Is Johns Hopkins a place for non pre-med students

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:JHU doesn't have a pipeline to finance consulting careers like the other top 25s. But if you child wants research, it's the best school for that.

1000% wrong.

Then you clearly don’t know finance or consulting. It simply is not a target school for Bulge Brackets and MBB. JHU has very little representation in those places.

JHU pumps out grads that actually improve the world, unlike Yale and Harvard that produce scumbags who ruin the country by working for consulting companies making 7 figures to figure out ways to lay people off, or who work on Wall Street and tank the economy while demanding tax payer handouts when their gambling and scams implode.

Please name me JHU grads who are actually improving the world, as you claim, and I'll wait....

Leana Wen
A good number of Nobel Prize Winners

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leana_Wen

She did not go to JHU.

Harvard and Yale have produced 4x and 2x more Nobel Prize winners than JHU...

Stop fooling yourself with the idea that JHU people have a superior moral mission to save the world or it's better than H or Y blah blah blah. It's just a pathetic excuse for JHU's significantly lower caliber of students and graduating alumni, and I say that as an objective fact, so you shouldn't take offense because you know it well but just afraid to admit it.

It's one of the least desired schools in the T10 with a yield rate below 40% and that's with ED - or in the T20, for that matter. Barely a T10 school had it not been COVID-19, US News Rankings and Bloomberg's record-breaking donation, but I doubt it would make a difference.

Your hatred for Hopkins is like 10 standard deviations beyond normal. That leaves it to us to postulate why.

Not PP, but I think JHU boosters are a bit too much too. They just need some reality check.

JHU is similar to UChicago — both are research universities on a more 19th c. German model. They are more focused on academics than on wealth and networking. That distinction interferes with the meritocratic pretension that in the US the richest people/institutions = smartest people/institutions and it’s a drag for status-obsessed students who are compelled to settle for one of the schools (because t10) and then feel like they ended up at a less socially prestigious school and, to add insult to injury, are now forced to work much harder than kids who went to the Ivies or Stanford. (Certain Ivy-obsessed parents then point to that hard work as a sign of the mediocrity (and/or social ineptitude) of the students at the more academics-focused schools).

OTOH, if you are (or have) a kid who loves academics (and who loves cities), both JHU and UofC can be great places to be. But when you point that out (e.g. in discussions like this one), you’re accused of being a delusional booster.

[Anonymous]

I taught at JHU in a non-STEM field. The 5 undergrads I worked most closely with now have careers as a law school prof, Dean of Faculty at an Ivy, activist/lawyer working on juvenile justice (inc LGBTQ+) issues, a fine arts photographer, and a director of research at a major tech company. All have grad degrees.

[Anonymous]

I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

Grad school-wise, Hopkins is a terrific place. Undergrad not so much. Has improved but still lags a little bit behind. PP was just trying to point out how some boosters like to conflate undergrad with overall prestige of the university or with certain programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

Grad school-wise, Hopkins is a terrific place. Undergrad not so much. Has improved but still lags a little bit behind. PP was just trying to point out how some boosters like to conflate undergrad with overall prestige of the university or with certain programs.

On what basis do you think Hopkins undergrad is less “terrific” than its grad schools? Same profs, can take same courses, in most cases it’s the same campus (exceptions are SAIS and med school).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

Grad school-wise, Hopkins is a terrific place. Undergrad not so much. Has improved but still lags a little bit behind. PP was just trying to point out how some boosters like to conflate undergrad with overall prestige of the university or with certain programs.

On what basis do you think Hopkins undergrad is less “terrific” than its grad schools? Same profs, can take same courses, in most cases it’s the same campus (exceptions are SAIS and med school).

Do you have a nonprofessional grad degree? For a PhD you do one on one independent research. Totally different experience than the classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

Grad school-wise, Hopkins is a terrific place. Undergrad not so much. Has improved but still lags a little bit behind. PP was just trying to point out how some boosters like to conflate undergrad with overall prestige of the university or with certain programs.

On what basis do you think Hopkins undergrad is less “terrific” than its grad schools? Same profs, can take same courses, in most cases it’s the same campus (exceptions are SAIS and med school).

Do you have a nonprofessional grad degree? For a PhD you do one on one independent research. Totally different experience than the classroom.

I not only have a PhD, I’ve been a PhD advisor, and have a kid currently in a PhD program and, no, these aren’t necessarily “totally different experience[s]”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

Grad school-wise, Hopkins is a terrific place. Undergrad not so much. Has improved but still lags a little bit behind. PP was just trying to point out how some boosters like to conflate undergrad with overall prestige of the university or with certain programs.

On what basis do you think Hopkins undergrad is less “terrific” than its grad schools? Same profs, can take same courses, in most cases it’s the same campus (exceptions are SAIS and med school).

Student caliber, of course. Makes a whole world of difference. Hopkins' student composition isn't that different from any T10 or T20s but lags most of its peers in terms of outcomes (few prominent alumni from the A&S division), salary, and ROI, despite having an engineering school and all that.

[Anonymous]

Both Hopkins and Chicago are world renowned for particular fields - namely medicine for Hopkins and economics for Chicago.

Neither have the historical social prestige of the Ivies because neither are based in the northeast, the wealthiest, most developed, and most politically powerful region of the country for much of its history.

It's tough to say how much better of an education one would get at Hopkins for non-premed over Cornell/Brown/Dartmouth. However the Ivy tag in and of itself has brand value, even if unjustly, and even more so in the globalized world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

Grad school-wise, Hopkins is a terrific place. Undergrad not so much. Has improved but still lags a little bit behind. PP was just trying to point out how some boosters like to conflate undergrad with overall prestige of the university or with certain programs.

On what basis do you think Hopkins undergrad is less “terrific” than its grad schools? Same profs, can take same courses, in most cases it’s the same campus (exceptions are SAIS and med school).

Student caliber, of course. Makes a whole world of difference. Hopkins' student composition isn't that different from any T10 or T20s but lags most of its peers in terms of outcomes (few prominent alumni from the A&S division), salary, and ROI, despite having an engineering school and all that.

My best Hopkins undergrads were (at least) as smart/capable as our grad students (and we’re comparable to the undergrads I encountered during my undergrad years and as a grad student at 2 different HYPs). HYP undergrads were more self-confident and more affluent than JHU students but not more intelligent or creative or intense. And when you’re at or near the top of your class academically at any of these schools, you don’t really look at other undergrads to set the pace/standards.

[Anonymous]

As a Hopkins grad I want to push the school to do two things:

1. There needs to be a semester long course that’s mandatory to take every year for four years that is a public speaking/schmoozing course. Get Hollywood execs, ex politicians, pr pros/mavens to teach.

We Hopkins grads need a huge cultural mindshift in this space even if we are introverted to know how to confidently carry ourselves in extroverted spaces.

2. Gym/fitness class every semester for all four years. Hopkins can’t change our faces or height but a fitness emphasis would be a positive vibe to the school.

A much larger proliferation of club/intramural sports and mandatory participation should be instituted.

3. Bloomberg should underwrite an endowment to have Hopkins have the best and healthiest campus food bar none in the country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a Hopkins grad I want to push the school to do two things:

1. There needs to be a semester long course that’s mandatory to take every year for four years that is a public speaking/schmoozing course. Get Hollywood execs, ex politicians, pr pros/mavens to teach.

We Hopkins grads need a huge cultural mindshift in this space even if we are introverted to know how to confidently carry ourselves in extroverted spaces.

2. Gym/fitness class every semester for all four years. Hopkins can’t change our faces or height but a fitness emphasis would be a positive vibe to the school.

A much larger proliferation of club/intramural sports and mandatory participation should be instituted.

3. Bloomberg should underwrite an endowment to have Hopkins have the best and healthiest campus food bar none in the country.

It’s a research university — not a country club. Let it be what it does well and if this is the cultural shift you want, look elsewhere. Nothing precludes any JHU student from going to the gym regularly, participating in clubs or sports, developing public speaking skills — if that’s what they’re interested in doing. But such things shouldn’t be a requirement for getting an excellent education.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a Hopkins grad I want to push the school to do two things:

1. There needs to be a semester long course that’s mandatory to take every year for four years that is a public speaking/schmoozing course. Get Hollywood execs, ex politicians, pr pros/mavens to teach.

We Hopkins grads need a huge cultural mindshift in this space even if we are introverted to know how to confidently carry ourselves in extroverted spaces.

2. Gym/fitness class every semester for all four years. Hopkins can’t change our faces or height but a fitness emphasis would be a positive vibe to the school.

A much larger proliferation of club/intramural sports and mandatory participation should be instituted.

3. Bloomberg should underwrite an endowment to have Hopkins have the best and healthiest campus food bar none in the country.

+1. A major culture change is needed if JHU wishes to cement its place in the T10. Crossadmit data, although imperfect, puts JHU at around 15th to 16th place, which is kind of low. With all the new money flowing in, the school needs to market itself to be made more desirable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a Hopkins grad I want to push the school to do two things:

1. There needs to be a semester long course that’s mandatory to take every year for four years that is a public speaking/schmoozing course. Get Hollywood execs, ex politicians, pr pros/mavens to teach.

We Hopkins grads need a huge cultural mindshift in this space even if we are introverted to know how to confidently carry ourselves in extroverted spaces.

2. Gym/fitness class every semester for all four years. Hopkins can’t change our faces or height but a fitness emphasis would be a positive vibe to the school.

A much larger proliferation of club/intramural sports and mandatory participation should be instituted.

3. Bloomberg should underwrite an endowment to have Hopkins have the best and healthiest campus food bar none in the country.

It’s a research university — not a country club. Let it be what it does well and if this is the cultural shift you want, look elsewhere. Nothing precludes any JHU student from going to the gym regularly, participating in clubs or sports, developing public speaking skills — if that’s what they’re interested in doing. But such things shouldn’t be a requirement for getting an excellent education.

An excellent education, in the American sense, is far more well rounded than the continental European model and is why America has produced a slew of globally renowned business leaders and creative geniuses. JHU is well positioned to produce lots of leaders but the school culture is more of an obstacle than an advantage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's just the Ivy obsessed people here that seem to want to downplay Hopkins. I was there for a non-STEM graduate degree. I have no interest in prestige but it amazes me how much street cred Hopkins carries (in and out of my professional field and in general social circles). Someone had mentioned this factor when I was choosing among grad school acceptances and I didn't factor it into my decision, but they were 100% correct. I chose Hopkins over some other programs that were ranked higher for my field....but not enough higher to compensate for tradeoff of financial packages I was offered. I am certain none of those schools would carry the prestige weight I still get for Hopkins.

Grad school-wise, Hopkins is a terrific place. Undergrad not so much. Has improved but still lags a little bit behind. PP was just trying to point out how some boosters like to conflate undergrad with overall prestige of the university or with certain programs.

On what basis do you think Hopkins undergrad is less “terrific” than its grad schools? Same profs, can take same courses, in most cases it’s the same campus (exceptions are SAIS and med school).

Student caliber, of course. Makes a whole world of difference. Hopkins' student composition isn't that different from any T10 or T20s but lags most of its peers in terms of outcomes (few prominent alumni from the A&S division), salary, and ROI, despite having an engineering school and all that.

My best Hopkins undergrads were (at least) as smart/capable as our grad students (and we’re comparable to the undergrads I encountered during my undergrad years and as a grad student at 2 different HYPs). HYP undergrads were more self-confident and more affluent than JHU students but not more intelligent or creative or intense. And when you’re at or near the top of your class academically at any of these schools, you don’t really look at other undergrads to set the pace/standards.

Then explain why JHU is not even top 50 in terms of producing startups, despite being so strong in biosciences and engineering. However, being a major research university, the # of alums who have won the Nobel-prize or top medals in sciences lags most of its peers, too.