Does anyone feel like the current DSM needs urgent updating?

[Anonymous]

The spectrum is so wide that it feels like different issues completely.

My BIL was diagnosed with aspergers many years ago. He has held down a full time job for over a decade, is married to my sister and able to maintain a functional relationship, has hobbies and friends and overall functions fine and independently in life. He definitely has some issues with social cues and social skills and these do pose challenges for him in life but not to the point that he can't have a full life. Of course my sister helps him out and he often avoids big group social situations and he gets anxious about unintentionally offending people or being rude but that is really the extent of his issues. He is a smart guy and lots of people likely just think he is a little socially awkward until they spend a lot of time with him or get to know him well.

Completely different from someone with 'true' autism.

I think this is where the pathologizing of the ends of the spectrum of normal has come into play. The DSM has narrowed what is normal and quirky and awkward and started to diagnose anything that starts to get more than one standard deviation from the mean - whereas maybe in the past, two standards of deviation were still normal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:yeah, that ASD spectrum thing is BS. Always was.
Also, the ADHD+Dyslexia+high IQ is different from just one of the three.
Come to think of it, so is ADHD with a profoundly high IQ.

You know this is done by a committee right? Stupidest way ever to do it too. Really old white men mostly with a few younger (50s) ppl to round it out. I ran the Autism committee (as a staffer) for this last round when they did the spectrum and the disfunction among these ppl was intense. They should not have been allowed to name a child much less a group of disabilities.

Honestly I wish you’d talk to the New York Times or wapo.
The asd is a spectrum bs is the biggest hustle/ ruse in the history of time. It’s utter laziness and they only get away with it bc as a pp pointed out - ‘social deficits’ is so very subjective and basically covers anyone who isn’t George Clooney level of charming

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I have a moderate autism kid.

Talks, but that's it.

I get really annoyed when people tell me their kid is autistic and is attending a normal school without a shadow.

Why? I am no expert but I have substituted in a class specifically for level 1 autism kids and it’s very clear they need additional support but can also handle other classes and don’t need a shadow.

Because some of us have level 2 or 3 kids. My kid wouldn't get into that class

but what is annoying about it, or about parents telling you about it?

Do you honestly not understand?

NP and I don’t. My mom has cancer but I don’t get annoyed when others tell me their mom has a cold. They are both sick but no one thinks our experiences are very similar.

If your mom had pancreatic cancer and someone was complaining nonstop about their precancerous mole … yes you would be annoyed.

If we go with this analogy it is more like your mom has stage 4+ ovarian cancer and someone is complaining about losing their hair with chemo for stage one breast cancer. Both need treatment, one is more tragic.


Or someone who lost a baby 22 weeks vs someone who miscarried at 6 weeks.

There are plenty of things where one person is worse off than another. It should be okay for someone to vent no matter where they are on the spectrum.

Everyone can vent, but hopefully you understand why you shouldn’t cry loudly about your 6 week miscarriage to you friend who just had a 40-week stillbirth. Right? PP wasn’t saying you have no right to be sad or vent. She was explaining how she feels to be grouped with parents who have kids who are virtually NT.

Pp was accusing those parents of 'complaining endlessly' and stated how 'annoyed' she is with them and their kids!

[Anonymous]

Everyone can vent, but hopefully you understand why you shouldn’t cry loudly about your 6 week miscarriage to you friend who just had a 40-week stillbirth. Right? PP wasn’t saying you have no right to be sad or vent. She was explaining how she feels to be grouped with parents who have kids who are virtually NT.

Misery is not a contest to be won.

[Anonymous]

Many diseases, disorders and issues range from mild to severe/profound. I had a basal cancer cell removed. My father died of squamous skin cancer. Both are skin cancers but vastly different outcomes. Breast cancer is similar. My DC has very severe/profound dyslexia but I don’t get bent out of shape when someone whose child has mild dyslexia complains. I empathize with what they are experiencing. It is not a ‘I’ve got it worse contest’.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Everyone can vent, but hopefully you understand why you shouldn’t cry loudly about your 6 week miscarriage to you friend who just had a 40-week stillbirth. Right? PP wasn’t saying you have no right to be sad or vent. She was explaining how she feels to be grouped with parents who have kids who are virtually NT.

Misery is not a contest to be won.

again that’s not the freakin’ point. the point was to understand PP’s POV when faced with parents complaining about their extremely high functioning kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many diseases, disorders and issues range from mild to severe/profound. I had a basal cancer cell removed. My father died of squamous skin cancer. Both are skin cancers but vastly different outcomes. Breast cancer is similar. My DC has very severe/profound dyslexia but I don’t get bent out of shape when someone whose child has mild dyslexia complains. I empathize with what they are experiencing. It is not a ‘I’ve got it worse contest’.

great you’re a perfect being! got any other helpful advice?

[Anonymous]

I don’t see why level of level of severity necessarily means that “mild” autism isn’t still autism. Like somebody who has mild schizophrenia is going to live a completely different life and need much less treatment than somebody who has severe schizophrenia, but both of them have schizophrenia.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Everyone can vent, but hopefully you understand why you shouldn’t cry loudly about your 6 week miscarriage to you friend who just had a 40-week stillbirth. Right? PP wasn’t saying you have no right to be sad or vent. She was explaining how she feels to be grouped with parents who have kids who are virtually NT.

Misery is not a contest to be won.

again that’s not the freakin’ point. the point was to understand PP’s POV when faced with parents complaining about their extremely high functioning kid.

I sympathize but what does that have to do with the DSM? That seems to be more about basic social skills than anything.

[Anonymous]

again that’s not the freakin’ point. the point was to understand PP’s POV when faced with parents complaining about their extremely high functioning kid.

A kid that needs less help at school, but still assaults their parents and attempts to jump out of a fast-moving car, is having marked difficulties. Parents of these kids often find they cannot share their struggles with NT parents because they don’t get it; and now they should shut up on the SN board because other kids have it worse?

[Anonymous]

The reason for changing the dsm is not bc it’s annoying for parents of kids who are more profoundly impacted (even though that is a very valid and important conversation).
The reason to change the dsm is that the spectrum narrative is not helpful if the commonalities between individuals are vastly outweighed by the differences.
The purpose of diagnoses are to support research and create communities of people impacted in certain ways so that therapies and medications may be targeted to their issue. The increasing wideness of the spectrum makes this job much harder

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The reason for changing the dsm is not bc it’s annoying for parents of kids who are more profoundly impacted (even though that is a very valid and important conversation).
The reason to change the dsm is that the spectrum narrative is not helpful if the commonalities between individuals are vastly outweighed by the differences.
The purpose of diagnoses are to support research and create communities of people impacted in certain ways so that therapies and medications may be targeted to their issue. The increasing wideness of the spectrum makes this job much harder

That is not the purpose of the DSM. The DSM can be helpful for that but it is primarily for billing codes.

Also if you bump level 1 autism out of the autism category, you need another diagnosis for it because level 1 autism requires specific therapies too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many diseases, disorders and issues range from mild to severe/profound. I had a basal cancer cell removed. My father died of squamous skin cancer. Both are skin cancers but vastly different outcomes. Breast cancer is similar. My DC has very severe/profound dyslexia but I don’t get bent out of shape when someone whose child has mild dyslexia complains. I empathize with what they are experiencing. It is not a ‘I’ve got it worse contest’.

If you look at your basal cancer cells under a microscope, they would look similar to your father's cancer cells. That's the key feature of cancer, and how you diagnose it. Molecular similarities.

I think many of us with kids on the spectrum -- both ends of the spectrum -- aren't convinced that our children have shared traits at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many diseases, disorders and issues range from mild to severe/profound. I had a basal cancer cell removed. My father died of squamous skin cancer. Both are skin cancers but vastly different outcomes. Breast cancer is similar. My DC has very severe/profound dyslexia but I don’t get bent out of shape when someone whose child has mild dyslexia complains. I empathize with what they are experiencing. It is not a ‘I’ve got it worse contest’.

If you look at your basal cancer cells under a microscope, they would look similar to your father's cancer cells. That's the key feature of cancer, and how you diagnose it. Molecular similarities.

I think many of us with kids on the spectrum -- both ends of the spectrum -- aren't convinced that our children have shared traits at all.

In your first paragraph you're talking about molecular similarities and in the second you're talking about traits, so I don't think you've addressed the argument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t see why level of level of severity necessarily means that “mild” autism isn’t still autism. Like somebody who has mild schizophrenia is going to live a completely different life and need much less treatment than somebody who has severe schizophrenia, but both of them have schizophrenia.

because autism is defined by symptoms. my HFA kid just does not have the same symptoms or the same treatment needs as a severely autistic kid.