Now That Iran Has Retaliated Against Israel?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

So you favor genocide?

So your stance is Israel can not allow the Palestinians back with full rights and compensation because it would be a genocide? Of whom? What a radical position you hold. If this had been done 45 years ago there would be no threat to Israel now.

No, no--I think it's an excellent idea to follow the DRC plan for Israel/Palestine.

Forcing two peoples with a long history of conflict and hatred to live together ALWAYS works out well for the minority group, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

This is a hoot! The Israelis couldn’t tell the truth about being outsmarted on Oct 7th, why would they admit damage to their bases? Those bases were the real target. And the real message, which is clear, is that the Israelis are fools to start a war with Iran given Iranian capabilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

Is it retaliation when you were the instigator? Why didn’t Israel bomb Iran directly? Why Syria? The US and UK mitigated the onslaught from Iran (Did Iran even really think they would get anywhere, they had to do something to save face) Like a parent breaking up a fight between the golden child and black sheep sibling.

Without the US and Iran’s restraint Israel would be burning right now. The Iranians gave 24 hours notice, lunched very small amount of slow moving drones and missiles, no ballistic missiles, no coordinated with hezbollah, using older technologies(the new generation of Iran missiles are much better because of Russia), short duration(a few hours, nots days), etc. Israel Air Force is not big and this raid stress them to the max. 310 combat aircraft out of 14 airbases. Without US intelligence Israel’s planes would not have made the intercepts.

This really shocked the Israelis. It could have been much worst and still going today. Though I do not think the Israelis will learn their lesson till something major happens in Israel.

THIS 1000x is right. Without the US stating clearly Israel's next aggressive move v Iran would not be supported, they would have wanted to escalate because that's Bibi for you - he's a warmonger and so torn up by hate that all he wants to do is fight and kill anyone not Jewish. Without the military and financial backing them, Israel is severely limited in their actions. The plight of Gaza - all the suffering and needless killing and of INNOCENT (NOT HAMAS) lives are squarely in the blame of American government who supported and funded this. Absolutely 100%. Bibi cannot do anything on his own on a massive scale without backing - it's not logistically possible for them to do this much damage totally on their own.

I think Iran played their hand well. They had to do something and what they did was clever in that they got their "revenge" but they went a step to "escalate" knowing full well that the tactic was never going to get them in too much trouble given that what they did wasn't all that. They politically and militarily tested Israel/US in forcing Biden's hand to not offer additional support to Israel by seemingly giving the illusion that they went full force at Israel (to anyone who really knows what is going on they totally did not). They did get their "revenge" in a sense because they got the last word in. Israel can't "save face" and do much at this point as a next step v Iran while the whole world watches.

I think/hope that Israel will be escalating down in various respects given that US has made clear there are limits to what we will do. I think this should have all taken place way earlier but politically, I don't think Biden had a choice given how many American Jews in power there are not to mention in his own cabinet, wanting revenge for 10/7 of some sort. But it's out of control at this point and Biden should have recognized this much sooner than now. He really messed up here as a leader.

What are you even babbling about?
Biden messed up? Get out of here with that garbage. This administration has done an excellent job of juggling a dozen opposing interests while holding off a third world war, despite every despot on the planet making a move to destroy democracy in the last 4 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

This is a hoot! The Israelis couldn’t tell the truth about being outsmarted on Oct 7th, why would they admit damage to their bases? Those bases were the real target. And the real message, which is clear, is that the Israelis are fools to start a war with Iran given Iranian capabilities.

I question Iran's capabilities now -- more than I did before they launched that attack. And remember they're not going to be going one-on-one with Israel. The US will defend Israel's security.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

DP.

So you're seriously arguing that Israelis and Palestinians can live together peacefully in a single state?

There's been some wild stuff in this thread, but this might be the silliest single post in all 2,847 pages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

This is a hoot! The Israelis couldn’t tell the truth about being outsmarted on Oct 7th, why would they admit damage to their bases? Those bases were the real target. And the real message, which is clear, is that the Israelis are fools to start a war with Iran given Iranian capabilities.

I question Iran's capabilities now -- more than I did before they launched that attack. And remember they're not going to be going one-on-one with Israel. The US will defend Israel's security.

What do you think has been re revealed by Iran? The smart folks point to the weakness in Israeli air defenses given the massively outlays needed to defend against *low end* drones+missles. The somewhat better, but not the best, Iranian missiles hit their targets. AND the Iranians gave ample early warnings. Shorter: Iran can cause Israel very serious damage if it chooses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

This is a hoot! The Israelis couldn’t tell the truth about being outsmarted on Oct 7th, why would they admit damage to their bases? Those bases were the real target. And the real message, which is clear, is that the Israelis are fools to start a war with Iran given Iranian capabilities.

I question Iran's capabilities now -- more than I did before they launched that attack. And remember they're not going to be going one-on-one with Israel. The US will defend Israel's security.

What do you think has been re revealed by Iran? The smart folks point to the weakness in Israeli air defenses given the massively outlays needed to defend against *low end* drones+missles. The somewhat better, but not the best, Iranian missiles hit their targets. AND the Iranians gave ample early warnings. Shorter: Iran can cause Israel very serious damage if it chooses.

Fine, but we both know that would be very stupid of them to do. So I can't see being worried about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

Is it retaliation when you were the instigator? Why didn’t Israel bomb Iran directly? Why Syria? The US and UK mitigated the onslaught from Iran (Did Iran even really think they would get anywhere, they had to do something to save face) Like a parent breaking up a fight between the golden child and black sheep sibling.

Without the US and Iran’s restraint Israel would be burning right now. The Iranians gave 24 hours notice, lunched very small amount of slow moving drones and missiles, no ballistic missiles, no coordinated with hezbollah, using older technologies(the new generation of Iran missiles are much better because of Russia), short duration(a few hours, nots days), etc. Israel Air Force is not big and this raid stress them to the max. 310 combat aircraft out of 14 airbases. Without US intelligence Israel’s planes would not have made the intercepts.

This really shocked the Israelis. It could have been much worst and still going today. Though I do not think the Israelis will learn their lesson till something major happens in Israel.

THIS 1000x is right. Without the US stating clearly Israel's next aggressive move v Iran would not be supported, they would have wanted to escalate because that's Bibi for you - he's a warmonger and so torn up by hate that all he wants to do is fight and kill anyone not Jewish. Without the military and financial backing them, Israel is severely limited in their actions. The plight of Gaza - all the suffering and needless killing and of INNOCENT (NOT HAMAS) lives are squarely in the blame of American government who supported and funded this. Absolutely 100%. Bibi cannot do anything on his own on a massive scale without backing - it's not logistically possible for them to do this much damage totally on their own.

I think Iran played their hand well. They had to do something and what they did was clever in that they got their "revenge" but they went a step to "escalate" knowing full well that the tactic was never going to get them in too much trouble given that what they did wasn't all that. They politically and militarily tested Israel/US in forcing Biden's hand to not offer additional support to Israel by seemingly giving the illusion that they went full force at Israel (to anyone who really knows what is going on they totally did not). They did get their "revenge" in a sense because they got the last word in. Israel can't "save face" and do much at this point as a next step v Iran while the whole world watches.

I think/hope that Israel will be escalating down in various respects given that US has made clear there are limits to what we will do. I think this should have all taken place way earlier but politically, I don't think Biden had a choice given how many American Jews in power there are not to mention in his own cabinet, wanting revenge for 10/7 of some sort. But it's out of control at this point and Biden should have recognized this much sooner than now. He really messed up here as a leader.

What are you even babbling about?
Biden messed up? Get out of here with that garbage. This administration has done an excellent job of juggling a dozen opposing interests while holding off a third world war, despite every despot on the planet making a move to destroy democracy in the last 4 years.

This sort of brain-dead paean to Biden comes from too much credulity in reading WaPo or listening to NPR. The reality is that he’s been a perfect example of how the Democrats of recent decades are nearly as problematic as the Republicans. Amplifying a Mideast War after all the other Mideast debacles? Biden has learned nothing!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

This is a hoot! The Israelis couldn’t tell the truth about being outsmarted on Oct 7th, why would they admit damage to their bases? Those bases were the real target. And the real message, which is clear, is that the Israelis are fools to start a war with Iran given Iranian capabilities.

I question Iran's capabilities now -- more than I did before they launched that attack. And remember they're not going to be going one-on-one with Israel. The US will defend Israel's security.

What do you think has been re revealed by Iran? The smart folks point to the weakness in Israeli air defenses given the massively outlays needed to defend against *low end* drones+missles. The somewhat better, but not the best, Iranian missiles hit their targets. AND the Iranians gave ample early warnings. Shorter: Iran can cause Israel very serious damage if it chooses.

But it won’t.
Message sent. Face saved.
Show’s over.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

This is a hoot! The Israelis couldn’t tell the truth about being outsmarted on Oct 7th, why would they admit damage to their bases? Those bases were the real target. And the real message, which is clear, is that the Israelis are fools to start a war with Iran given Iranian capabilities.

I question Iran's capabilities now -- more than I did before they launched that attack. And remember they're not going to be going one-on-one with Israel. The US will defend Israel's security.

What do you think has been re revealed by Iran? The smart folks point to the weakness in Israeli air defenses given the massively outlays needed to defend against *low end* drones+missles. The somewhat better, but not the best, Iranian missiles hit their targets. AND the Iranians gave ample early warnings. Shorter: Iran can cause Israel very serious damage if it chooses.

But it won’t.
Message sent. Face saved.
Show’s over.

Yup. Exactly this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

Is it retaliation when you were the instigator? Why didn’t Israel bomb Iran directly? Why Syria? The US and UK mitigated the onslaught from Iran (Did Iran even really think they would get anywhere, they had to do something to save face) Like a parent breaking up a fight between the golden child and black sheep sibling.

Without the US and Iran’s restraint Israel would be burning right now. The Iranians gave 24 hours notice, lunched very small amount of slow moving drones and missiles, no ballistic missiles, no coordinated with hezbollah, using older technologies(the new generation of Iran missiles are much better because of Russia), short duration(a few hours, nots days), etc. Israel Air Force is not big and this raid stress them to the max. 310 combat aircraft out of 14 airbases. Without US intelligence Israel’s planes would not have made the intercepts.

This really shocked the Israelis. It could have been much worst and still going today. Though I do not think the Israelis will learn their lesson till something major happens in Israel.

THIS 1000x is right. Without the US stating clearly Israel's next aggressive move v Iran would not be supported, they would have wanted to escalate because that's Bibi for you - he's a warmonger and so torn up by hate that all he wants to do is fight and kill anyone not Jewish. Without the military and financial backing them, Israel is severely limited in their actions. The plight of Gaza - all the suffering and needless killing and of INNOCENT (NOT HAMAS) lives are squarely in the blame of American government who supported and funded this. Absolutely 100%. Bibi cannot do anything on his own on a massive scale without backing - it's not logistically possible for them to do this much damage totally on their own.

I think Iran played their hand well. They had to do something and what they did was clever in that they got their "revenge" but they went a step to "escalate" knowing full well that the tactic was never going to get them in too much trouble given that what they did wasn't all that. They politically and militarily tested Israel/US in forcing Biden's hand to not offer additional support to Israel by seemingly giving the illusion that they went full force at Israel (to anyone who really knows what is going on they totally did not). They did get their "revenge" in a sense because they got the last word in. Israel can't "save face" and do much at this point as a next step v Iran while the whole world watches.

I think/hope that Israel will be escalating down in various respects given that US has made clear there are limits to what we will do. I think this should have all taken place way earlier but politically, I don't think Biden had a choice given how many American Jews in power there are not to mention in his own cabinet, wanting revenge for 10/7 of some sort. But it's out of control at this point and Biden should have recognized this much sooner than now. He really messed up here as a leader.

What are you even babbling about?
Biden messed up? Get out of here with that garbage. This administration has done an excellent job of juggling a dozen opposing interests while holding off a third world war, despite every despot on the planet making a move to destroy democracy in the last 4 years.

This sort of brain-dead paean to Biden comes from too much credulity in reading WaPo or listening to NPR. The reality is that he’s been a perfect example of how the Democrats of recent decades are nearly as problematic as the Republicans. Amplifying a Mideast War after all the other Mideast debacles? Biden has learned nothing!

There are no good options when dealing with religious zealots. You’re not getting Middle East peace. Biden has done the only doable thing, and kept in from boiling over. Grow up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

Is it retaliation when you were the instigator? Why didn’t Israel bomb Iran directly? Why Syria? The US and UK mitigated the onslaught from Iran (Did Iran even really think they would get anywhere, they had to do something to save face) Like a parent breaking up a fight between the golden child and black sheep sibling.

Without the US and Iran’s restraint Israel would be burning right now. The Iranians gave 24 hours notice, lunched very small amount of slow moving drones and missiles, no ballistic missiles, no coordinated with hezbollah, using older technologies(the new generation of Iran missiles are much better because of Russia), short duration(a few hours, nots days), etc. Israel Air Force is not big and this raid stress them to the max. 310 combat aircraft out of 14 airbases. Without US intelligence Israel’s planes would not have made the intercepts.

This really shocked the Israelis. It could have been much worst and still going today. Though I do not think the Israelis will learn their lesson till something major happens in Israel.

THIS 1000x is right. Without the US stating clearly Israel's next aggressive move v Iran would not be supported, they would have wanted to escalate because that's Bibi for you - he's a warmonger and so torn up by hate that all he wants to do is fight and kill anyone not Jewish. Without the military and financial backing them, Israel is severely limited in their actions. The plight of Gaza - all the suffering and needless killing and of INNOCENT (NOT HAMAS) lives are squarely in the blame of American government who supported and funded this. Absolutely 100%. Bibi cannot do anything on his own on a massive scale without backing - it's not logistically possible for them to do this much damage totally on their own.

I think Iran played their hand well. They had to do something and what they did was clever in that they got their "revenge" but they went a step to "escalate" knowing full well that the tactic was never going to get them in too much trouble given that what they did wasn't all that. They politically and militarily tested Israel/US in forcing Biden's hand to not offer additional support to Israel by seemingly giving the illusion that they went full force at Israel (to anyone who really knows what is going on they totally did not). They did get their "revenge" in a sense because they got the last word in. Israel can't "save face" and do much at this point as a next step v Iran while the whole world watches.

I think/hope that Israel will be escalating down in various respects given that US has made clear there are limits to what we will do. I think this should have all taken place way earlier but politically, I don't think Biden had a choice given how many American Jews in power there are not to mention in his own cabinet, wanting revenge for 10/7 of some sort. But it's out of control at this point and Biden should have recognized this much sooner than now. He really messed up here as a leader.

What are you even babbling about?
Biden messed up? Get out of here with that garbage. This administration has done an excellent job of juggling a dozen opposing interests while holding off a third world war, despite every despot on the planet making a move to destroy democracy in the last 4 years.

This sort of brain-dead paean to Biden comes from too much credulity in reading WaPo or listening to NPR. The reality is that he’s been a perfect example of how the Democrats of recent decades are nearly as problematic as the Republicans. Amplifying a Mideast War after all the other Mideast debacles? Biden has learned nothing!

There are no good options when dealing with religious zealots. You’re not getting Middle East peace. Biden has done the only doable thing, and kept in from boiling over. Grow up.

DP.

+1

The "wave a magic wand" crowd is downright silly.

If there were a panacea here, perhaps someone would have implemented it sometime in the last 100 years?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel cannot fight Iran via Hezbollah in Lebanon and Syria in the North, Iran to the West, and Hamas to the east. They cannot do it alone without American help and without Arab intervention/interception from Jordan, Kuwait, Saudis and I suspect they are on Israel’s side against Iran and quietly helped on Saturday

Or Israel can just solve the root cause- the Palestinians. It’s long past time to force solution on Israel and stop this madness. One state solution with full rights for no Jews and compensation for Palestinians with right of return.

Gee whiz, I wonder if those peace loving Palestinians had Israel’s arsenal of nuclear weapons if they’d hesitate even 1 minute before annihilating Israel? Hell, the destruction of Israel is written into their founding documents as it is with Iran.

This conjecture is hilarious given the extreme statements in the longstanding Likud charter AND the fact that the Hamas charter removed its extreme stuff.

Hasbara fools thinking they play 80s/90s propaganda games on today’s chess board?

DP.

So you're seriously arguing that Israelis and Palestinians can live together peacefully in a single state?

There's been some wild stuff in this thread, but this might be the silliest single post in all 2,847 pages.

Haha! First principle here is that Zionism in its current form has a short future. If you think that keeping up Zionism’s hostility to peace helps you, please don’t be surprised when it blows up in your face. Zionism has depended upon American largesse which end abruptly when our gerontocracy dies.

Bye bye bigots!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was Iran's intended target PP?

NP. Two airbases in the Negev, including the one involved in the Damascus attack, and an intelligence base in the Golan.

C'mon. Was any real damage done? I've tried to look this up and only find that all operations are back to normal today. I suppose this is why Israel sees no need to retaliate.

Is it retaliation when you were the instigator? Why didn’t Israel bomb Iran directly? Why Syria? The US and UK mitigated the onslaught from Iran (Did Iran even really think they would get anywhere, they had to do something to save face) Like a parent breaking up a fight between the golden child and black sheep sibling.

Without the US and Iran’s restraint Israel would be burning right now. The Iranians gave 24 hours notice, lunched very small amount of slow moving drones and missiles, no ballistic missiles, no coordinated with hezbollah, using older technologies(the new generation of Iran missiles are much better because of Russia), short duration(a few hours, nots days), etc. Israel Air Force is not big and this raid stress them to the max. 310 combat aircraft out of 14 airbases. Without US intelligence Israel’s planes would not have made the intercepts.

This really shocked the Israelis. It could have been much worst and still going today. Though I do not think the Israelis will learn their lesson till something major happens in Israel.

THIS 1000x is right. Without the US stating clearly Israel's next aggressive move v Iran would not be supported, they would have wanted to escalate because that's Bibi for you - he's a warmonger and so torn up by hate that all he wants to do is fight and kill anyone not Jewish. Without the military and financial backing them, Israel is severely limited in their actions. The plight of Gaza - all the suffering and needless killing and of INNOCENT (NOT HAMAS) lives are squarely in the blame of American government who supported and funded this. Absolutely 100%. Bibi cannot do anything on his own on a massive scale without backing - it's not logistically possible for them to do this much damage totally on their own.

I think Iran played their hand well. They had to do something and what they did was clever in that they got their "revenge" but they went a step to "escalate" knowing full well that the tactic was never going to get them in too much trouble given that what they did wasn't all that. They politically and militarily tested Israel/US in forcing Biden's hand to not offer additional support to Israel by seemingly giving the illusion that they went full force at Israel (to anyone who really knows what is going on they totally did not). They did get their "revenge" in a sense because they got the last word in. Israel can't "save face" and do much at this point as a next step v Iran while the whole world watches.

I think/hope that Israel will be escalating down in various respects given that US has made clear there are limits to what we will do. I think this should have all taken place way earlier but politically, I don't think Biden had a choice given how many American Jews in power there are not to mention in his own cabinet, wanting revenge for 10/7 of some sort. But it's out of control at this point and Biden should have recognized this much sooner than now. He really messed up here as a leader.

What are you even babbling about?
Biden messed up? Get out of here with that garbage. This administration has done an excellent job of juggling a dozen opposing interests while holding off a third world war, despite every despot on the planet making a move to destroy democracy in the last 4 years.

This sort of brain-dead paean to Biden comes from too much credulity in reading WaPo or listening to NPR. The reality is that he’s been a perfect example of how the Democrats of recent decades are nearly as problematic as the Republicans. Amplifying a Mideast War after all the other Mideast debacles? Biden has learned nothing!

There are no good options when dealing with religious zealots. You’re not getting Middle East peace. Biden has done the only doable thing, and kept in from boiling over. Grow up.

Lol! Thinking 1) we’ve explored all our options and 2) all we are dealing with are “religious extremists” is just silly. And you consider that to be conclusive that Biden, while supporting a genocide, is doing the best possible? If anyone here needs to grow up, it’s you!