Disappointment

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Anyone else facing a lot of disappointment during this cycle? DD got into a couple target schools + most of her safeties... Rejected or WL from the rest. She was (imo and told to us by many others) a great applicant - High stats, great ECs + essays, LORs... Her interviews all went very well, especially JHU. She applied to JHU EA and the rest RD, and we're from NOVA. Intended major is BME (biomed engineering).

Stats:
4.0 UW/4.7 W GPA
1570 SAT (800 M, 770 R&W)
14 APs, all 5s

ECs:
- A few regional awards (STEM)
- 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
- Founder of non-profit
- Research w/ prof at T30
- Competitive summer program for BME
- Lots of community service

Results:
JHU EA - Deferred -> Rejected
Princeton - Rejected
Brown - Rejected
Dartmouth - Rejected
Columbia - Rejected
Duke - Rejected
UVA - WL
Cornell - WL
CMU - WL
UNC CH - WL
VT - Accepted
W&M - Accepted
Lehigh - Accepted
UPitt - Accepted

DD is incredibly upset and so are we... JHU was her dream school but she relied on UVA + CMU as well. Anyone here confused and facing a similar situation? We all were convinced that DD had it in the bag - Worst of all is that many of her classmates w/ lower stats and worse ECs have gotten into a few of these schools.

Your DD sounds amazing to me. So amazing that I can see why a lot of people on this forum thought you were a troll and these admission results are fake. You must be so proud of her. She will do great and have a great time no matter where she decides to go.

OP here, thank you! She has worked so hard these past 4 years, it really makes me upset that she feels she isn't good enough because of the decisions - It's hard to get her to stop comparing herself to her peers who made it into some of these schools.

It’s especially hard when you keep doing the same thing.

How am I comparing her? By saying that I feel it's unfair that many of her peers who put less effort got into some of these schools?

I understand your frustration, as I posted earlier your daughter has a wonderful academic profile and she will do great wherever she ends up. But be careful with comparisons and comments of "unfair" because you don't really know and neither does your daughter even though she may believe that she does.

We had a typical 'sports kid' at my daughter's school last year; cheerful, well liked, and captain of the volleyball team for her junior and senior year. People knew that she did well in school but she wasn't obviously standing out. She would have been on nobody'd RADAR for a top school unless it was to play volleyball. Senior year rolled around and:

She was named as an NMSF. The kids in her AP classes were shocked because she was a 'sports kid' and many of them actually questioned that she belonged in the AP classes
She was named the schools 'Scholar Athlete' for the year. None of the 'sports kids' ever imagined that she would have a 4.6 GPA and neither did her coach
She was an AP Scholar with distinction because she had 12APs with all 4 and 5s as far as I know.
It turned out that she also had probably 600 hours volunteering at a local hospital (and she's not premed) and another 200 or so hours at the local foodbank.

I only know this because she is my kids best friend but it is a quick illustration as to why people need to be careful with the "unfair, people with lesser stats got the spot" comments. Most of the time there is something that you just don't know.

Totally agree with this. In some cases, its actually by design that you don't know what the real story is with another kid. At out private, there are some maniac parents who are willing to bring others down to elevate their own kids. These people are to be feared during college applications. For all the EC's that my kid was doing outside of school, he was very, very quiet about it. No one realized the full extent of it until very recently. He was able to stay off the radar for the duration.

Your kid is literally hiding ECs for a leg up on admissions. You are exactly the type of parent we are talking about.

No---they are not openly bragging to everyone about their ECs outside of school because they know parents and other students will be nasty and malicious. How does it harm your kid and you if my kid has national level ECs or State level ECs that they are the best at and you don't know about it? Just how the heck does that harm you or your kid? (I'll just wait)

DP here. It's cute that you think you are different from the "maniac" parents at your private. You are not.

My kids attended a public HS (I'm not that PP). What any kid does outside of school (or in school academically) is really none of your business or your kid's business. If my kid wants to spend 15 hours each weekend working as a CNA (or volunteering at a nursing home and doing actual work) from time they are old enough, nobody needs to advertise that to you. Same if my kid wants to spend 5 hours a day practicing piano and becoming one of the best players in the USA by end of HS. It's literally none of your business. They are not hiding anything, they are just pursuing their passions. And unless you are their friend, you have no interest in knowing


I'm sorry that you are so maniac that your kid doesn't have any passions, unless they check your boxes for "how to get into an Ivy"

+1000. What my kid (or any kid) is doing outside of school is their own business. We told our kids early in life that their biggest competition was themselves - so out and win every day versus who you were yesterday and something good will happen in the end.

It's still going completely over both of your heads. No one GAF what your kids are doing in their free time. What's "maniac" about it is that you thing you are somehow above the tiger parents you have so much disdain for. You are not better than them. You ARE them.

You can keep repeating the same tropes all day long if it make you feel better. All I know is my kid quietly kicked ass on what he cared deeply about and is now headed for Harvard in the fall. I hope your find tranquility in your path at some point. Everyone's going to be fine in the end.

+1
That PP is furious that she didn't know certain kids quietly do great ECs outside of school (many having done them before high school even rolled around). THOSE are the special kids - and she can't stand it.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

If the kids wants a vocational path, then yes. We need to step back and allow them to take that path, starting 8/9th grade. But no we shouldn't force kids onto that path based on their test scores on one or two days.
But yes, if a kid wants to be a plumber, then don't require 2-3 years of Spanish and Pre-Calc. Let them take thru Alg2 and let them take Vocational courses for half the day and by junior senior year let them start training for specifics (if they want).
But do not force kids down that path. If you offer it, most who are "not college material" will select it.

Yes we should force them down that path. It’s a waste of time and resources to try and prepare kids for college who don’t have the chops to be there. And yes you can know who they are on the basis of testing.

Great, you "force" your kids down that path. I'll let mine have the time they need to develop and express what interests them. What a totally idiotic take.
DP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else facing a lot of disappointment during this cycle? DD got into a couple target schools + most of her safeties... Rejected or WL from the rest. She was (imo and told to us by many others) a great applicant - High stats, great ECs + essays, LORs... Her interviews all went very well, especially JHU. She applied to JHU EA and the rest RD, and we're from NOVA. Intended major is BME (biomed engineering).

Stats:
4.0 UW/4.7 W GPA
1570 SAT (800 M, 770 R&W)
14 APs, all 5s

ECs:
- A few regional awards (STEM)
- 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
- Founder of non-profit
- Research w/ prof at T30
- Competitive summer program for BME
- Lots of community service

Results:
JHU EA - Deferred -> Rejected
Princeton - Rejected
Brown - Rejected
Dartmouth - Rejected
Columbia - Rejected
Duke - Rejected
UVA - WL
Cornell - WL
CMU - WL
UNC CH - WL
VT - Accepted
W&M - Accepted
Lehigh - Accepted
UPitt - Accepted

DD is incredibly upset and so are we... JHU was her dream school but she relied on UVA + CMU as well. Anyone here confused and facing a similar situation?We all were convinced that DD had it in the bag - Worst of all is that many of her classmates w/ lower stats and worse ECs have gotten into a few of these schools.

Your DD sounds amazing to me. So amazing that I can see why a lot of people on this forum thought you were a troll and these admission results are fake. You must be so proud of her. She will do great and have a great time no matter where she decides to go.

OP here, thank you! She has worked so hard these past 4 years, it really makes me upset that she feels she isn't good enough because of the decisions - It's hard to get her to stop comparing herself to her peers who made it into some of these schools.

It’s especially hard when you keep doing the same thing.

How am I comparing her? By saying that I feel it's unfair that many of her peers who put less effort got into some of these schools?

Yes, exactly.

In your OP: “Worst of all is that many of her classmates w/ lower stats and worse ECs have gotten into a few of these schools.”

From the jump, you are comparing her to her classmates and saying how much less deserving they are.

How do you think she is going to get past that if you keep doing it?

+100
That whole opening rant was disgusting. No doubt the OP and her daughter sit around and discuss how much "better" she thinks she is. Meanwhile, she got into great schools and is still upset. Cry me a river.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

If the kids wants a vocational path, then yes. We need to step back and allow them to take that path, starting 8/9th grade. But no we shouldn't force kids onto that path based on their test scores on one or two days.
But yes, if a kid wants to be a plumber, then don't require 2-3 years of Spanish and Pre-Calc. Let them take thru Alg2 and let them take Vocational courses for half the day and by junior senior year let them start training for specifics (if they want).
But do not force kids down that path. If you offer it, most who are "not college material" will select it.

Yes we should force them down that path. It’s a waste of time and resources to try and prepare kids for college who don’t have the chops to be there. And yes you can know who they are on the basis of testing.

And yes, you are an idiot!

Amen to that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

Could not agree more. Open enrollment in Honors and AP classes at our public HS has been an unmitigated disaster for the kids who actually deserve to be there. Tons of kids are literally flunking. It should not even be possible to flunk an AP class. It means someone screwed up somewhere.

Yes, I agree open enrollment into AP courses should not be allowed. Kids should be required to at minimum get a B or better in the honors/honor equivalent course the prior year or an B+ or better in a regular course. But many do allow open enrollment because it means less work for the overworked staff and teachers, it means they don't have to deal with nasty pushy parents who want "my kid belongs in AP X or Honors X, I don't care that they got a C in regular X this year" This way with open enrollment, any failures are totally on the parents/student.

DP. I completely disagree. How does someone else's kid potentially doing badly in an AP affect you or your kid? EVERY student should have the opportunity to excel, and most do. And if they do badly or fail, then it is indeed on them/their parents - no one else is affected.

Except the rest of the students in an AP class where the teacher is spending way too much time trying to help those failing kids. What a waste of everyone’s time, including the kids who could be learning a lot more in a class appropriate for their level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public or Private HS?

These items are a dime a dozen and not needed. Ie mean nothing on an application.
Founder of non-profit
- Research w/ prof at T30
- Competitive summer program for BME
- Lots of community service

Regional Stem awards got her into the schools she was accepted at and her stats. Most of those schools are data schools ie SAT/GPA.

I am sorry OP but honestly your kid got in where they should be going. They will do well at any of their choices.

Pitt is the place they belong or VT.

You did not prepare your kid to be realistic

So the kids who got in to the higher ranked schools with lesser stats are not going where they should be going? I mean, if OP's kid isn't qualified....

DP. Again: how on earth would you know what their stats are?? Perhaps their stats are BETTER than the OP's kid. They clearly have something more appealing, whether it's their stats, their ECs, their essays, their LOCs...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

Could not agree more. Open enrollment in Honors and AP classes at our public HS has been an unmitigated disaster for the kids who actually deserve to be there. Tons of kids are literally flunking. It should not even be possible to flunk an AP class. It means someone screwed up somewhere.

Yes, I agree open enrollment into AP courses should not be allowed. Kids should be required to at minimum get a B or better in the honors/honor equivalent course the prior year or an B+ or better in a regular course. But many do allow open enrollment because it means less work for the overworked staff and teachers, it means they don't have to deal with nasty pushy parents who want "my kid belongs in AP X or Honors X, I don't care that they got a C in regular X this year" This way with open enrollment, any failures are totally on the parents/student.

DP. I completely disagree. How does someone else's kid potentially doing badly in an AP affect you or your kid? EVERY student should have the opportunity to excel, and most do. And if they do badly or fail, then it is indeed on them/their parents - no one else is affected.

Except the rest of the students in an AP class where the teacher is spending way too much time trying to help those failing kids. What a waste of everyone’s time, including the kids who could be learning a lot more in a class appropriate for their level.

That doesn't happen in high school. In AP classes, all kids are expected to keep up. If they don't, the teacher will counsel them to drop down a level. What you're describing is an elementary school situation.

[Anonymous]

What we learn from this thread:
1. Half of DCUM are realists.
2. The other half are not. They believe they have Ivies/JHU/CMU/UNC oos in the bag. They believe their kids are special and cannot fathom why Princeton would not admit them. They don't understand that if they apply to 10 schools/program where the admit rate is 4%, then the probability of getting admitted to "at least one" is still only 33.5%. i e., there is a 72.5% CHANCE OF GETTIGNG REJECTED FROM ALL OF THEM. Then they get angry with those pointing out facts and want to key their Teslas.

[Anonymous]

*66.5% chance of getting rejected from all of them

[Anonymous]

The OP is right to be disappointed, people should not pile on her so gratuitously.

Taking 14 APs puts her child in the top 5000 in the nation, likely top 100-1000 because she scored all 5s in the exams.

SAT 1570 is top 1%, maybe not as impressive but at least it checks the box.

No major red flags for the GPA since it was 4.0

I wouldn’t say admission to a selective school was in the bag, but she was competitive. Extracurriculars were not that notable but still, absent major red flags in the application it should have resulted in admissions to a more selective college. That doesn’t mean other kids were not deserving.

I agree it’s not the end of the world and the OP and her child should move on and do her best at the college she’s in.

[Anonymous]

OP, you complain that she is disappointed w/ UVA WL, yet you then repeatedly defend applying RD instead of EA because she wasn't that interested. Well, you shouldn't be surprised because clearly, it showed! Both in the RD choice, possibly in her demonstrated interest and likely her app itself. UVA is not a target. Your counselor misled you.
Also, she has 1 likely school on her list. Why? She also only has 2 targets, and VT for ENGR is potentially a hard target.
She did not apply wisely. I also suspect that her app could have better conveyed what she had to offer.
Pitt and VT are good choices. And Pitt should give her 20k of automatic merit. Get another counselor to help her w/ LOCIs, then invest in admitted students' days for what she's got in hand and psych her up for those.
Stop comparing to kids who got in. You really don't know what they bring to the table (or how well their app conveyed that).
-Independent Counselor

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

Could not agree more. Open enrollment in Honors and AP classes at our public HS has been an unmitigated disaster for the kids who actually deserve to be there. Tons of kids are literally flunking. It should not even be possible to flunk an AP class. It means someone screwed up somewhere.

Yes, I agree open enrollment into AP courses should not be allowed. Kids should be required to at minimum get a B or better in the honors/honor equivalent course the prior year or an B+ or better in a regular course. But many do allow open enrollment because it means less work for the overworked staff and teachers, it means they don't have to deal with nasty pushy parents who want "my kid belongs in AP X or Honors X, I don't care that they got a C in regular X this year" This way with open enrollment, any failures are totally on the parents/student.

DP. I completely disagree. How does someone else's kid potentially doing badly in an AP affect you or your kid? EVERY student should have the opportunity to excel, and most do. And if they do badly or fail, then it is indeed on them/their parents - no one else is affected.

Except the rest of the students in an AP class where the teacher is spending way too much time trying to help those failing kids. What a waste of everyone’s time, including the kids who could be learning a lot more in a class appropriate for their level.

That doesn't happen in high school. In AP classes, all kids are expected to keep up. If they don't, the teacher will counsel them to drop down a level. What you're describing is an elementary school situation.

Shows what you (don’t) know about the current state of AP and honors in public HSs in the area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I smell a 🧌

Do you think her profile is too "basic"? She says she regrets not picking more creative ECs, although I think her ECs were perfectly suited for her major + demonstrated her passion.

Yeah, I agree there is nothing that stands out in her ECs.

ECs:
not impressive: - A few regional awards (STEM)
Actually good: - 200+ volunteer hours @ local hospital
everyone has one: - Founder of non-profit
this year AOs don't like research for some reason: - Research w/ prof at T30
everyone has one: - Competitive summer program for BME
everyone has this: - Lots of community service

This year I heard Stanford retracted an acceptance because the applicant lied about volunteer hours.
Are those 200 volunteer hours @ local hospital registered with the school?

Yes, she made sure that everything was registered. I'm assuming the more "basic" ECs were the factor harming her application?

No, it's just a bizarre system that makes kids do these things. In other countries kids don't have to do these admissions acrobatics.

No, other countries instead track kids around age 11/12 (or earlier). You are tracked at this age, based on a one day test. Do well, you can be on tract for pre-med/stem/engineering. Do okay, and you can focus on humanities and social sciences (non stem), do worse, and you won't be tracked for much college at all. And without $$$$$$ it is damn near impossible to get off those tracks.
So yeah, I 1000% prefer what we have, where a kid can grow academically after 5th/6th grade and still decide to be an engineer or a doctor after age 12.

Nah. You can pretty much tell where a kid should be by the end of 6th grade. Pretending that kids can “grow” after that is a waste of everyone’s time and of public resources.

This is so un-American!
I am an immigrant from Asia. What attracts us so much about America is precisely that, as long as you work hard, you always have another opportunity.
Tiger parents often pushed kids hard in their childhood, then the kids lost motivation once they left home.

America doesn’t do everything right. The education system is a perfect example of this! It is a huge waste of time, money, and effort to try and get every kid to go to college. Many kids should be put on a vocational track in high school, as many countries do.

Could not agree more. Open enrollment in Honors and AP classes at our public HS has been an unmitigated disaster for the kids who actually deserve to be there. Tons of kids are literally flunking. It should not even be possible to flunk an AP class. It means someone screwed up somewhere.

Yes, I agree open enrollment into AP courses should not be allowed. Kids should be required to at minimum get a B or better in the honors/honor equivalent course the prior year or an B+ or better in a regular course. But many do allow open enrollment because it means less work for the overworked staff and teachers, it means they don't have to deal with nasty pushy parents who want "my kid belongs in AP X or Honors X, I don't care that they got a C in regular X this year" This way with open enrollment, any failures are totally on the parents/student.

DP. I completely disagree. How does someone else's kid potentially doing badly in an AP affect you or your kid? EVERY student should have the opportunity to excel, and most do. And if they do badly or fail, then it is indeed on them/their parents - no one else is affected.

Except the rest of the students in an AP class where the teacher is spending way too much time trying to help those failing kids. What a waste of everyone’s time, including the kids who could be learning a lot more in a class appropriate for their level.

That doesn't happen in high school. In AP classes, all kids are expected to keep up. If they don't, the teacher will counsel them to drop down a level. What you're describing is an elementary school situation.

From an actual APUSH teacher in an open enrollment high school classroom, not elementary:

Any attempt to have reading or proper homework assignments done is typically met with massive failures. Because of this, I can't get through material as fast as I would like, and we only get up to barely talking about the Cold War when it's already exam time.

Do you really think that kids who can’t keep up aren’t going to affect teacher workload and the pace of the class, especially if there are several of these kids in the class? Pressure on the teacher from admin and parents can be brutal.

[Anonymous]

- Your DD should have applied ED1 to JHU. That would have increased her chances to get in. A good counselor would have insisted upon that if DD had her heart set on going there.

- I wonder what story your DD told in her essays. What impact did she have in her ECs? What did they teach her? What is she passionate about? What do you think her teachers said about her?

- What was DD’s approximate class rank? I know she had a 4.0UW, but were there others with 4.0UW/4.9W? Wondering if AOs judged her against kids who took more honors/AP classes and had higher GPAs.

Anyways, like others have said, it’s time to find closure and move on to the acceptances. Best of luck to your DD. She sounds like she is super intelligent and has an amazing work ethic, so she will thrive wherever she ends up!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, there are so many applicants out there with stats better than your DD’s still get rejected from T20s. These kids will often have a competitive sport w national appoints/standing or an outstanding musical talent in addition to everything on your DD’s list. It is naive for you to be so sure of your DD’s chance during these crazy admission cycles. You are doing your DD a disservice by not helping her set the right expectation going into the admission roulette.

Do your DD a favor by being excited about the schools who appreciate her talent. Do your homework with her on which one offers the best fit!!!

And almost all of those kids are Asian students.