NYT: Men where have you gone, please come back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women have taken half the high level jobs that used to belong to men in an effort to feel safe and secure with their lives. Good for them, that's understandable.
But they haven't realized by doing that, they shrunk the dating pool considerably. Now there are even less men that are "marriage worthy" and there is more competition for those men.
Men are fine marrying the waitress that is nice to them and runs a tight ship around the house. He would be happy providing her a nice lifestyle. Women will not marry the male equivalent. That's why it seems that there are so few quality men. It's simply due to women's standards are not reasonable considering what's available. So they either need to stay single or learn to find happiness with a man that treats them well even if he is 5'8" and makes $50k a year

The problem is that the "male equivalent" who is "nice to them and runs a tight ship around the house" is so rare that it's practically non-existent. The "around the house" part, in particular, is nearly impossible to find. A nice guy making 50k a year rarely takes on the house duties to the same extent that nice waitress will. That's the problem with aiming down for women. Other than a good income, men rarely provide enough value around the house. Staying single is often better.

There are plenty of men that could and would do it but women are not attracted to that at all. They would quickly lose respect for him and have an affair with the hard working, passionate about his job, project leader at work.

No, there aren't plenty of men who would do that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I work in tech support with almost 100% of young men and women, and the job pays around 80K/year. The workplace is around 50/50 young men and women. Almost 100% of these women at this workplace don't want to have anything to do with the men here, and they think these guys are "losers" for working in tech support instead of 400K/yr in software engineering jobs. All of these "average" women think they can get a 9 or 10 guys. One of the average women slept with a high-income software sales guy and former D1 athlete, and now she thinks those guys are willing to take her seriously, LOL...

Some women have ridiculously high standards, to be sure, but so do some men. That's why there are so many incels. I bet if the incel was willing to date a woman who was overweight and not pretty he'd have no problems finding a woman. Instead, they want size 2 women who look like umc yoga instructors.

Cuts both ways.

The sucky thing about living and dating in 2025 vs 1975 is there are way more fat people now, so a very average thin woman in 1975 is considered above average in 2025 just from not being fat. Women have become less attractive so now there’s increased competition for the good ones.

Have you tried not being fatphobic?

The "sucky thing" about being alive in 2025 is ridiculous beauty standards achieved by AI and filters that nobody can match up to, and average women being considered "too fat" by men who aren't even fit themselves. This idea that only non-fat women could be "good ones" is a construct you're free to opt out of, if your brain is capable of some simple critical thinking.

Regrettably I have dated fat women and there are very good reasons why men avoid them. It’s not even all about sexual attraction. For one, it’s annoying AF when she gets out of breath or has foot pain from walking a few city blocks while I can easily run 10k’s and marathons (true experience). Or she is pre diabetic at 27 years old and will have a ton of health problems going forward.

It’s not fatphobic to not want to be with someone who can’t even physically keep up with you or gave themselves serious health issues at a young age from their life choices.

Ah, so you're ableist, not fatphobic. I ran a 5k fat, climbed all the steps of Machu Picchu while obese, and wouldn't have run a marathon even when I was thin, but I know fat people who have. I'm "morbidly obese" now and have no trouble walking, can flatpalm the floor in front of my feet with straight legs and have perfect bloodwork, and I'm more than twice the age you cited in your rant.

You're just a basic ableist jerk who assumes fat=out of shape. People can be fit at a variety of sizes, just like they can be stupid in a variety of sizes.

This is not reality. Maybe you finished the 5k in over half an hour or something, I’ve seen fat people do that. I date girls who can run a 5k in ~20min and not a single one is fat. You might be able to FINISH those activities (which tbh puts you in a small minority of fat people, most can’t even jog 100yards) but you definitely can’t do them well. You will never be considered good at any athletic activity that involves running while being obese.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women have taken half the high level jobs that used to belong to men in an effort to feel safe and secure with their lives. Good for them, that's understandable.
But they haven't realized by doing that, they shrunk the dating pool considerably. Now there are even less men that are "marriage worthy" and there is more competition for those men.
Men are fine marrying the waitress that is nice to them and runs a tight ship around the house. He would be happy providing her a nice lifestyle. Women will not marry the male equivalent. That's why it seems that there are so few quality men. It's simply due to women's standards are not reasonable considering what's available. So they either need to stay single or learn to find happiness with a man that treats them well even if he is 5'8" and makes $50k a year

The problem is that the "male equivalent" who is "nice to them and runs a tight ship around the house" is so rare that it's practically non-existent. The "around the house" part, in particular, is nearly impossible to find. A nice guy making 50k a year rarely takes on the house duties to the same extent that nice waitress will. That's the problem with aiming down for women. Other than a good income, men rarely provide enough value around the house. Staying single is often better.

There are plenty of men that could and would do it but women are not attracted to that at all. They would quickly lose respect for him and have an affair with the hard working, passionate about his job, project leader at work.

No, there aren't plenty of men who would do that.

Go to a restaurant and ask the servers and bartenders. You would be surprised

[Anonymous]

It’s the apps. Because so much of dating is done online these days, its so easy to filter out a lot people based on a limited set of superficial qualities that play best online; the losers in this marketplace become embittered; rinse and repeat. There is a massive lack of in-person structures to allow people to meet one another as an alternative to apps, and even then someone better might just be one swipe away. There are lots of structural pressures that don’t serve most people very well at all, and no clear path back to something more sustainable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The majority of young men these days are unmarriable.

Young men and young women both.

+1. My own kids included sadly. I should have done a better job on well.

Absolutely. Gen x did a terrible job with their kids

I can't disagree strongly enough. I can't speak for boys - I've only got girls - but I think the girls I know who are late teens, early 20s these days are frankly amazing. Yes, of course, we aren't perfect parents, and I do know a lot of young adults who are way too coddled (and don't even feel comfortable making a phone call to set up an appointment) but they are compassionate, interesting, socially responsible people.

I do think the men my age - yes, gen x - are generally quite good, responsible people, but they have a huge deficit when it comes to their own mental health and well being. They don't know how to maintain good, masculine relationships. They use women as their therapists.

I do see men in general as experiencing a crisis. Not enough connection with other men. Not enough communication and intimacy (non-sexual intimacy) with other men. They rely on women to do the hard work of relationships, and are fixated on sex.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women have taken half the high level jobs that used to belong to men in an effort to feel safe and secure with their lives. Good for them, that's understandable.
But they haven't realized by doing that, they shrunk the dating pool considerably. Now there are even less men that are "marriage worthy" and there is more competition for those men.
Men are fine marrying the waitress that is nice to them and runs a tight ship around the house. He would be happy providing her a nice lifestyle. Women will not marry the male equivalent. That's why it seems that there are so few quality men. It's simply due to women's standards are not reasonable considering what's available. So they either need to stay single or learn to find happiness with a man that treats them well even if he is 5'8" and makes $50k a year

The problem is that the "male equivalent" who is "nice to them and runs a tight ship around the house" is so rare that it's practically non-existent. The "around the house" part, in particular, is nearly impossible to find. A nice guy making 50k a year rarely takes on the house duties to the same extent that nice waitress will. That's the problem with aiming down for women. Other than a good income, men rarely provide enough value around the house. Staying single is often better.

There are plenty of men that could and would do it but women are not attracted to that at all. They would quickly lose respect for him and have an affair with the hard working, passionate about his job, project leader at work.

No, there aren't plenty of men who would do that.

Go to a restaurant and ask the servers and bartenders. You would be surprised

I agree. High earning men don’t need and often don’t want their wife to work. We care more about is she going to be a good mother, do our personalities match, etc. My wife made 1/30th of my income when we met, I didn’t remotely care. It’s only the men who don’t earn enough to support a family on their own who want a girlboss wife.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of these "average" women think they can get a 9 or 10 guys [because they once] slept with a high-income ... former D1 athlete

This is a typical "average guy" story, genderswapped. All of the average guys think ... they're entitled to ... 9s and 10s.

Exactly. These male idiots think that watching Andrew Tate makes them an educated "king" deserving a 10. The difference is that reality hits women hard in their thirties, when all the good men get locked up and the fertility window closes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Women have taken half the high level jobs that used to belong to men in an effort to feel safe and secure with their lives. Good for them, that's understandable.
But they haven't realized by doing that, they shrunk the dating pool considerably. Now there are even less men that are "marriage worthy" and there is more competition for those men.
Men are fine marrying the waitress that is nice to them and runs a tight ship around the house. He would be happy providing her a nice lifestyle. Women will not marry the male equivalent. That's why it seems that there are so few quality men. It's simply due to women's standards are not reasonable considering what's available. So they either need to stay single or learn to find happiness with a man that treats them well even if he is 5'8" and makes $50k a year

This is the correct answer

[Anonymous]

In all these conversations about 9s and 10s, etc - whatever happened to chemistry, and falling in love and all that? My husband is not tall or rich and we are very happy together, healthy children, good sex life, compatible, etc. I'm not that old (38) and I swear it used to be normal for people to "click" without having to pre-qualify on some generic criteria first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In all these conversations about 9s and 10s, etc - whatever happened to chemistry, and falling in love and all that? My husband is not tall or rich and we are very happy together, healthy children, good sex life, compatible, etc. I'm not that old (38) and I swear it used to be normal for people to "click" without having to pre-qualify on some generic criteria first.

Feminism has made a lot of false claims on how to achieve happiness and has pushed the whole entitlement narrative

[Anonymous]

Any time a woman rejects a man he goes crying to his red pill loser friends and complains that women are trash and only want tall rich successful men. Meanwhile women know these men are rejected because they have a personality of a troll and are barely survive as adults. The bar is in hell and these men still bring a shovel.

On a first date:
Was he showered? No
Did he dress nicely? No
Did he show up on time? No
Did he say disparaging things about women? Yes
Did he vote for trump? Yes
Did he make uncomfortable sexual comments? Yes

But oh no, women’s standards are too high, blame feminism!
No, how about these men look in the mirror and realize they have very little to bring to the table and can work on increasing their soft skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Any time a woman rejects a man he goes crying to his red pill loser friends and complains that women are trash and only want tall rich successful men. Meanwhile women know these men are rejected because they have a personality of a troll and are barely survive as adults. The bar is in hell and these men still bring a shovel.

On a first date:
Was he showered? No
Did he dress nicely? No
Did he show up on time? No
Did he say disparaging things about women? Yes
Did he vote for trump? Yes
Did he make uncomfortable sexual comments? Yes

But oh no, women’s standards are too high, blame feminism!
No, how about these men look in the mirror and realize they have very little to bring to the table and can work on increasing their soft skills.

Perhaps this has been your experience. It has not been mine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any time a woman rejects a man he goes crying to his red pill loser friends and complains that women are trash and only want tall rich successful men. Meanwhile women know these men are rejected because they have a personality of a troll and are barely survive as adults. The bar is in hell and these men still bring a shovel.

On a first date:
Was he showered? No
Did he dress nicely? No
Did he show up on time? No
Did he say disparaging things about women? Yes
Did he vote for trump? Yes
Did he make uncomfortable sexual comments? Yes

But oh no, women’s standards are too high, blame feminism!
No, how about these men look in the mirror and realize they have very little to bring to the table and can work on increasing their soft skills.

Perhaps this has been your experience. It has not been mine.

Yeah this was really not my experience with OLD when I did it. The people that bother to go on dates are usually putting in som effort. Even your example is counter to the article which is more stating men have given up even going out.

[Anonymous]

At most universities. 60% of undegrads are female now. We're failing men.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I work in tech support with almost 100% of young men and women, and the job pays around 80K/year. The workplace is around 50/50 young men and women. Almost 100% of these women at this workplace don't want to have anything to do with the men here, and they think these guys are "losers" for working in tech support instead of 400K/yr in software engineering jobs. All of these "average" women think they can get a 9 or 10 guys. One of the average women slept with a high-income software sales guy and former D1 athlete, and now she thinks those guys are willing to take her seriously, LOL...

Some women have ridiculously high standards, to be sure, but so do some men. That's why there are so many incels. I bet if the incel was willing to date a woman who was overweight and not pretty he'd have no problems finding a woman. Instead, they want size 2 women who look like umc yoga instructors.

Cuts both ways.

The sucky thing about living and dating in 2025 vs 1975 is there are way more fat people now, so a very average thin woman in 1975 is considered above average in 2025 just from not being fat. Women have become less attractive so now there’s increased competition for the good ones.

Have you tried not being fatphobic?

The "sucky thing" about being alive in 2025 is ridiculous beauty standards achieved by AI and filters that nobody can match up to, and average women being considered "too fat" by men who aren't even fit themselves. This idea that only non-fat women could be "good ones" is a construct you're free to opt out of, if your brain is capable of some simple critical thinking.

Internist here. No really, a shocking percentage of 20-something females have overweight and obesity. Men tend to be somewhat older *as a cohort* when they move into obesity.

This has nothing to do with with filter-driven beauty standards. Young people in the US are fat, and it occurs earlier in women than men.