NYTimes: College educated workers are leaving DC due to high housing costs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This doesn’t mean they’re moving to the middle of nowhere. Likely places like Philly, Providence, Richmond, Baltimore, Charlotte, Nashville, Pittsburgh and
Columbus that all have some semblance of city amenities like Whole Foods, public transit, “luxury” brand new apartments, walkability and Amtrak stop, but are relatively affordable.

Not just a semblance of a city, but employers. WFH is all but dead. People may be avoiding NYC and SF because of cost, but that doesn't mean they are going rural Montana

Why is WFH dead? DH's marketing company is now permanently hybrid and was 100% in person before. My office job where is making moves to increase from 1 day WFH to two and I hear our central corporate office is basically a ghost town.

It really seems like Hybrid is the wave of the future where and when it can be applied.

I think that will be the norm, but hybrid means that you have to live close enough to actually go in. It makes exurbs more viable because 2 hours once or twice a week may be worth it in exchange for a higher standard of living, but that still closes off a lot of rural America and ties you to a city with a office you can go into

Yup - exurbs and outer suburbs are going to hold their value well in the new hybrid environment. If those spaces are close to any retail (e.g. planned communities or existing towns like Kensington) I think they’ll do particularly well

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My brother gets his DC salary and now lives about an hour outside of Philly. He and his wife bought a 5 BR, 5.5 BA house on a 3 acre lot for under $500k! It also has a MIL/au pair suite, pool, and a detached larger garage (with garage apartment) & attached smaller garage. All of that would easily be $1.5mil or more in this area.

West Chester? Yardley?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I like DC, I want it to be better, but honestly I'm thrilled that more college educated people are moving to smaller towns/cities. More education = more likely to be Democrats; I hope they turn those places blue.

The problem is that being blue is what has turned DC and other great cities into cesspools.

Why move someplace new and try to turn it into the place you left because of bad schools, crime, bad government etc? That’s stupid.

Maybe poor people are the root of those issues and blue policies minus poor people mean great schools, low crime and good government? Look at any rich town in the Hudson Valley, or CT or NJ. At the same time, no amount of great conservative leadership is going to make schools in rural alabama any good

It’s this unfortunately. These resort towns turned year round locales offer the best of everything without the dregs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that this is a good thing and hope that it continues to the point that employers in these overpriced cities - looking at you fed gov - pay enough so that people can stay.

Healthcare worker here - my perception is that fed workers make more plus they get pensions which are unheard of in the private sector world. Is this not true? A coworker recently jumped ship from the hospital to a federal job for these reasons.

It depends. GS workers top out at 183k. Most make a lot less than that. Financial regulators, certain IT classifications, and medical classifications can make a lot more

So at top level positions, people could make more in private sector... but middle level positions, seems Fed pay is better, especially if you get a pension?

The pension isn’t much unless you work for more than 20 years but the retirement healthcare benefits are good.

[Anonymous]

We left because of the crime, homelessness and constant pot smell.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

This is just untrue. I lived in a very rural town that had an organic co-op.

You should get out once in a while.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, housing is expensive in DC, but 2020-2021 was also prime pandemic. Lots of the great things about living in a city were not really that great at the time. With many restrictions at the time and the opening up of telework, a number of people who would have been happy to live in more urban areas in smaller apartments decided to move.

It will be interesting to see if there is a return or increase in 2023 of people moving back now that city amenities are more open and accessible.

That is one way to put it.....

[Anonymous]

Childless single 25 y/o yuppies have different lifestyles than a family of 6 (see the use of the word “we” in this thread). And people thinking homelessness & pot is a dealbreaker when deciding whether to live in the cities. 20 somethings think they’re invincible and don’t care about that, local public schools or museums. They want access to restaurants, bars, clubs and outdoor activities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I like DC, I want it to be better, but honestly I'm thrilled that more college educated people are moving to smaller towns/cities. More education = more likely to be Democrats; I hope they turn those places blue.

The problem is that being blue is what has turned DC and other great cities into cesspools.

Why move someplace new and try to turn it into the place you left because of bad schools, crime, bad government etc? That’s stupid.

All “cities” are blue.

+1 this is true. Every single large metro area in every single state went blue in 2020. Even cities like Lubbock, TX went blue in 2020.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

SHHHHHHH....we do not want the sullied, angry DC masses invading our space in the secret zones........

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, housing is expensive in DC, but 2020-2021 was also prime pandemic. Lots of the great things about living in a city were not really that great at the time. With many restrictions at the time and the opening up of telework, a number of people who would have been happy to live in more urban areas in smaller apartments decided to move.

It will be interesting to see if there is a return or increase in 2023 of people moving back now that city amenities are more open and accessible.

Ding ding ding - this is a big one. And even now, many places are switching to virtual work or hybrid work permanently and we have yet to see the permanent impact of this. We are looking to move out of the city because two parents who didn't work remotely at all now both work for companies that embraced hybrid work. Two of us home together on conference calls in a tiny rowhouse where we don't even have desk space other than our kid's desk isn't cutting it anymore, but was fine pre-pandemic.

But if your work has a hybrid schedule you won't be moving far, right? Maybe just from DC to the suburbs, as opposed to, say, Kansas City. I'm not sure much is lost for the region if college-educated folks move from Logan Circle to McLean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

This is just untrue. I lived in a very rural town that had an organic co-op.

You should get out once in a while.

It’s interesting to read comments where posters think rural areas don’t have organic markets. This must be why these people stay in a city with carjackings, looting etc. They truly don’t understand what other locations have to offer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

This is just untrue. I lived in a very rural town that had an organic co-op.

You should get out once in a while.

It’s interesting to read comments where posters think rural areas don’t have organic markets. This must be why these people stay in a city with carjackings, looting etc. They truly don’t understand what other locations have to offer.

We live car-free. There are not many places where that’s possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

This is just untrue. I lived in a very rural town that had an organic co-op.

You should get out once in a while.

It’s interesting to read comments where posters think rural areas don’t have organic markets. This must be why these people stay in a city with carjackings, looting etc. They truly don’t understand what other locations have to offer.

That is fine. It is not up to us to educate the ignorant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

This is just untrue. I lived in a very rural town that had an organic co-op.

You should get out once in a while.

It’s interesting to read comments where posters think rural areas don’t have organic markets. This must be why these people stay in a city with carjackings, looting etc. They truly don’t understand what other locations have to offer.

It depends on the rural area. You can have rich horse country and you can have Appalachian poverty and everything in between. I have rural family who were excited to get a super Walmart. They do not have organic markets, but they do not care. I have other family living year round near a ski resort that have amenities nicer than most major cities.