Now That Iran Has Retaliated Against Israel?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

DP.

So you're seriously arguing that Israelis and Palestinians can live together peacefully in a single state?

There's been some wild stuff in this thread, but this might be the silliest single post in all 2,847 pages.

Haha! First principle here is that Zionism in its current form has a short future. If you think that keeping up Zionism’s hostility to peace helps you, please don’t be surprised when it blows up in your face. Zionism has depended upon American largesse which end abruptly when our gerontocracy dies.

Bye bye bigots!!!

So you are NOT arguing that Palestinians and Israelis can live peacefully together in a single state.

You're actually arguing that Israel will cease to exist once older Americans die.

Which you celebrate.

In other words, "Death to Israel (and grandpa)!"

Brilliant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

Is it retaliation when you were the instigator? Why didn’t Israel bomb Iran directly? Why Syria? The US and UK mitigated the onslaught from Iran (Did Iran even really think they would get anywhere, they had to do something to save face) Like a parent breaking up a fight between the golden child and black sheep sibling.

Without the US and Iran’s restraint Israel would be burning right now. The Iranians gave 24 hours notice, lunched very small amount of slow moving drones and missiles, no ballistic missiles, no coordinated with hezbollah, using older technologies(the new generation of Iran missiles are much better because of Russia), short duration(a few hours, nots days), etc. Israel Air Force is not big and this raid stress them to the max. 310 combat aircraft out of 14 airbases. Without US intelligence Israel’s planes would not have made the intercepts.

This really shocked the Israelis. It could have been much worst and still going today. Though I do not think the Israelis will learn their lesson till something major happens in Israel.

THIS 1000x is right. Without the US stating clearly Israel's next aggressive move v Iran would not be supported, they would have wanted to escalate because that's Bibi for you - he's a warmonger and so torn up by hate that all he wants to do is fight and kill anyone not Jewish. Without the military and financial backing them, Israel is severely limited in their actions. The plight of Gaza - all the suffering and needless killing and of INNOCENT (NOT HAMAS) lives are squarely in the blame of American government who supported and funded this. Absolutely 100%. Bibi cannot do anything on his own on a massive scale without backing - it's not logistically possible for them to do this much damage totally on their own.

I think Iran played their hand well. They had to do something and what they did was clever in that they got their "revenge" but they went a step to "escalate" knowing full well that the tactic was never going to get them in too much trouble given that what they did wasn't all that. They politically and militarily tested Israel/US in forcing Biden's hand to not offer additional support to Israel by seemingly giving the illusion that they went full force at Israel (to anyone who really knows what is going on they totally did not). They did get their "revenge" in a sense because they got the last word in. Israel can't "save face" and do much at this point as a next step v Iran while the whole world watches.

I think/hope that Israel will be escalating down in various respects given that US has made clear there are limits to what we will do. I think this should have all taken place way earlier but politically, I don't think Biden had a choice given how many American Jews in power there are not to mention in his own cabinet, wanting revenge for 10/7 of some sort. But it's out of control at this point and Biden should have recognized this much sooner than now. He really messed up here as a leader.

What are you even babbling about?
Biden messed up? Get out of here with that garbage. This administration has done an excellent job of juggling a dozen opposing interests while holding off a third world war, despite every despot on the planet making a move to destroy democracy in the last 4 years.

This sort of brain-dead paean to Biden comes from too much credulity in reading WaPo or listening to NPR. The reality is that he’s been a perfect example of how the Democrats of recent decades are nearly as problematic as the Republicans. Amplifying a Mideast War after all the other Mideast debacles? Biden has learned nothing!

There are no good options when dealing with religious zealots. You’re not getting Middle East peace. Biden has done the only doable thing, and kept in from boiling over. Grow up.

Lol! Thinking 1) we’ve explored all our options and 2) all we are dealing with are “religious extremists” is just silly. And you consider that to be conclusive that Biden, while supporting a genocide, is doing the best possible? If anyone here needs to grow up, it’s you!

ASD?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

DP.

So you're seriously arguing that Israelis and Palestinians can live together peacefully in a single state?

There's been some wild stuff in this thread, but this might be the silliest single post in all 2,847 pages.

Of all the hypocrisy and logical pretzels in the Israel/Palestine conflict, one of the choice bits is the pretend relationship Israel has with the Palestinians. It goes something like this:

Israelis and Palestinians cannot possibly live together! They will exterminate us! They hate us!

But:

We are a tolerant multinational state. We have Arabs! Look, over here! Here are our Arabs! They are just like us! They work, play, get elected, we have, like, Arab judges! They are like LOYAL.

But:

Let's make sure we have just enough and not too many of them. Because, you know, Arabs. Who knows. Let's make sure they can only marry their own and let's not allow them to bring Arab spouses from outside. Because, you know, Arabs. Mustn't have too many or something terrible might happen! And let's take every opportunity to remind them this is JEWISH state, yo. Don't get ideas about being equal or something.

But:

We are a democracy! With protections and equal rights! We have Arabs, look! But we can't really be expected to live peacefully next to them. Well not to THEM, to different kind of Arab. You know, the bad ones. Because Arabs hate the Jews! Except we have Arabs and therefore are tolerant. You know?

It's a beauty.

[Anonymous]

But - he should have given his ultimatum earlier to Bibi. He waited until too many innocents were massacred. Agreed that he's in between hard choices and yes he has to support Israel but just like he said no more v Iran he should have absolutely said no to them crushing Gaza weeks ago. After you murder innocents like 5k - that ought to be a sign but to wait till more than 30k killed - Biden deserves to lose this election.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But - he should have given his ultimatum earlier to Bibi. He waited until too many innocents were massacred. Agreed that he's in between hard choices and yes he has to support Israel but just like he said no more v Iran he should have absolutely said no to them crushing Gaza weeks ago. After you murder innocents like 5k - that ought to be a sign but to wait till more than 30k killed - Biden deserves to lose this election.

But he’s not.
He’s the best option. He’s the only serious option.
We don’t have any other options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

This is a hoot! The Israelis couldn’t tell the truth about being outsmarted on Oct 7th, why would they admit damage to their bases? Those bases were the real target. And the real message, which is clear, is that the Israelis are fools to start a war with Iran given Iranian capabilities.

I question Iran's capabilities now -- more than I did before they launched that attack. And remember they're not going to be going one-on-one with Israel. The US will defend Israel's security.

What do you think has been re revealed by Iran? The smart folks point to the weakness in Israeli air defenses given the massively outlays needed to defend against *low end* drones+missles. The somewhat better, but not the best, Iranian missiles hit their targets. AND the Iranians gave ample early warnings. Shorter: Iran can cause Israel very serious damage if it chooses.

Was well played by Iran. They knew this was for show only. The idea is to get the biggest bang they could - not risk an all out war v US. Israel was not the prob it was always a measured response to what the US may do. They had to figure out how to hurt Israel and they did by 1. Getting the last word and 2. Showing they got some fighting power that required US involvement v Israel - they were smart enough not to use the good stuff but showed they still had some stuff to hurt Israel on their own. 3. Now they know who their allies are and aren't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But - he should have given his ultimatum earlier to Bibi. He waited until too many innocents were massacred. Agreed that he's in between hard choices and yes he has to support Israel but just like he said no more v Iran he should have absolutely said no to them crushing Gaza weeks ago. After you murder innocents like 5k - that ought to be a sign but to wait till more than 30k killed - Biden deserves to lose this election.

You are right about Biden setting himself up for a loss. The shrill worries about Trump were always about his causing chaos and mass death, etc. Biden was sold as an antidote to those worries, but unfortunately he’s just been another cheerleader for the pre-Trump war machine and not a path to a better future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

DP.

So you're seriously arguing that Israelis and Palestinians can live together peacefully in a single state?

There's been some wild stuff in this thread, but this might be the silliest single post in all 2,847 pages.

Of all the hypocrisy and logical pretzels in the Israel/Palestine conflict, one of the choice bits is the pretend relationship Israel has with the Palestinians. It goes something like this:

Israelis and Palestinians cannot possibly live together! They will exterminate us! They hate us!

But:

We are a tolerant multinational state. We have Arabs! Look, over here! Here are our Arabs! They are just like us! They work, play, get elected, we have, like, Arab judges! They are like LOYAL.

But:

Let's make sure we have just enough and not too many of them. Because, you know, Arabs. Who knows. Let's make sure they can only marry their own and let's not allow them to bring Arab spouses from outside. Because, you know, Arabs. Mustn't have too many or something terrible might happen! And let's take every opportunity to remind them this is JEWISH state, yo. Don't get ideas about being equal or something.

But:

We are a democracy! With protections and equal rights! We have Arabs, look! But we can't really be expected to live peacefully next to them. Well not to THEM, to different kind of Arab. You know, the bad ones. Because Arabs hate the Jews! Except we have Arabs and therefore are tolerant. You know?

It's a beauty.

Funny that you presume that all of the potential/purported issues arise from the Palestinian side.

Notice that none of the above posts make that claim?

Neither Israelis nor Palestinians are willing/able to live together in a "tolerant, multinational" state.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But - he should have given his ultimatum earlier to Bibi. He waited until too many innocents were massacred. Agreed that he's in between hard choices and yes he has to support Israel but just like he said no more v Iran he should have absolutely said no to them crushing Gaza weeks ago. After you murder innocents like 5k - that ought to be a sign but to wait till more than 30k killed - Biden deserves to lose this election.

You are right about Biden setting himself up for a loss. The shrill worries about Trump were always about his causing chaos and mass death, etc. Biden was sold as an antidote to those worries, but unfortunately he’s just been another cheerleader for the pre-Trump war machine and not a path to a better future.

Dp- cool cool cool.
I mean we could have had the genius of Trump leading us through this quagmire, that is not of our making.
What was it that Trump said this weekend?
Oh that’s right
“. “What an unbelievable ― I mean, it was so much and so interesting, and so vicious and horrible, and so beautiful in so many different ways.”
“Gettysburg. Wow. I go to Gettysburg, Pennsylvania, to look and to watch. And the statement of Robert E. Lee ― who’s no longer in favor, did you ever notice that? No longer in favor ― ‘Never fight uphill, me boys, never fight uphill.’ They were fighting uphill. He said, ‘Wow, that was a big mistake.’ He lost his great general, and they were fighting. ‘Never fight uphill, me boys!’ But it was too late.”

Just think we could have that intellect running the show.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

DP.

So you're seriously arguing that Israelis and Palestinians can live together peacefully in a single state?

There's been some wild stuff in this thread, but this might be the silliest single post in all 2,847 pages.

Of all the hypocrisy and logical pretzels in the Israel/Palestine conflict, one of the choice bits is the pretend relationship Israel has with the Palestinians. It goes something like this:

Israelis and Palestinians cannot possibly live together! They will exterminate us! They hate us!

But:

We are a tolerant multinational state. We have Arabs! Look, over here! Here are our Arabs! They are just like us! They work, play, get elected, we have, like, Arab judges! They are like LOYAL.

But:

Let's make sure we have just enough and not too many of them. Because, you know, Arabs. Who knows. Let's make sure they can only marry their own and let's not allow them to bring Arab spouses from outside. Because, you know, Arabs. Mustn't have too many or something terrible might happen! And let's take every opportunity to remind them this is JEWISH state, yo. Don't get ideas about being equal or something.

But:

We are a democracy! With protections and equal rights! We have Arabs, look! But we can't really be expected to live peacefully next to them. Well not to THEM, to different kind of Arab. You know, the bad ones. Because Arabs hate the Jews! Except we have Arabs and therefore are tolerant. You know?

It's a beauty.

Sounds reasonable. Look how many places implemented sharia law or have creeping Islamism. Even in Scandinavia they've had to close bars and get rid of some public baths. Why take a chance?
There was even a town in Vermont that demanded a restaurant sign with a pig be taken down.
100 years ago Egypt had Jews in its cabinet. Now in Egypt it is difficult for Jews to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

DP.

So you're seriously arguing that Israelis and Palestinians can live together peacefully in a single state?

There's been some wild stuff in this thread, but this might be the silliest single post in all 2,847 pages.

Of all the hypocrisy and logical pretzels in the Israel/Palestine conflict, one of the choice bits is the pretend relationship Israel has with the Palestinians. It goes something like this:

Israelis and Palestinians cannot possibly live together! They will exterminate us! They hate us!

But:

We are a tolerant multinational state. We have Arabs! Look, over here! Here are our Arabs! They are just like us! They work, play, get elected, we have, like, Arab judges! They are like LOYAL.

But:

Let's make sure we have just enough and not too many of them. Because, you know, Arabs. Who knows. Let's make sure they can only marry their own and let's not allow them to bring Arab spouses from outside. Because, you know, Arabs. Mustn't have too many or something terrible might happen! And let's take every opportunity to remind them this is JEWISH state, yo. Don't get ideas about being equal or something.

But:

We are a democracy! With protections and equal rights! We have Arabs, look! But we can't really be expected to live peacefully next to them. Well not to THEM, to different kind of Arab. You know, the bad ones. Because Arabs hate the Jews! Except we have Arabs and therefore are tolerant. You know?

It's a beauty.

Sounds reasonable. Look how many places implemented sharia law or have creeping Islamism. Even in Scandinavia they've had to close bars and get rid of some public baths. Why take a chance?
There was even a town in Vermont that demanded a restaurant sign with a pig be taken down.
100 years ago Egypt had Jews in its cabinet. Now in Egypt it is difficult for Jews to be.

Yes even in the US religious laws are being imposed on the population. There are many dry counties and we all know about abortion. If want to talk about religious laws let talk about the get.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

Hamas removes its extreme stuff then runs across into Israel, rapes women, sticks babies in ovens, kills the elderly and then cries uncle when Israel beats the crap out of it. What a bunch of effing pu$$ies.

Well we all know Hamas did not rape anyone, did not stick babies in ovens, etc, etc. Why do you repeat these lies over and over again? I guess you think it will allow you to continue your genocide?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Biden said don’t


And they basically didn’t.
They put on a show, and it didn’t do much.
And that’s that.

You cannot be serious.

I didn’t wake up to World War III this morning did you?

I don't think Israel will retaliate. Iran shot its wad and it was pretty much ineffective. They made their point. They don't want any further escalation. It'd be suicidal and I don't think they're that dumb.

You clearly don’t understand what happened. Iran planned and executed with masterful elegance. They notified their opponents ahead of time, had them fully mobilize and position themselves and then slipped through their missile smack dab in the runway of the most protected base in the world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Biden said don’t


And they basically didn’t.
They put on a show, and it didn’t do much.
And that’s that.

You cannot be serious.

I didn’t wake up to World War III this morning did you?

I don't think Israel will retaliate. Iran shot its wad and it was pretty much ineffective. They made their point. They don't want any further escalation. It'd be suicidal and I don't think they're that dumb.

You clearly don’t understand what happened. Iran planned and executed with masterful elegance. They notified their opponents ahead of time, had them fully mobilize and position themselves and then slipped through their missile smack dab in the runway of the most protected base in the world.

True, but 50% of their launches failed and the Middle Eastern Air Defense alliance showed up strong. They saved face but at a cost. Both Israel and Iran have enough to claim a W but really got an L. The Western Alliance meanwhile got a W as long as Israel doesn't do anything stupid, again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

Hamas removes its extreme stuff then runs across into Israel, rapes women, sticks babies in ovens, kills the elderly and then cries uncle when Israel beats the crap out of it. What a bunch of effing pu$$ies.

Well we all know Hamas did not rape anyone, did not stick babies in ovens, etc, etc. Why do you repeat these lies over and over again? I guess you think it will allow you to continue your genocide?

WTF?
we can’t even have a conversation about this because people are living in La La land.