Perfect scores, no interest in Ivys

[Anonymous]

My child only applied to 2 ivies. Didn’t get in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will cause entertaining responses I'm sure, but what would be your reaction if your 36 ACT/4.8W GPA student didn't want to apply to an Ivy? I respect it but am surprised.

Weighted gpa means nothing.
Perfect scores are no big deal.
I would say your thinking these would be the main criteria for Ivy admission means you have a lot to learn.

I actually think these kids have figured that out, which is why these high GPA, high test score kids aren’t attracted to Ivies. Everyone wants a school where they’ll be wanted, and fit in, and recent admissions results and statements have made it pretty clear that an ordinary suburban kid from the DMV who is really really smart is not someone who will fit in or be welcome at an Ivy. So why should they want to go there?

Actually my ordinary suburban kid is thriving and has absolutely found their people. The community has been tremendously welcoming and exceeded all expectations which were very high. You don’t have to like any particular school, but I always find it odd when people make generic claims with no direct experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will cause entertaining responses I'm sure, but what would be your reaction if your 36 ACT/4.8W GPA student didn't want to apply to an Ivy? I respect it but am surprised.

👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏. BRAVO
The only way to fight the unfair practises of Ivies is to send brilliant student to other colleges and bring prestige to those colleges.

Lots of other colleges besides the Ivies have prestige. If you hate the ivies for some reason, don't go to them.

+1 So sick of the idea that there is something wrong with being from a successful family. It's an advantage. We don't live in an all-things-equal world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It sounds a little they are taking a lot of liberty in assuming they would have gotten in and had the opportunity to turn down. Most of those stats are rejected. However, I applaud any kid that prioritizes fit.

+1 I also have a 1600 scoring kid. Especially with super scoring, a 1600 on the modern SAT is not as rare or meaningful as it once was when the test was designed differently. Even the majority of 1600 kids would get rejected from an ivy today, especially without other stand out accomplishments to back up the test scores. The schools do not really distinguish between a 1600 vs 1550, and there are too many kids who get these top scores, so you have to be a stand out some other way. As a previous thread pointed out, there are probably 20,000 who get 1520 or higher in one sitting, and when you allow super scoring on top of that, the numbers are even higher. It’s really good that OPs kid is not expecting or hoping to get into an Ivy or top10, and good for them for prioritizing fit.

I would be curious to know what places they pick and why. My kid is book smart, but not the leadership type or startup type, nor have they built a nuclear reactor in our garage. They just love learning and want to go somewhere where they can meet other nice, curious kids.

+1. I had a brief moment when DC started getting perfect scores on practice tests where I thought, should I be adjusting the schools we are planning to tour this year? And then I remembered how thoroughly unimpressed he was when we toured Brown, which was probably the closest fit wise of any of the Ivies. He knows he wants an artsy SLAC and so even if he does get a perfect or near perfect score this fall, it won’t change our plans. I’m not going to pressure him to go after something he doesn’t want that he probably wouldn’t get anyway. I’m glad he’s focused on fit and not prestige.

Which artsy SLAC does your DC like? Mine wants strong music arts but wants to major in one of the sciences.

We aren’t done touring yet but so far he liked Oberlin and Skidmore best.

[Anonymous]

The very first exercise Juniors should do when making the application list is draft a one paragraph preliminary essay on "Why this school?" for every school that might go on the list. This forces them to seriously do their research and will really start to help them shape an idea about what they really care about in a college. They will get to know each school and will be prepared when they meet school reps during the process.

Making a list from rankings and number data is meaningless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will cause entertaining responses I'm sure, but what would be your reaction if your 36 ACT/4.8W GPA student didn't want to apply to an Ivy? I respect it but am surprised.

Weighted gpa means nothing.
Perfect scores are no big deal.
I would say your thinking these would be the main criteria for Ivy admission means you have a lot to learn.

I actually think these kids have figured that out, which is why these high GPA, high test score kids aren’t attracted to Ivies. Everyone wants a school where they’ll be wanted, and fit in, and recent admissions results and statements have made it pretty clear that an ordinary suburban kid from the DMV who is really really smart is not someone who will fit in or be welcome at an Ivy. So why should they want to go there?

Actually my ordinary suburban kid is thriving and has absolutely found their people. The community has been tremendously welcoming and exceeded all expectations which were very high. You don’t have to like any particular school, but I always find it odd when people make generic claims with no direct experience.

I am really happy to hear that! I’m not surprised to hear that some ordinary suburban kids are admitted to Ivies and find their place. I was actually thinking of the somewhat blinkered perspective of a high school student: if you never see ordinary kids from your own high school get in, because all the slots for kids from your school are taken up by hooked kids, you just conclude it’s off the table for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will cause entertaining responses I'm sure, but what would be your reaction if your 36 ACT/4.8W GPA student didn't want to apply to an Ivy? I respect it but am surprised.

Many kids applying to school now have strong feelings on Israel and its treatment of the Palestinians specially in Gaza. Over the past few years Ivies have shown by actions that only support for Israel will be allowed. Your freedom speech and academic freedom will be suppressed. You can be expelled from the school if you are in disagreement with the administration or well funded outside groups. This is reinforced in what seems like a preferential admission for Jewish students(12-25% of the students population depending on the school vs 2% of the population). Add in the antisemitism attacks from the federal government that creates a preferred status for students that vocally support Israel.

Most students with the high scores and grades apply ED because it increases your admissions chances(Brown is 17.9% EA and 5% regular admission). Though this limits your choice to one school. Why would you pick a school where you are basically a second class student, can get expelled by outside groups, receive no support from the administration and have federal funding stripped? Today it is support for Israel. Tomorrow it could be support for vaccines or if you are a democrat.

Who wants that type of a hassle went there are other schools out there that are just focused on academics.

What a TDS take you have. Some kids have seen the Elite Ivies for what they are - bastions of progressive group think. And they want nothing to do with that - hence the big change where kids from the Northeast are now flocking to SEC and Southern schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will cause entertaining responses I'm sure, but what would be your reaction if your 36 ACT/4.8W GPA student didn't want to apply to an Ivy? I respect it but am surprised.

Weighted gpa means nothing.
Perfect scores are no big deal.
I would say your thinking these would be the main criteria for Ivy admission means you have a lot to learn.

I actually think these kids have figured that out, which is why these high GPA, high test score kids aren’t attracted to Ivies. Everyone wants a school where they’ll be wanted, and fit in, and recent admissions results and statements have made it pretty clear that an ordinary suburban kid from the DMV who is really really smart is not someone who will fit in or be welcome at an Ivy. So why should they want to go there?

Actually my ordinary suburban kid is thriving and has absolutely found their people. The community has been tremendously welcoming and exceeded all expectations which were very high. You don’t have to like any particular school, but I always find it odd when people make generic claims with no direct experience.

I am really happy to hear that! I’m not surprised to hear that some ordinary suburban kids are admitted to Ivies and find their place. I was actually thinking of the somewhat blinkered perspective of a high school student: if you never see ordinary kids from your own high school get in, because all the slots for kids from your school are taken up by hooked kids, you just conclude it’s off the table for you.

Also, I think many kids are turned off to the Ivies because the kids applying and getting admitted were intolerable in high school. Certainly no ALL but many. They're the kids who played along with parents who started the non-profits, nepo'ed their way into research publications, etc. Most other kids want to entirely avoid these grinder outliers.

[Anonymous]

I wish my kid with perfect stats was interested in schools where she would get major merit money. She plans to go to med school and I think she should save the money and go shine in pre-med classes at a lower-ranked school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ivy is not a meaningful category beyond prestige. When you really look at them, they are very different from each other and a student who applies to several of them is just chasing prestige and risking a bad fit. Some are very urban (Columbia, Penn, Yale, Brown), some are rural/suburban with not a lot going on (Dartmouth, Cornell, Princeton), some are very pre-professional and large/impersonal (Harvard, Cornell, Penn), some have social scenes that are Greek or eating club dominated (Dartmouth, Princeton), some attract more artsy and humanities types (Yale, Brown). It is not surprising to me that a top student might find a better fit and prefer an excellent non-Ivy school. Top SLACS in particular may be a better fit for some; some students might prefer the social scene at Duke or UCLA, or fall in love with Ann Arbor, etc. I think it is impressive when a 17 year old is mature enough to look beyond the Ivies. A good fit college can provide lifelong friends and connections. The older I get the more I think that is important; I know a lot of people who had a meh experience at an Ivy and have no connection to the place or anyone they went to college with.

Okay and some kids are a bad fit for Duke and UCLA. There's nothing wrong with not wanting to go to Princeton and there's nothing wrong with wanting to go to Princeton. It's a good place for some students and not for others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish my kid with perfect stats was interested in schools where she would get major merit money. She plans to go to med school and I think she should save the money and go shine in pre-med classes at a lower-ranked school.

Not the case at our school, but not dismissing your claim for your own. Only speak to what I have firsthand experience with. The sentiment just rubs me wrong sometimes, it’s like me saying the kids going to the flagship want to take the lazy route. Clearly not true, but equally dismissive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will cause entertaining responses I'm sure, but what would be your reaction if your 36 ACT/4.8W GPA student didn't want to apply to an Ivy? I respect it but am surprised.

Weighted gpa means nothing.
Perfect scores are no big deal.
I would say your thinking these would be the main criteria for Ivy admission means you have a lot to learn.

I actually think these kids have figured that out, which is why these high GPA, high test score kids aren’t attracted to Ivies. Everyone wants a school where they’ll be wanted, and fit in, and recent admissions results and statements have made it pretty clear that an ordinary suburban kid from the DMV who is really really smart is not someone who will fit in or be welcome at an Ivy. So why should they want to go there?

Actually my ordinary suburban kid is thriving and has absolutely found their people. The community has been tremendously welcoming and exceeded all expectations which were very high. You don’t have to like any particular school, but I always find it odd when people make generic claims with no direct experience.

I am really happy to hear that! I’m not surprised to hear that some ordinary suburban kids are admitted to Ivies and find their place. I was actually thinking of the somewhat blinkered perspective of a high school student: if you never see ordinary kids from your own high school get in, because all the slots for kids from your school are taken up by hooked kids, you just conclude it’s off the table for you.

Also, I think many kids are turned off to the Ivies because the kids applying and getting admitted were intolerable in high school. Certainly no ALL but many. They're the kids who played along with parents who started the non-profits, nepo'ed their way into research publications, etc. Most other kids want to entirely avoid these grinder outliers.

So avoid the "grinder outliers" then. Maybe the "grinder outliers" like Dartmouth and who cares?

[Anonymous]

I’m surprised that no one has yet to suggest another pretty obvious reason why he says he’s not interested: fear of rejection. He has a perfect record. Still, most of even those with perfect records are routinely rejected by the Ivy League and other top colleges. Surely OP’s kid is smart enough to realize that and doesn’t want to bruise his ego with a rejection.

I’m not saying this to be a dick. It happened with one of my own kids. Was borderline UVA and William & Mary, would have gladly gone to either, but wouldn’t even visit and said she wasn’t interested. I knew her enough to know that wasn’t true. In the end she applied and got in and went, but it took some doing.

I had another kid with better credentials but being a theatre kid was used to rejection. Had no qualms about applying—and being rejected—by several reach colleges. Ended up at an excellent LAC.

Remember, OP, you are dealing with a young and fragile person.

[Anonymous]

I don't get this thread. There is some category called "non-grinder insiders" and those are supposed to go to UCLA? That sounds like as stupid of a generalization as saying the "grinder outsiders" belong at any other particular college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't get this thread. There is some category called "non-grinder insiders" and those are supposed to go to UCLA? That sounds like as stupid of a generalization as saying the "grinder outsiders" belong at any other particular college.

It was an attempt at a flex and dismiss of ivies that did opposite.