Give me constructive advice on how to help my middle schooler in English

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have you tried CTY? They would be in class with other high performing peers which could get them out of the rut. My poor kid was in the dumbed down curriculum and became catatonic by the end of the school year, producing mediocre work. Being around kids who are at their same level might snap them out of that.

CTY is overpriced. If you're willing to go online and have gifted kids, there are better options like AoPS, NUMATS, Davidson, Athena's Academy, Astra Nova, Cresco Nova, Synthesis, Northwestern GLL, Eclipse Academy, Online G3, Stanford OHS, Lukeion, and CLRC. https://www.davidsongifted.org/gifted-blog/online-gifted-learning-options/

Pp, can you expand on this? Which are really strong here? My kids are actually total rule followers and very respectful of their teachers - if their teachers ask them to do something, they will absolutely follow it to a T and not shirk at all. Virtual school was completely fine for them except the missed social aspect. I'd need something with a live teacher on zoom who somehow enforces accountability.

Which subject(s) do you want? Are they gifted, or advanced in one or more subject(s)? Do you want something supplemental/enrichment or a full course on a school subject complete with all the work and time commitments of a full course or a full course on a topic unlikely to be covered in school? What's your budget? What ages/grades are your children?

Op here.. kids going into 6th and 8th. They are both gifted. We opted out of both math/Humanities magnets (which they were both offered seats at) because we didn't want the commute and also they had good friends. Second guessing ourselves on the Humanities front now I guess. We want English and supplemental. Something like a book club with some rigor/analysis on text analysis and writing about the books. Ideally a class once a week (2 hrs) and reading/hw on the side. Fwiw Ms English is so dumb that my older kid routinely knocks out the required assignment in class and then uses the extra time to start her math hw.

Same for my kid. My kid went from the CES back to the home MS and it was so discouraging. Basically, the kids get an A for completion. Zero feedback on the writing. If you kid can write basic sentences, he will get an A. The peer review is a joke.

[Anonymous]

Seems like you all should be looking at non-MCPS options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Seems like you all should be looking at non-MCPS options.

That’s not helpful. This thread is asking about supplementing for kids who are in MCPS and stuck with a single English level for grades 6-10. But I’ll bet you knew that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sad that this thread is here, as people argue in the other thread about how great MCPS is.

Good luck, OP. I’m sorry.

This...I need to link this in the thread about private schools. OP, consider an inexpensive middle school...Catholic K-8. Reading, writing, grammar, etc. superior to mcps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Seems like you all should be looking at non-MCPS options.

Private school is just not an expense we can swing right now. So we’re sticking with MCPS and supplementing for Math and Language Arts.

I’d love to move, but DH’s job needs to be here.

We’re trying to do the best we can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like you all should be looking at non-MCPS options.

Private school is just not an expense we can swing right now. So we’re sticking with MCPS and supplementing for Math and Language Arts.

I’d love to move, but DH’s job needs to be here.

We’re trying to do the best we can.

You’re supplementing for the two core subjects, which means your kids are barely getting an education.

Your kids were offered magnet spots. You opted for a shorter commute and social environment over a better education.

I just don’t feel bad for you. Your kids, yes. Not you.

My parents swung private school by making significant sacrifices. There are more inexpensive private schools that are still miles better than MCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You have to first ask yourself what constitutes a challenging novel and Why? You clearly have a problem with what they would choose to read, Why? And then what is the purpose of the reading? Are you trying to get them consume information, learn about a specific topic, or read for enjoyment.

Also reading the Lighting Thief and Hunger Games in third or fourth grade doesn’t mean actual literary analysis was done of the novels at that time.

I'd like them to analyze and understand complex plots. I'd like their vocabulary to improve. I'd like their own writing to improve. I'd like for them to think.

I mean your kids will hate you if you push this on them--- if you want them to truly love reading, encourage any kind of books. If you think their writing should improve, how about a creative or other writing class?

This, this, this. If you want them to consume more challenging books, read them TO your child. Let the kid read what they want for fun.

[Anonymous]

NP here also looking for some ideas for my kid.

Read to a middle schooler? No, just no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Hunger Games is structurally brilliant and worth studying to identify the tools a good writer uses.

Graphic novels can have complex plots, and both graphic novels and audio books can be subjected to the same literary analysis as text books. Maybe start there.

Also, if audio books work, consider if your kid may have a visual or processing issue with text.

There are a bunch of book recap podcasts, many of which get into analysis. The specific ones I listen to are explicit so maybe those aren't ideal for MS but finding a podcast on a "classic" should be do-able. You could do a read-along or read-after.

Can you expand upon this? I'd be interested to discuss that with kids. - NP

I'm the first PP. There is nothing wasted in the Hunger Games narrative: every scene has a job. And the structure is classic, see these links for a detailed explanation:

https://www.writingasasecondcareer.com/hunger-games/

http://storyfix.com/the-hunger-games-beat-sheet

I was speaking of story structure and not political commentary or historical allusions, but of course those are present too. If nothing else, you could have a kid look up every Roman name in the book.

Which would be a more meaningful exercise if they were also studying humanities and the classics. Looking up names in a vacuum without the context is not as useful.

[Anonymous]

MS is a tough time to get most kids to read outside of what is required. Some will do it naturally, others will simply resent you. OP, you sound like you are doing all the right things that will make it likely that your kid will come back to reading later in life. But now starts the march toward independence, which often means doing the opposite of what you know your parents hope you will do today.

Keep putting good books in front of them; offer incentives if they finish them. Read them yourself and comment on them at the dinner table, discuss what you are reading and at least they will absorb parts of it and gather some touchstones.

[Anonymous]

Why aren’t you reading to your kids regularly?

It’s recommended through middle school.

Your family should be doing this and reading a book a month and discussing.

Do you work nights or something?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why aren’t you reading to your kids regularly?

It’s recommended through middle school.

Your family should be doing this and reading a book a month and discussing.

Do you work nights or something?

what? Why on earth would you read to a MSer? That's insane. Talk about babying a tween/teen.

I have two kids.

One is gifted, and like a PP, classes at home school were insanely easy compared to the HGC (former name of CES), and they would typically have so much time in class that they'd do that night's HW, and the next day's as well if they got the assignment early enough.

The other is above average, not gifted, and even this DC said the writing was insanely easy in MS. This DC was in the whatever enrichment MS class MCPS came up with as a consolation to the MS magnet lottery.

It gets better in HS, but not by much unless you take an AP class. And MS also does a crappy job preparing kids for the more rigorous AP classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have you tried CTY? They would be in class with other high performing peers which could get them out of the rut. My poor kid was in the dumbed down curriculum and became catatonic by the end of the school year, producing mediocre work. Being around kids who are at their same level might snap them out of that.

CTY is overpriced. If you're willing to go online and have gifted kids, there are better options like AoPS, NUMATS, Davidson, Athena's Academy, Astra Nova, Cresco Nova, Synthesis, Northwestern GLL, Eclipse Academy, Online G3, Stanford OHS, Lukeion, and CLRC. https://www.davidsongifted.org/gifted-blog/online-gifted-learning-options/

Pp, can you expand on this? Which are really strong here? My kids are actually total rule followers and very respectful of their teachers - if their teachers ask them to do something, they will absolutely follow it to a T and not shirk at all. Virtual school was completely fine for them except the missed social aspect. I'd need something with a live teacher on zoom who somehow enforces accountability.

Which subject(s) do you want? Are they gifted, or advanced in one or more subject(s)? Do you want something supplemental/enrichment or a full course on a school subject complete with all the work and time commitments of a full course or a full course on a topic unlikely to be covered in school? What's your budget? What ages/grades are your children?

Op here.. kids going into 6th and 8th. They are both gifted. We opted out of both math/Humanities magnets (which they were both offered seats at) because we didn't want the commute and also they had good friends. Second guessing ourselves on the Humanities front now I guess. We want English and supplemental. Something like a book club with some rigor/analysis on text analysis and writing about the books. Ideally a class once a week (2 hrs) and reading/hw on the side. Fwiw Ms English is so dumb that my older kid routinely knocks out the required assignment in class and then uses the extra time to start her math hw.

I see this so much. People stick with mediocre public school because they want convenience and like the social aspect.

Well, your kids have friends and you have a short commute, but they can’t write.

I feel sorry for your kids but not you.

Op here. Well, that is kind of mean. And also my kids are definitely farther along in Math/Humanities/foreign language than most of my friends who do send their kids to privates. Also - we aren't white. This may not be relevant to some but we really value diversity. So - nothing is perfect.
It's helpful when people don't engage in black and white thinking. I am a parent who is just trying to make things a bit better in this one arena.

Also - I never said they could not write. They write just fine. They write a ton in global Humanities which is the class that's basically forcing them to really write these days, but those texts are non fiction that they analyze.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have you tried CTY? They would be in class with other high performing peers which could get them out of the rut. My poor kid was in the dumbed down curriculum and became catatonic by the end of the school year, producing mediocre work. Being around kids who are at their same level might snap them out of that.

CTY is overpriced. If you're willing to go online and have gifted kids, there are better options like AoPS, NUMATS, Davidson, Athena's Academy, Astra Nova, Cresco Nova, Synthesis, Northwestern GLL, Eclipse Academy, Online G3, Stanford OHS, Lukeion, and CLRC. https://www.davidsongifted.org/gifted-blog/online-gifted-learning-options/

Pp, can you expand on this? Which are really strong here? My kids are actually total rule followers and very respectful of their teachers - if their teachers ask them to do something, they will absolutely follow it to a T and not shirk at all. Virtual school was completely fine for them except the missed social aspect. I'd need something with a live teacher on zoom who somehow enforces accountability.

Which subject(s) do you want? Are they gifted, or advanced in one or more subject(s)? Do you want something supplemental/enrichment or a full course on a school subject complete with all the work and time commitments of a full course or a full course on a topic unlikely to be covered in school? What's your budget? What ages/grades are your children?

Op here.. kids going into 6th and 8th. They are both gifted. We opted out of both math/Humanities magnets (which they were both offered seats at) because we didn't want the commute and also they had good friends. Second guessing ourselves on the Humanities front now I guess. We want English and supplemental. Something like a book club with some rigor/analysis on text analysis and writing about the books. Ideally a class once a week (2 hrs) and reading/hw on the side. Fwiw Ms English is so dumb that my older kid routinely knocks out the required assignment in class and then uses the extra time to start her math hw.

I see this so much. People stick with mediocre public school because they want convenience and like the social aspect.

Well, your kids have friends and you have a short commute, but they can’t write.

I feel sorry for your kids but not you.

Op here. Well, that is kind of mean. And also my kids are definitely farther along in Math/Humanities/foreign language than most of my friends who do send their kids to privates. Also - we aren't white. This may not be relevant to some but we really value diversity. So - nothing is perfect.
It's helpful when people don't engage in black and white thinking. I am a parent who is just trying to make things a bit better in this one arena.

Also - I never said they could not write. They write just fine. They write a ton in global Humanities which is the class that's basically forcing them to really write these days, but those texts are non fiction that they analyze.

Your statement about your kids being farther along than private school kids is so insanely false.

We’ve had a long debate on here about math in MCPS vs private and have shown that private schools are better than non-magnet MCPS.

But to say your kids are farther ahead in humanities is delusional. I’m sorry, it’s the truth.

Lastly, many private schools around here are plenty diverse from a racial standpoint. My daughter has friends at her private school who are Iranian, Hispanic, Black, Indian, Spanish, French, etc etc etc.

You sound massively ignorant about private schools and really have no basis for making the statements you do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why aren’t you reading to your kids regularly?

It’s recommended through middle school.

Your family should be doing this and reading a book a month and discussing.

Do you work nights or something?

what? Why on earth would you read to a MSer? That's insane. Talk about babying a tween/teen.

I have two kids.

One is gifted, and like a PP, classes at home school were insanely easy compared to the HGC (former name of CES), and they would typically have so much time in class that they'd do that night's HW, and the next day's as well if they got the assignment early enough.

The other is above average, not gifted, and even this DC said the writing was insanely easy in MS. This DC was in the whatever enrichment MS class MCPS came up with as a consolation to the MS magnet lottery.

It gets better in HS, but not by much unless you take an AP class. And MS also does a crappy job preparing kids for the more rigorous AP classes.

People of all ages listen to audiobooks. How is that any different?