who don't have a Bachelor's Degree.

Then you know very, very few people or the people you know are all so burned out that they gave up (or you are not sampling US colleges). I know plenty of successful people with graduate degrees who did not take Calculus until college (or in some cases, at all). I went to a top 25 college on full academic scholarship with 12th grade calculus-- AB. dThese days, a kid planning to attend a selective college probably should aim for Calculus. And maybe potential engineering and math majors should look at accelerating a year beyond that. But stop the insanity. Your average Doctor/lawyer/MBA/psychologist PHd, etc does not need linear algebra and Multivariable calculus in high school to get into and succeed at a top tier college. Signed, a successful lawyer who has looked at a differential equation since HS. Calculus has no relevance for 90+% of real life "successful" jobs.

Kids planning to attend ANY college should aim for Calculus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

I don't know anyone who has a Bachelor's that didn't take Calculus before their senior year of high school. But I know plenty of people who took Calculus their sophomore or junior years who don't have a Bachelor's Degree.

Then you know very, very few people or the people you know are all so burned out that they gave up (or you are not sampling US colleges). I know plenty of successful people with graduate degrees who did not take Calculus until college (or in some cases, at all). I went to a top 25 college on full academic scholarship with 12th grade calculus-- AB. dThese days, a kid planning to attend a selective college probably should aim for Calculus. And maybe potential engineering and math majors should look at accelerating a year beyond that. But stop the insanity. Your average Doctor/lawyer/MBA/psychologist PHd, etc does not need linear algebra and Multivariable calculus in high school to get into and succeed at a top tier college. Signed, a successful lawyer who has looked at a differential equation since HS. Calculus has no relevance for 90+% of real life "successful" jobs.

Kids planning to attend ANY college should aim for Calculus.

My child only had pre-calc / AP Stats and had no problem getting into the colleges of her choice such as URichmond, JMU, American, some others..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

I don't know anyone who has a Bachelor's that didn't take Calculus before their senior year of high school. But I know plenty of people who took Calculus their sophomore or junior years who don't have a Bachelor's Degree.

Then you know very, very few people or the people you know are all so burned out that they gave up (or you are not sampling US colleges). I know plenty of successful people with graduate degrees who did not take Calculus until college (or in some cases, at all). I went to a top 25 college on full academic scholarship with 12th grade calculus-- AB. dThese days, a kid planning to attend a selective college probably should aim for Calculus. And maybe potential engineering and math majors should look at accelerating a year beyond that. But stop the insanity. Your average Doctor/lawyer/MBA/psychologist PHd, etc does not need linear algebra and Multivariable calculus in high school to get into and succeed at a top tier college. Signed, a successful lawyer who has looked at a differential equation since HS. Calculus has no relevance for 90+% of real life "successful" jobs.

Kids planning to attend ANY college should aim for Calculus.

My child only had pre-calc / AP Stats and had no problem getting into the colleges of her choice such as URichmond, JMU, American, some others..

Okay, so maybe some kids can miraculously get into college without taking calculus. But there's the matter of graduating. The kids who want to graduate from college, particularly on time, should definitely take Calculus. Otherwise they don't stand a chance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

I don't know anyone who has a Bachelor's that didn't take Calculus before their senior year of high school. But I know plenty of people who took Calculus their sophomore or junior years who don't have a Bachelor's Degree.

Then you know very, very few people or the people you know are all so burned out that they gave up (or you are not sampling US colleges). I know plenty of successful people with graduate degrees who did not take Calculus until college (or in some cases, at all). I went to a top 25 college on full academic scholarship with 12th grade calculus-- AB. dThese days, a kid planning to attend a selective college probably should aim for Calculus. And maybe potential engineering and math majors should look at accelerating a year beyond that. But stop the insanity. Your average Doctor/lawyer/MBA/psychologist PHd, etc does not need linear algebra and Multivariable calculus in high school to get into and succeed at a top tier college. Signed, a successful lawyer who has looked at a differential equation since HS. Calculus has no relevance for 90+% of real life "successful" jobs.

Kids planning to attend ANY college should aim for Calculus.

My child only had pre-calc / AP Stats and had no problem getting into the colleges of her choice such as URichmond, JMU, American, some others..

Okay, so maybe some kids can miraculously get into college without taking calculus. But there's the matter of graduating. The kids who want to graduate from college, particularly on time, should definitely take Calculus. Otherwise they don't stand a chance.

Both of my DCs are tracked to take a year of post- Calc math in HS, so I have no real dog in this fight, but I call BS. Every college, and every major, have different requirements. Does an MIT engineering major need HS Calc to graduate on time? Maybe (I have no idea). Does an English student at Mason? I seriously doubt it, since you can graduate without ever taking above pre-Calc math. Quit the fear-mongering.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the PP, I think the choices are Multivariable Calculus or AP Statistics, depending on the school.

OP here - I guess one of my questions is: if DD ends up not being the keen STEM type, can she stop math with AP Calculus (AB or BC) in 11th grade or will that limit her College admission potential?

Or Discrete Math. Sadly, the top universities want to see calculus finished and with an A too, before appication whic means by end of jr. year. DC did that and is now taking college chemistry so to hit the chemistry subject matter test hard in the fall. It's a brutal college app. world out there.

My son was admitted HYD with no calculus. He is a history major. He had some major accomplishments in the arts and social sciences. You should not make blanket statements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is crazy! Make sure she takes calculus by 12th grade, unless she wants to be an engineer. -- mother of two, one of whom is at HYP and the other at a top-20 university.

I don't know anyone who has a Bachelor's that didn't take Calculus before their senior year of high school. But I know plenty of people who took Calculus their sophomore or junior years who don't have a Bachelor's Degree.

Then you know very, very few people or the people you know are all so burned out that they gave up (or you are not sampling US colleges). I know plenty of successful people with graduate degrees who did not take Calculus until college (or in some cases, at all). I went to a top 25 college on full academic scholarship with 12th grade calculus-- AB. dThese days, a kid planning to attend a selective college probably should aim for Calculus. And maybe potential engineering and math majors should look at accelerating a year beyond that. But stop the insanity. Your average Doctor/lawyer/MBA/psychologist PHd, etc does not need linear algebra and Multivariable calculus in high school to get into and succeed at a top tier college. Signed, a successful lawyer who has looked at a differential equation since HS. Calculus has no relevance for 90+% of real life "successful" jobs.

Kids planning to attend ANY college should aim for Calculus.

My child only had pre-calc / AP Stats and had no problem getting into the colleges of her choice such as URichmond, JMU, American, some others..

Okay, so maybe some kids can miraculously get into college without taking calculus. But there's the matter of graduating. The kids who want to graduate from college, particularly on time, should definitely take Calculus. Otherwise they don't stand a chance.

This just made me laugh. Calculus is only necessary for kids going the engineering route. Do you even have kids in college yet, or are you just an uber-helicopter parent? I have one in high school and two currently in college. Each took pre-calculus, hated it, and finished with stats, which they enjoyed and found useful. And yet each "miraculously" was accepted to the colleges of their choice. They are very much English/social sciences kids and math never appealed to them, so they took the minimum amount required - with our blessing. Why are you trying to make parents even more anxious by spreading such false information?