American Exceptionalism

[Anonymous]

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I don't know if you're anti-immigration altogether or anti-undocumented immigration, but you can't stem the flow. Maybe you can stem it a little more than they did during the times of immigration thru Ellis Island. FWIW, I agree that there need to be some controls on whom to let in and whom not to let in: criminals, drug/human traffickers, as an example.

New poster here. The immigration itself is not the issue. Assimilation is. My German great grandparents sent their children to American schools and encouraged English, study, hard work, etc. They themselves made an effort at English, although I was always told stories by my Aunt about how my Great grandmother butchered the language.

Immigration without assimilation leads to trouble, as Europe is beginning to realize.

Additionally we have laws around immigration. We don't get to pick which laws we individually like and will follow and which we won't. WE have means to change the laws if we so want in a democracy. This is in part why the right goes crazy about amnesty or granting in state tuition and state/federal aide to non-documented 20 year olds who came to this country as young children. Sure it wasn't the child's fault. The child should be angry at the parents, not the state, for the status quo.

I strongly disagree that the right hates immigrants. Rather, they embrace immigrants who enter the country legally and who embrace the language, culture and values of their adopted country.

Just my two cents worth. This is a surprisingly civil discussion for this board - hats off to all participating.

I think the only ones not assimilating are immigrants who immigrate at an adult/advanced age. It's unrealistic to expect 30 or 40 yo immigrants to immediately embrace all things American as soon as they step off the plane. I haven't noticed that the children of immigrants with assimilation issues.

On a side note, I don't think advanced age immigrants who can't say more than, "Hello. How are you?" to become citizens. They also should not be collecting Social Security checks and get Medicare benefits when they have effectively contributed nothing to the till.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yeah...we weren't mean to the slaves at all. As Pp said..work in the filed isn't the toughest life. Now aborting babies....thats kind of rough, I'm surevthey would have liked to live, even if they had to work the fileds.

Nevertheless, abortion is an issue upon which the country is split down the middle, but which the court has determined is an individual liberty that is constitutionally protected at the national level. Also, I don't see how this has anything to do with the attributes of exceptionalism that posters have discussed, like creativity or innovation or economic output, one way or the other.

I think you should start a separate abortion thread if you want to discuss the topic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

I don't know if you're anti-immigration altogether or anti-undocumented immigration, but you can't stem the flow. Maybe you can stem it a little more than they did during the times of immigration thru Ellis Island. FWIW, I agree that there need to be some controls on whom to let in and whom not to let in: criminals, drug/human traffickers, as an example.

New poster here. The immigration itself is not the issue. Assimilation is. My German great grandparents sent their children to American schools and encouraged English, study, hard work, etc. They themselves made an effort at English, although I was always told stories by my Aunt about how my Great grandmother butchered the language.

Immigration without assimilation leads to trouble, as Europe is beginning to realize.

Additionally we have laws around immigration. We don't get to pick which laws we individually like and will follow and which we won't. WE have means to change the laws if we so want in a democracy. This is in part why the right goes crazy about amnesty or granting in state tuition and state/federal aide to non-documented 20 year olds who came to this country as young children. Sure it wasn't the child's fault. The child should be angry at the parents, not the state, for the status quo.

I strongly disagree that the right hates immigrants. Rather, they embrace immigrants who enter the country legally and who embrace the language, culture and values of their adopted country.

Just my two cents worth. This is a surprisingly civil discussion for this board - hats off to all participating.

I think the only ones not assimilating are immigrants who immigrate at an adult/advanced age. It's unrealistic to expect 30 or 40 yo immigrants to immediately embrace all things American as soon as they step off the plane. I haven't noticed that the children of immigrants with assimilation issues.

On a side note, I don't think advanced age immigrants who can't say more than, "Hello. How are you?" to become citizens. They also should not be collecting Social Security checks and get Medicare benefits when they have effectively contributed nothing to the till.

Assimilation is more than English fluency or the willingness to eat a roast beef sandwich. No one has to "embrace all things American" to be American - even you are not required to listen to jazz or rap or bluegrass music. You do not have to watch indecent television shows. You are not even required to know your own country's history - something that at least naturalized citizens must do a bit of. No one is ever going to check to see if you went to church or wore the right colors on the 4th of July.

Countries which have tried to force cultural assimilation are now facing backlash because their population is divided against itself. A part of our success is that we really only require two things: to support and defend the constitution and the laws of our land, and to live free. As for the first, our history is full of decorated war heroes who ate food from the old country but who volunteered for service to defend America.

As for the second, this board is full of conservative posters extolling the power of liberty to free people up to be productive, innovative, and successful. In this country, sometimes the key to success is your ability to march to the beat of your own drummer. So let's drop this double standard where immigrants, who have been historically the engine of growth for our nation, must somehow add some unofficial responsibilities to their job because of where they were born. If you want a free country, let people live free. If you believe that the key to our economic powerhouse is liberty, then be consistent. Expect them to follow the laws of the land and to seek their fortune and let them be.

[Anonymous]

Here's a great op-ed piece related to this topic in today's NYT: Thomas Friedman's "From WikiChina"

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/01/opinion/01friedman.html?src=me&ref=homepage