there is only one Montgomery County School District

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As long as Montgomery has assigned neighborhood schools for most of the county, and the Downcounty and Northeast Consortia in the eastern part of the county, that area will have a stigma. It sends a strong message that those schools aren't good enough to stand on their own feet, and that parents will only stay in the system if they have choices that aren't needed in the rest of the county. Whether there's literally one school district is besides the point.

Is this how the consortia schools are viewed?

I work in the NEC and have often asked myself that question.

so sad on so many levels

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I do hear this fear from parents that you mention too, but I don't know if it's real. Can anyone chime in if they have a high-performing child in a lower-performing school, and how it has affected them?

np here. I have no kids yet in MoCo but I have a very close relative who teaches at New Hampshire Estates, a title I school. Sbe tells us things that she's really contractually or ethically forbidden to discuss. In her classes of ~15, there's always one child who isn't FARM + ESL. The other 14 are always poor to dirt poor recent immigrants with parents who are entirely uninvested in the kids' education -- for a variety of reasons. ie, they don't speak English, it's not culturally common to engage with teachers, they work 3 jobs, they live in another country and the kid is staying in a counsin's basement ... whatever.

Bottom line, my teacher-relative spends 98% of her time focusing on the 14 students described above because she must. The 'high performing child' gets minimal attention and my relative freely admits this. She is frustrated because she spend a huge amount of time on classroom management and behavior and less time than is needed on instruction.

Not to mention, when 14 of the 15 kids need to learn at a slow pace during oral instruction -- again, for a variety of understandable reasons -- the 15th kid must necessarily learn at a slow pace. Do a DCUM search for 'new hampshire estates' and you'll find other posts of hers and mine with more concrete examples of what I'm talking about.

What you detail in your post is exactly why the country (and county) is going down hill. Thank you for posting it. End this nonsense of allowing illegals in our schools; likewise in-state tuition in our colleges. Why are we training an illegal person with job skills when by the very nature of being illegal, they will not be allowed to legally contribute to our workforce.

I found it was amazing that precious few put 2 and 2 together a few months ago when MoCo put out the news that schools were getting overcrowded:

Montgomery County opens new schools, but overcrowding worries remain
http://www.gazette.net/article/20120111/NEWS/701119615/montgomery-county-opens-new-schools-but-overcrowding-worries-remain&template=gazette

when all they had to do was look back a year ago at Michelle Obama visiting one of our county schools and talking up the fact that it would be okay for illegals to continue this practice of taking up so many of these slots in our schools.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2010/05/immigration-hits-home-for-young-girl-and-first-lady-michelle-obama/

So on the one hand, the first lady talks up the fact that we need to allow illegals in our schools, and within months we find ourselves in an overcrowding crisis. Are the coocoos minding the shop? Hello, election year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree and would only add that no one pays "higher property taxes" (a comment that typically goes hand-in-hand with, "and therefore we pay for better schools.". We all pay the same tax rate.

The point of a county-based school system (as opposed to a town-based one) is uniformity of resources/opportunities/education county-wide. There are no "higher property taxes" districts. There is ONE school district.

I agree, and to this point, people often say that they pay more for their house so they should get better schools. Well, if the housing downturn has taught anything it's that the market is not always "right." It's possible you paid more for your house and your child's school is not in fact "better" than a nearby one where houses cost less. Or, it's possible you paid more for your house because people pay a premium to send their children to schools with more white children because they are more comfortable with that. There are no guarantees your housing choice was correct, or that the price of your house will not go down in the future.

Another point of clarification. There is definite link, establish in copious economic literature, that a house in better school districts cost more than the same house in a bad school district. The causation is easy to follow: people want to live in good school districts so they big more aggressively on those houses.
Also, to the extent the economic downturn affected the DC area, it has lowered all boats proportionately. It's still true that a 3-BR colonial on 1 acre will cost more in Bethesda (green zone) than in Takoma Park (Red Zone), with perhaps a few changes within small pockets, but on average.

It may not make it right, and it doesn't guarantee that the same school will be good 20 years from now. But on average, and within the span of a few years, the house green zone (schools considered good) will be more expensive than the same house in the red zone.

No - the DC area has not been proportionately affected. We have friends that live in areas such as Manasas, Frederick etc with homes that have lost 40% of their value from 2005 values. Our home recently appraised at, and has similar models selling for about (or 20-30 grand less) than what we paid for it at the absolute peak of the market in 2005. That $20-30 grand amounts to <5% drop in our neighborhood. Homes in nice neighborhoods, closer in (ie. Bethesda) have not been nearly as hard hit percentage wise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not sure what you thought you'd accomplish by starting this thread, other than get some support from people who can't afford B-CC or the Ws, and from a few others who can, but decided to live in the Downcounty area for whatever reason.

I'm the OP and I decided to check on the thread again, so I'll respond. I do live in the DCC, so your assumption on that count was right. And like 99% of America, I could not afford to live in Bethesda, though it's not like we pine for it. I have just seen many school districts in this country, urban and suburban and rural, and Montgomery county really is among the very best, EVEN (and this may be a surprise to some) the lower-performing schools in the county. I looked up some statistics. Nationally, 18% of students take and pass an AP exam. Even at Wheaton High School, seen by many on this forum as an impoverished wasteland, that number is 31%. All Montgomery County schools compare favorably to the "pretty good" small town school I attended in the midwest. They all compare favorably to DC, PG, and several more rural Maryland counties. I really just wanted to make the point, especially to new families moving to this area, that all of the schools here are part of a great school district, even if you don't live in those few towns with world-class super-schools. The upper class in this area does not have a realistic perspective on the rest of America, and I wanted to make sure theirs were not the only voices on this board.

[Anonymous]

To OP - I understand your point but I would hate for somebody to ask - where should I move and for the idea that ever school is the same and then have them end up in a school like Seneca Valley. Have you visited that school lately - believe me - it's not the same. Not everybody cares about AP classes and test scores.

[Anonymous]

The "we pay more in taxes" argument stems from the fact that two similar basic brick colonial houses, say one in Bethesda and one in the Silver Spring neighborhood featured in the Post this weekend, will sell for prices varying by perhaps $200-$400k. The Houses are similar...so it must be the land that is the difference here. Land=location, not landscaping. Thus, while tax rates are the same, person A might believe that he or she is paying "more in taxes" --which is. the case--than person B. Similar houses, but more taxes. A more expensive house, yes, but that is due to location.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As long as Montgomery has assigned neighborhood schools for most of the county, and the Downcounty and Northeast Consortia in the eastern part of the county, that area will have a stigma. It sends a strong message that those schools aren't good enough to stand on their own feet, and that parents will only stay in the system if they have choices that aren't needed in the rest of the county. Whether there's literally one school district is besides the point.

Is this how the consortia schools are viewed?

I work in the NEC and have often asked myself that question.

so sad on so many levels

Sorry to say, yes. I was disappointed when they launched the Downcounty Consortium, basically lumping five of the poorest performing schools in the county together, as if having a choice amont them was some sort of consolation prize for not being able to afford to live in a W cluster (of course, Wheaton starts with a W :lol A DCC with BCC, WJ, Einstein and Blair, that would have been a nice compromise, but probably completely unworkable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The "we pay more in taxes" argument stems from the fact that two similar basic brick colonial houses, say one in Bethesda and one in the Silver Spring neighborhood featured in the Post this weekend, will sell for prices varying by perhaps $200-$400k. The Houses are similar...so it must be the land that is the difference here. Land=location, not landscaping. Thus, while tax rates are the same, person A might believe that he or she is paying "more in taxes" --which is. the case--than person B. Similar houses, but more taxes. A more expensive house, yes, but that is due to location.

Understood, but again, the point of the unified/single-county tax system is fair distribution of resources county-wide regardless of who pays more for their house. In a town-based system, you might have two houses in the same town costing e.g. $500K and $300K but the kids in those houses will attend the same schools in the same system.

Theoretically the county is supposed to distribute these resources across the county fairly. Therefore the statement "we pay more in taxes" is fine by itself, but "we pay more in taxes and therefore are entitled to better schools" is emphatically NOT fine given the point of county-based government.

[Anonymous]

True. I came from a place that had town/borough-based govt. People there understandably felt they got what they paid for and far fewer elected to go to independent schools as a result.

[Anonymous]

OP, I totally agree with you so you have at least one person here who sees your point. We live in the DCC and my husband went to a MoCo school that many would consider to be in the bottom half of MoCo high schools (not one in the DCC though). He went to a decent but not great public university and does not have an advanced degree. I went to private school my entire life and have a Masters from a prominent university. He makes double what I do and in his field, people are throwing money at people who have his skills.

Our kids are not in high school just yet and I have no idea what we will do when they hit that age. Honestly, I think we will end up moving closer to Howard County because its more convenient to friends and family. But it will have nothing to do with the fact that our local high school isn't among the top 5 in Montgomery County, despite the fact that its still ranked higher than 90% of high schools in the this country.

But you will never convince someone in a Bethesda school district that this is an acceptable way to live. You just won't. So stop trying and just be happy that they aren't your neighbors.

[Anonymous]

I have to say that my experience so far leads me to agree with the original post. My kid is a very good in school (as measured in second grade) in reading and mathematics. He goes to Glenallan Elementary school in Silver Spring. Looking at the overall scores, I might have opted not to send him there. But when I first visited the school, I knew immediately this was (and remains) a well-run school. The teaching at Glenallan is excellent. I'll give an example: last week my son came home to tell me that while he likes to be able to buy gum, the need to save his money is more important and giving up the gum is the opportunity cost of saving for another day! What? I looked at him, asked him where he learned this, and he said in Social Studies.

This was not a fluke: he came home three days ago and was looking through the ingredients list of everything in the pantry. When asked, he explained that he's looking for palm oil on the list, and that he's offended about the destruction of the environment in Asia in order to grow palm trees, and how they're not even healthy for you.

This is second grade at Glenallan where we get weekly emails (and sometimes more) from our teachers telling us the focus of the lessons for the week, what the kids learned, and the plan for the following week. Not a highly rated school on anyone's list in MoCo, but I have enough education to know this school is an amazing school with great kids, teachers, and a wonderful principal.

I cannot buy into this nonsense about different applications of the curriculum at different schools. It's just not true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
This is second grade at Glenallan where we get weekly emails (and sometimes more) from our teachers telling us the focus of the lessons for the week, what the kids learned, and the plan for the following week. Not a highly rated school on anyone's list in MoCo, but I have enough education to know this school is an amazing school with great kids, teachers, and a wonderful principal.

I cannot buy into this nonsense about different applications of the curriculum at different schools. It's just not true.

It is absolutely true. I'm in Western MoCo - this school is probably higher rated, but I'd argue that your kids (based on your description) are getting a much different and better experience. We get almost no communication from the school about academic plans and focus save for a quarterly one page newletter (that is only 4 times a year). My child is in 3rd grade. No lessons regarding environment or personal finance last year that I'm aware of --- the schools each have a LOT of lattitude on how they implement the MCPS curriculum and each one is very different.

You need to know that your experience is NOT the same everywhere!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This is second grade at Glenallan where we get weekly emails (and sometimes more) from our teachers telling us the focus of the lessons for the week, what the kids learned, and the plan for the following week. Not a highly rated school on anyone's list in MoCo, but I have enough education to know this school is an amazing school with great kids, teachers, and a wonderful principal.

I cannot buy into this nonsense about different applications of the curriculum at different schools. It's just not true.

It is absolutely true. I'm in Western MoCo - this school is probably higher rated, but I'd argue that your kids (based on your description) are getting a much different and better experience. We get almost no communication from the school about academic plans and focus save for a quarterly one page newletter (that is only 4 times a year). My child is in 3rd grade. No lessons regarding environment or personal finance last year that I'm aware of --- the schools each have a LOT of lattitude on how they implement the MCPS curriculum and each one is very different.

You need to know that your experience is NOT the same everywhere!!

NP here-The curriculum for second grade has changed from last year to this year- Curriculum 2.0 was rolled out for grade 2 this year, so your child would have been under the old curriculum.

[Anonymous]

Would not it be nice if the required GT services were available in all the home schools in MCPS, so that parents did not have to stress about whether there is only one school district or not? Would not it be great if curricular changes suddenly does not throw away all best practices for GT education?

Plan to show up at the GT forum on March 22 at Magruder HS. See thread http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/221871.page for details.

Post your comments and questions at GTA site http://www.gtamc.org/2012-gt-forum before hand.

[Anonymous]

10:28, stop resurrecting thread after thread to post the same message. Get a life.