St. Andrews: Don't Buy The "Happy Kids" Marketing

[Anonymous]

This is the time of year when parents visit open houses, and at St. Andrew’s Episcopal School they will show you a video claiming their focus is “happy kids.” Don’t fall for it like we did. The school markets itself as a happy and supportive environment but in reality, it's a strict, rigid and traditional religious school concerned more with making kids conform than with educating or supporting them.  Although a few of the newer, younger teachers are supportive and creative, the large majority of teachers and administrators seemed to us chiefly interested in imitating the environment and structure of a traditional New England prep school (think Dead Poets Society).

The administration, in particular, is very uptight and most of the teachers don't seem at all happy or cheerful.  The staff is very focused on making kids conform to the school rules and on kids controlling their bodies, rather than on creating a warm and fun learning environment.  They teach the same material to all students, with absolutely no variation, and they are not equipped to provide individualized instruction or support for students who learn differently or at different speeds.  In the lower grades there are no specialists to provide help with math or reading if needed. Your child either fits in socially and academically, or is ostracized immediately. Administrators will be happy to tell you what’s wrong with your child not “fitting in” but will make little effort to help kids who need more help. There is fairly high student turnover, which helps to explain why the classes are so small. In a homeroom class with fewer than a dozen students, the teacher told us there was “no time” to provide individual support for kids who need it, which makes you wonder what you are paying for.

You are certainly not paying for facilities, at least not in the lower grades. The lower school's playground is bisected by a busy parking lot and the middle school classrooms are very small and boxy. Indeed, the classrooms for Grades 3-5 have the look and feel of temporary “trailer” classrooms that you would find at an overcrowded public school. Resources are simply not devoted to the younger kids. The administration is focused heavily on image and athletics. Leaders spend money on important-looking new logos (you can buy all sorts of ties and sweaters), staff social coordinators to organize fundraisers and golf tournaments, or a new gymnasium complex that will create what they proudly call a “college quadrangle feel.” Yet the intermediate school (right next door to the new gym) doesn’t have a proper library or a well-equipped science room. The intermediate school library is just a converted classroom with some books on trolleys, and the “science room” is another plain classroom with a few experiments stored in plastic bins on shelves. Until last year, the lower school didn’t have a full-time science teacher. And within sight of the expensive new gym and the AstroTurf fields, the third graders have not a single slide or swing to play on at recess. Look at the school’s Twitter feed – you will find information about upper school athletic teams, parties, and fundraisers but much less about education, especially lower or intermediate school education.

If you want tradition, structure, and strict conformity for your child, St. Andrew’s may be a good fit. If you are looking for a school that will support, nurture and foster a love of learning in your child (especially a child in elementary school), look elsewhere.

[Anonymous]

Where have you decided to send your kid next?

(Truly, not a snarky question. I'm looking for a school that markets itself as open to different kinds of learners, and I had thought St. Andrews would fit)

[Anonymous]

Schools are so individual. I'm at a different private school and we have close friends who were very disappointed and unhappy with the school and left. I think of us as similar couples, but they hated it, we love it. Everyone's needs are different.

[Anonymous]

Harbor School is much better for different kinds of learners, and so is McLean. Frankly public school would be better for kids who learn differently than St. Andrew's.

[Anonymous]

I may be off base here, but I get a slight vibe that OP is suggesting his/her child might have some mild special needs: the discussion of controlling bodies, learning differently, fitting in, individual support.

If so, this is a typical, but brutal, pattern. Parents who have an inkling of what their kids will need tend to seek out environments they think will be nurturing, and are hopeful that their kids will thrive. Private schools have clear lines about what they are willing or not willing to accommodate, and are on high alert for kids who will need more than that, and counsel them out.

Like I said, I may be way off base.

[Anonymous]

I thought St. Andrews IS a school that caters to kids with some special needs. In that case, wouldn't parents rightly expect accommodation for these needs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I thought St. Andrews IS a school that caters to kids with some special needs. In that case, wouldn't parents rightly expect accommodation for these needs?

Or one year they admitted a couple kids with mild SN. But that doesn't mean they 'cater' to them or want that moniker.

St Andrews is not Commonwealth Academy or Siena. They are a mainstream private.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I may be off base here, but I get a slight vibe that OP is suggesting his/her child might have some mild special needs: the discussion of controlling bodies, learning differently, fitting in, individual support.

If so, this is a typical, but brutal, pattern. Parents who have an inkling of what their kids will need tend to seek out environments they think will be nurturing, and are hopeful that their kids will thrive. Private schools have clear lines about what they are willing or not willing to accommodate, and are on high alert for kids who will need more than that, and counsel them out.

Like I said, I may be way off base.

That's the vibe I was getting as well.

Unfortunately, all too often parents fall into the trap of "he/she just needs a small, nurturing environment to "thrive""

[Anonymous]

OP, is your experience mainly with the lower school? Anyone have comments about the upper school environment?

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry the OP had this experience. I would add that it is very important to be skeptical of all private school marketing. This is not to say that many private schools aren't wonderful environments, but tours and open houses are advertisements for luxury goods that are designed to play off of parents' deepest hopes and fears for their children. Who doesn't want their child to be happy and successful? We should not be surprised that school marketing focuses on students' happiness and success. Marketing also always showcases diverse faces, even though the school itself may not be very diverse. Ask the more practical and specific questions that are relevant to your child. Don't be satisfied with answers like "we strive to meet everyone's needs" or "we understand the whole child." You need specifics.

[Anonymous]

This was my experience too. They have this Center for Learning that they set up with Hopkins and they market that they can handle different types of learners, but it's not true. They are VERY mainstream.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is the time of year when parents visit open houses, and at St. Andrew’s Episcopal School they will show you a video claiming their focus is “happy kids.” Don’t fall for it like we did. The school markets itself as a happy and supportive environment but in reality, it's a strict, rigid and traditional religious school concerned more with making kids conform than with educating or supporting them.  Although a few of the newer, younger teachers are supportive and creative, the large majority of teachers and administrators seemed to us chiefly interested in imitating the environment and structure of a traditional New England prep school (think Dead Poets Society).

The administration, in particular, is very uptight and most of the teachers don't seem at all happy or cheerful.  The staff is very focused on making kids conform to the school rules and on kids controlling their bodies, rather than on creating a warm and fun learning environment.  They teach the same material to all students, with absolutely no variation, and they are not equipped to provide individualized instruction or support for students who learn differently or at different speeds.  In the lower grades there are no specialists to provide help with math or reading if needed. Your child either fits in socially and academically, or is ostracized immediately. Administrators will be happy to tell you what’s wrong with your child not “fitting in” but will make little effort to help kids who need more help. There is fairly high student turnover, which helps to explain why the classes are so small. In a homeroom class with fewer than a dozen students, the teacher told us there was “no time” to provide individual support for kids who need it, which makes you wonder what you are paying for.

You are certainly not paying for facilities, at least not in the lower grades. The lower school's playground is bisected by a busy parking lot and the middle school classrooms are very small and boxy. Indeed, the classrooms for Grades 3-5 have the look and feel of temporary “trailer” classrooms that you would find at an overcrowded public school. Resources are simply not devoted to the younger kids. The administration is focused heavily on image and athletics. Leaders spend money on important-looking new logos (you can buy all sorts of ties and sweaters), staff social coordinators to organize fundraisers and golf tournaments, or a new gymnasium complex that will create what they proudly call a “college quadrangle feel.” Yet the intermediate school (right next door to the new gym) doesn’t have a proper library or a well-equipped science room. The intermediate school library is just a converted classroom with some books on trolleys, and the “science room” is another plain classroom with a few experiments stored in plastic bins on shelves. Until last year, the lower school didn’t have a full-time science teacher. And within sight of the expensive new gym and the AstroTurf fields, the third graders have not a single slide or swing to play on at recess. Look at the school’s Twitter feed – you will find information about upper school athletic teams, parties, and fundraisers but much less about education, especially lower or intermediate school education.

If you want tradition, structure, and strict conformity for your child, St. Andrew’s may be a good fit. If you are looking for a school that will support, nurture and foster a love of learning in your child (especially a child in elementary school), look elsewhere.

Curious if others have found this bolded quote to be true at all levels of the school? Interested in how they integrate into the Upper School as we are looking for next year.

[Anonymous]

We're the parents of a very happy Lower Schooler. I'm so sorry if that hasn't been her experience. I know that the school accommodates some learning differences, the way that most private schools do. But I don't think they pretend to offer the same services as Lab or Mclean or others. If your child needs those services, then yes, this isn't the right fit.

The outdoor facilities and library in the Lower School seem suitable for our preschool to 2nd grade age group. We like the smaller scale of the village campus. DC has the most amazing science teacher, and a kind of makerspace classroom and art studio. DC has made what we're sure will be life-long friends, and her teachers are very caring.

After a recent visit to the big campus, we're looking forward to being there. It's nice that the Intermediate School is in its own building -- but has access to the amazing new facilities of that campus. Seriously, not enough space to play? The playscape itself may not be huge, but don't the kids have access to the new gyms, studios, 4 turf fields, etc? I don't get it.

[Anonymous]

Our children have attended three different K-12 independent schools in the area, and I agree completely that parents of prospective students should look beyond the marketing efforts that all independent schools engage in. So, in addition to viewing websites and attending open house events, it's a good idea to talk to parents of currently-enrolled students and alumni. In that vein, I can offer my perspective as a parent of a current St. Andrew's student. Our daughter entered St. Andrew's in middle school and is now in the upper school, so I can't comment at all on the lower school, but we've been very pleased with the middle school and upper school.

Overall, we have been impressed by the quality and creativity of teaching at St. Andrew's. Our daughter's teachers have encouraged her to stretch and challenge herself. As a result, she has grown as a student, taking intellectual risks, developing strong academic skills, and becoming ever more confident in her ability to learn and meet her goals. We have found the vast majority of teachers, coaches and administrators to be friendly and warm in their manner, both toward students and parents.

Outside the classroom, the social vibe in the middle and upper school tends to be pretty much one of coexistence, rather than cliquishness or competitiveness. For our daughter, this works, Since entering the middle school, she has made a really nice and supportive group of friends. In addition, she plays two varsity sports and enjoys the camaraderie among her teammates.

St. Andrew's is traditional in some ways, though, in fairness it should be noted that the school doesn't hide these aspects at all. Most notably, there is a dress code, which wasn't really a draw for our family, but neither is it something we have found to be intrusive or oppressive. There is also weekly chapel, which is grounded in the Episcopal church's strong value of inclusiveness and love for all our neighbors.

I'm not one to gush -- I feel like superlatives are often overused when parents talk about schools, so I won't say St. Andrew's is amazing or fabulous or wonderful, but I will say that our daughter is happy at St. Andrew's -- and that means a lot to us.

[Anonymous]

Unfortunately, all too often parents fall into the trap of "he/she just needs a small, nurturing environment to "thrive""

This. And the corollary is the schools that supports "different kinds of learners." "But not too different."