Test optional over

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges can still admit students with low test scores even if they submit them!

As long as they are white, otherwise the Administration will sue them for admitting an “objectively worse” student (read as: Black).

Why did they admit someone with lower scores? Must be a proxy for race.

The administration couldn’t be clearer: admitting students of color to elite schools is going to be treated as prima facie evidence of unlawful discrimination against whites.

You don't know what you are talking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges can still admit students with low test scores even if they submit them!

Yes, as long as they admit non-URM at the same rate as URM students.

Legacies, high dollar donors, faculty kids, the average white guys to balance out gender gap, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is too bad. Creatives will be shut out of better colleges because many don’t process standardized tests well. One of mine tested high and another went TO. They both deserve a place at college, but the one kid isn’t inherently a better student than the other. The one who didn’t test well has more curiosity and is always leading interesting discussions on a myriad of topics.

That's BS! Do you have data to back up that ridiculous claim?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is too bad. Creatives will be shut out of better colleges because many don’t process standardized tests well. One of mine tested high and another went TO. They both deserve a place at college, but the one kid isn’t inherently a better student than the other. The one who didn’t test well has more curiosity and is always leading interesting discussions on a myriad of topics.

Don't worry.
There are good colleges for the kid who got 1250 sat. The kid will be fine.

Elite colleges are for kids who got both.

You are so smug. Your kid who “got both” may not have the advantages you think he does in the real world.

Colleges like Bowdoin (which is a great college) have long disagreed with you that test scores are the most important factor. Their track record shows they know how to choose good students without test scores. FWIW, I believe they used to have kids submit graded work in lieu of test scores so they had a method and it clearly worked for them for many years. Not sure if it is the same now that more schools are test optional. I know you can’t comprehend it, but good schools actually do know what they are looking for and have a good track record of picking the right students. It’s not all about who has the highest scores.

You speculate too much.
MIT disagrees. There's no need to take low scoring kids unless they really show something special such as
winning math Olympiad, national hacker championship, etc that everyone can agree.

Nobody is talking about MIT. They are not TO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some LAC have been TO for many, many years and it is not to achieve a racial balance. I would imagine the administration would need to show that is the reason. In many (most?) cases, it is not.

This is not really true. Which LACs? Many went TO right around the time of the pandemic and when Harvard was sued and the outcome did not look good.

Here’s a chronological list.
https://www.fairtest.org/sites/default/files/Optional-Growth-Chronology.pdf

Some examples:

George Mason (2006)
Wake Forest (2008)
Colby (2009)
Whitman (2016)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges can still admit students with low test scores even if they submit them!

Exactly. It doesn't mean kids who aren't great test takers won't get into college.

“Aren’t great test takers”, the foundation for academic measurement in every setting. Have you ever wondered if they “aren’t great test takers” but have a high GPA, how that occurred? Grade inflation? Retakes? Clearly it was not “test taking”. If there is one score I would use for college admissions it’s the SAT/ACT and secondarily AP scores. The amount of TO kids getting into colleges over my high stat GPA/SAT kids makes me crazy and I have every right to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some LAC have been TO for many, many years and it is not to achieve a racial balance. I would imagine the administration would need to show that is the reason. In many (most?) cases, it is not.

This is not really true. Which LACs? Many went TO right around the time of the pandemic and when Harvard was sued and the outcome did not look good.

Here’s a chronological list.
https://www.fairtest.org/sites/default/files/Optional-Growth-Chronology.pdf

Some examples:

George Mason (2006)
Wake Forest (2008)
Colby (2009)
Whitman (2016)

Bowdoin has also been test optional for decades. The slacs and Wake are pretty white.

[Anonymous]

I have a feeling most elite colleges will not fight lawsuits to remain test optional so yea it's gone, give it a few months.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges can still admit students with low test scores even if they submit them!

Exactly. It doesn't mean kids who aren't great test takers won't get into college.

“Aren’t great test takers”, the foundation for academic measurement in every setting. Have you ever wondered if they “aren’t great test takers” but have a high GPA, how that occurred? Grade inflation? Retakes? Clearly it was not “test taking”. If there is one score I would use for college admissions it’s the SAT/ACT and secondarily AP scores. The amount of TO kids getting into colleges over my high stat GPA/SAT kids makes me crazy and I have every right to be.

Hahahaha…. I love this…. My low stat kid (1380) with amazing essays and ECs is in at Princeton…. Yes, he is a white privileged kid, not an athlete or legacy….. he sends his regards to your high stat kid 😘

[Anonymous]

The dumbs always rail against standardized tests……not at all surprising.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Will they get rid of legacy admissions as a proxy for selecting wealthy white students?

BOOM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are a few long term TO schools and that is fine, they are quirky and look for something other than academics. But for the vast majority of academic mainstream schools the thought of making admissions decisions with localized GPAs, chatgpt essays and unverified activities is just asinine. They have to have an agenda to agree to this and it’s not the find the highest performing academics, which are potentially America’s GREATEST natural resource. They are being cast aside for all sorts of nonsense while other countries plot our demise.

This is essentially the best overall argument as to why we need standardized scores and doesn't lean into the anti-minority position many tend to jump to. It is frankly puzzling how the US has agreed with an admissions system that deprioritizes academics as much as it does. Pretty much every other developed nation has a model built off of rigorous exams, and we prize...being interesting?

Do I think students with quirky extracurriculars and backgrounds provide a ton to the college community? 100%, it is how I got into college, and I've always been more interested in investing into community, so college admissions was perfect for me, but I also had the baseline SAT stats to get into an elite school. Honestly, schools should just use an SAT minimum that is public knowledge and throw out apps under a certain threshold. The SAT is practically a joke-exam compared to peer nations and seriously needs a curriculum/rigor upgrade.

[Anonymous]

Agree with PP- there is a college for everyone but being interesting, esp unverified, is not what should be driving any college admissions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges can still admit students with low test scores even if they submit them!

Exactly. It doesn't mean kids who aren't great test takers won't get into college.

“Aren’t great test takers”, the foundation for academic measurement in every setting. Have you ever wondered if they “aren’t great test takers” but have a high GPA, how that occurred? Grade inflation? Retakes? Clearly it was not “test taking”. If there is one score I would use for college admissions it’s the SAT/ACT and secondarily AP scores. The amount of TO kids getting into colleges over my high stat GPA/SAT kids makes me crazy and I have every right to be.

Almost everyone DD knows is getting an accommodation of some sort. Expect accommodations to rise if TO is eliminated.

[Anonymous]

So will this have an impact on Regular Decisions this year?