NYTimes: College educated workers are leaving DC due to high housing costs

[Anonymous]

I mean, obviously. This is not the DC of the 80s/90s where housing costs were pretty low and increased only incrementally, and people were paid well from the outset. The job market has become much more difficult to navigate AND you have to have tens of thousands of dollars available for a down payment: it’s just not realistic for many.

My mom was able to buy a house for us - as a single mom - in the 90s. Nice Capitol Hill townhouse, and she was an ED of a nonprofit so not exactly raking it in. Not one of the kids I grew up with still live in DC: too expensive. Even people I know who lived in SF and NYC - and being paid a commensurate salary - are fleeing.

Housing prices are out of control. Unfortunately with highly paid remote workers moving to smaller cities and towns, housing prices are only increasing in those locations as well. We are overdue for a reckoning. The market is not a blind, benevolent force. Regulations and policies must be enacted nationally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I mean, obviously. This is not the DC of the 80s/90s where housing costs were pretty low and increased only incrementally, and people were paid well from the outset. The job market has become much more difficult to navigate AND you have to have tens of thousands of dollars available for a down payment: it’s just not realistic for many.

My mom was able to buy a house for us - as a single mom - in the 90s. Nice Capitol Hill townhouse, and she was an ED of a nonprofit so not exactly raking it in. Not one of the kids I grew up with still live in DC: too expensive. Even people I know who lived in SF and NYC - and being paid a commensurate salary - are fleeing.

Housing prices are out of control. Unfortunately with highly paid remote workers moving to smaller cities and towns, housing prices are only increasing in those locations as well. We are overdue for a reckoning. The market is not a blind, benevolent force. Regulations and policies must be enacted nationally.

Do you know what Capitol Hill was like in the 90s? It was not a place to walk outside after dark.

You can’t regulate desirability.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Frankly you’re not missing much by not having these soulless corporate chains nearby. The great thing about a city are its unique offerings.

Right and rural towns have Walmart and thats it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

The article doesn't say that college educated workers are leaving DC for rural areas and suburbs. It says they are leaving DC and environs for other cities.

The people in question want to live in a city, they just want to live in a city they can actually afford. They are not moving to Frederick or La Plata County, Maryland. They are moving to Philadelphia, Denver, Minneapolis, Nashville, etc. -- cities with many of the same amenities as DC but cheaper housing and an overall lower cost of living.

Denver is more expensive than DC now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Frankly you’re not missing much by not having these soulless corporate chains nearby. The great thing about a city are its unique offerings.

This.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

I live in a rural setting and nearly all of that is within 45 minutes - which, where I am, is about 15-20 minutes past the nearest thing.

You live in someplace like Winchester, on the outskirts of a major metro. There just aren’t that many of those stores outside a major metro, except the random Santa Barbara or Vail (or wealthy destination).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean, obviously. This is not the DC of the 80s/90s where housing costs were pretty low and increased only incrementally, and people were paid well from the outset. The job market has become much more difficult to navigate AND you have to have tens of thousands of dollars available for a down payment: it’s just not realistic for many.

My mom was able to buy a house for us - as a single mom - in the 90s. Nice Capitol Hill townhouse, and she was an ED of a nonprofit so not exactly raking it in. Not one of the kids I grew up with still live in DC: too expensive. Even people I know who lived in SF and NYC - and being paid a commensurate salary - are fleeing.

Housing prices are out of control. Unfortunately with highly paid remote workers moving to smaller cities and towns, housing prices are only increasing in those locations as well. We are overdue for a reckoning. The market is not a blind, benevolent force. Regulations and policies must be enacted nationally.

Do you know what Capitol Hill was like in the 90s? It was not a place to walk outside after dark.

You can’t regulate desirability.

I grew up there - it was not that bad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This doesn’t mean they’re moving to the middle of nowhere. Likely places like Philly, Providence, Richmond, Baltimore, Charlotte, Nashville, Pittsburgh and
Columbus that all have some semblance of city amenities like Whole Foods, public transit, “luxury” brand new apartments, walkability and Amtrak stop, but are relatively affordable.

Not just a semblance of a city, but employers. WFH is all but dead. People may be avoiding NYC and SF because of cost, but that doesn't mean they are going rural Montana

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

[Anonymous]

The reality is that these T2 cities now have most of the amenities of larger cities with nicer housing, less traffic and fewer awful people. And for the number of times you actually use the Smithsonian or go to the theater, you can travel to NYC or DC four times a year to see the shows and then GTFO back to a more civilized enclave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This doesn’t mean they’re moving to the middle of nowhere. Likely places like Philly, Providence, Richmond, Baltimore, Charlotte, Nashville, Pittsburgh and
Columbus that all have some semblance of city amenities like Whole Foods, public transit, “luxury” brand new apartments, walkability and Amtrak stop, but are relatively affordable.

Not just a semblance of a city, but employers. WFH is all but dead. People may be avoiding NYC and SF because of cost, but that doesn't mean they are going rural Montana

Why is WFH dead? DH's marketing company is now permanently hybrid and was 100% in person before. My office job where is making moves to increase from 1 day WFH to two and I hear our central corporate office is basically a ghost town.

It really seems like Hybrid is the wave of the future where and when it can be applied.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

I live in New England and towns like Providence, Portsmouth, Burlington, and many others absolutely do. These smaller cities are surrounded by rural towns that are like a 15 minute drive, probably closer/faster than many people in DC are to their local strip mall.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not just cheaper housing. It’s better schools, less crime and fewer homeless people.

Not to mention rural, towns and suburbs have caught up in terms of dining, gyms and other amenities. You no longer need to live in a city for access to these things.

No. I live in a rural town and there is none of the following here or within 90 minutes of me: stores such as Lululemon, Apple, Athleta, Nordstrom, Coach and also Whole Foods, Equinox, Lifetime Fitness, Trader Joe’s, Soulcycle, Justsalad, Sweetgreen and Cava.

Every single one of these things that isn’t edible is available more conveniently online, and my smaller town has a better organic market and much better artisanal restaurants than Sweetgreen and Cava lol.

What smaller town can support an organic market?? This most be a vacation destination. Real rural towns don’t have organic markets, they have a section in Walmart. .

College towns. I live in one and the pandemic fueled population growth is insane.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean, obviously. This is not the DC of the 80s/90s where housing costs were pretty low and increased only incrementally, and people were paid well from the outset. The job market has become much more difficult to navigate AND you have to have tens of thousands of dollars available for a down payment: it’s just not realistic for many.

My mom was able to buy a house for us - as a single mom - in the 90s. Nice Capitol Hill townhouse, and she was an ED of a nonprofit so not exactly raking it in. Not one of the kids I grew up with still live in DC: too expensive. Even people I know who lived in SF and NYC - and being paid a commensurate salary - are fleeing.

Housing prices are out of control. Unfortunately with highly paid remote workers moving to smaller cities and towns, housing prices are only increasing in those locations as well. We are overdue for a reckoning. The market is not a blind, benevolent force. Regulations and policies must be enacted nationally.

Do you know what Capitol Hill was like in the 90s? It was not a place to walk outside after dark.

You can’t regulate desirability.

You are sort of right. I lived in Capitol Hill from 1999-2003, and then moved back in 2011.

CH was pretty rough in spots in the late 90s/early 00s. But definitely more affordable too. You could buy a 3 bedroom rowhouse for 500k. Less if you were willing to live further east (where there was more crime).

2011-2020, prices went up, but crime went down. Tons of families, especially with young kids. H Street got big, Barracks Row got built out, Navy Yard developed and became a boon to the south side of the Hill, even the development of NoMa had a positive impact.

But since 2020, crime has been going up FAST. We live just south of H Street, about midway between Union Station and where it becomes Benning Road. According to crime stats, we've seen a 20% uptick in violent crime just this year. And that's after similar increases last year and the year before. Carjackings, people breaking into cars, shootings and stabbings, etc.

But during this time, prices have gone UP.