Ruling on MCPS LGBT curriculum case coming this morning

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

What happens when parents their kids opt out of science class when evolution or anything related is taught?

Or science in general?

This is nuts

As parents, its their choice.

People cannot expect to be able to order their child's public school experience a la carte. If your child having a modern, secular, inclusive school experience bothers you, the "parental choice" option is to pick a different school for them or homeschool them.

Exactly. But Alito has now ruled otherwise…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

Nope . You can’t have 1 class where you have total opt out and guess what the scotus agrees. The books stay the kids stay home with their parents.

Would you also like a class where there are no black characters?

MCPS focuses on students of color, except Muslim and other specific groups and LGBT. Its not inclusive or welcoming to other groups. They will do something about a hate crime against LGBT, but nothing when Jews and Muslims are targeted. The county will pay for security for private Jewish Schools but not MCPS schools.

Jewish schools pay for their own security, they might pay a cop and he might wear his uniform, but he is paid by the school. Just like the Catholic schools.

It is very inclusive in welcoming to Jewish families and Muslim families and Christian families.

They can’t stop bigotry. They can only punish it after it happens.

No. the county over the past few years has given grants for secuirty to certain religious groups, including Jewish and Muslim. But, its only for private schools, not public. Not all Jewish schools are inclusive. We looked at a bunch of and many were not that thrilled with a mixed religion family. Same with Catholic only they made us feel even less welcomed.

That is not true. They pay for private security.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

Nope . You can’t have 1 class where you have total opt out and guess what the scotus agrees. The books stay the kids stay home with their parents.

Would you also like a class where there are no black characters?

Staying home would be another solution, I agree. But if they have to be in school then they need to be in easily removed sections to facilitate the school functioning and to not place further burdens on teachers.

The rolling was that would be too much of a burden on a large school system and then it’s up to the parents to keep their kids out of the class. It’s only the responsibility of the teacher administration to let the parents know what books are being read.

Are you telling me that your religion is too much of a burden?

This is inaccurate, you cannot treat LGBTQ opt out any differently then any other opt out. Children that opt out of sex ed, for example, are not expected to keep their children home on sex Ed day. It’s the responsibility of the school to handle it. The school is creating the burden, if there were no burden there would be nobody opting out.

You are incorrect. It was also discussed during the arguments. Children who take sex at or old enough to take care of themselves and can be left alone to their own devices in a room by themselves.

A 5, 6 and seven year-old are not legally allowed to be loved by themselves. I’m Montgomery County‘s argument was that they don’t have the staff for every opt out whim for every bigot.

So the court ruled parents could keep their kids at home and it would be an excused absence.

The school is not creating a burden. You are creating a burden.

If your religion is that important, you won’t feel as though it’s a burden you will feel it’s an honor to spend the day with your children praying.

No kids should be left in a room alone at school. Families have a right to decide what's best for their kids. Why do you want your beliefs respected by have no ability to respect others.

Kids are left alone in rooms all the time when they are in middle and high school.

Yes, of course an elementary school child should not be left alone. That is why their parents need to keep them at home on days, but they think they can à la carte their education.

I don’t have a belief that needs to be respected. Schools teach about everybody that’s life if you don’t like it keep your kid home.

The only thing that’s being respected. Here is the constitution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

What happens when parents their kids opt out of science class when evolution or anything related is taught?

Or science in general?

This is nuts

As parents, its their choice.

People cannot expect to be able to order their child's public school experience a la carte. If your child having a modern, secular, inclusive school experience bothers you, the "parental choice" option is to pick a different school for them or homeschool them.

Then change the curriculum to be respectful to all families and viewpoints.

So you want whites supremacy to dictate a curriculum that doesn’t speak about Black people?

No, you’re not changing the curriculum you have the right to opt out. Keep your kid home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

Nope . You can’t have 1 class where you have total opt out and guess what the scotus agrees. The books stay the kids stay home with their parents.

Would you also like a class where there are no black characters?

Staying home would be another solution, I agree. But if they have to be in school then they need to be in easily removed sections to facilitate the school functioning and to not place further burdens on teachers.

The rolling was that would be too much of a burden on a large school system and then it’s up to the parents to keep their kids out of the class. It’s only the responsibility of the teacher administration to let the parents know what books are being read.

Are you telling me that your religion is too much of a burden?

This is inaccurate, you cannot treat LGBTQ opt out any differently then any other opt out. Children that opt out of sex ed, for example, are not expected to keep their children home on sex Ed day. It’s the responsibility of the school to handle it. The school is creating the burden, if there were no burden there would be nobody opting out.

You are incorrect. It was also discussed during the arguments. Children who take sex at or old enough to take care of themselves and can be left alone to their own devices in a room by themselves.

A 5, 6 and seven year-old are not legally allowed to be loved by themselves. I’m Montgomery County‘s argument was that they don’t have the staff for every opt out whim for every bigot.

So the court ruled parents could keep their kids at home and it would be an excused absence.

The school is not creating a burden. You are creating a burden.

If your religion is that important, you won’t feel as though it’s a burden you will feel it’s an honor to spend the day with your children praying.

No kids should be left in a room alone at school. Families have a right to decide what's best for their kids. Why do you want your beliefs respected by have no ability to respect others.

Kids are left alone in rooms all the time when they are in middle and high school.

Yes, of course an elementary school child should not be left alone. That is why their parents need to keep them at home on days, but they think they can à la carte their education.

I don’t have a belief that needs to be respected. Schools teach about everybody that’s life if you don’t like it keep your kid home.

The only thing that’s being respected. Here is the constitution.

Nobody is leaving their children home, Karen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

What happens when parents their kids opt out of science class when evolution or anything related is taught?

Or science in general?

This is nuts

As parents, its their choice.

People cannot expect to be able to order their child's public school experience a la carte. If your child having a modern, secular, inclusive school experience bothers you, the "parental choice" option is to pick a different school for them or homeschool them.

Then change the curriculum to be respectful to all families and viewpoints.

So you want whites supremacy to dictate a curriculum that doesn’t speak about Black people?

No, you’re not changing the curriculum you have the right to opt out. Keep your kid home.

One has nothing to do with the other. You are the hateful extremist who cannot respect others beliefs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:For the parents opting their children out of lessons because those lessons include a same sex couple family, please know that the vast majority of us judge you harshly as a bigot and your kids will likely suffer social consequences because of your intolerance. I feel bad for them, especially those who are themselves gay. Shame on you, you intolerant and insecure people.

The vibe has shifted. I think you’ll be surprised at who is judging who here.

No such thing as a "bigot". This is a fake, made up social construct that liberals made up for people who don't agree with them. Disagreeing with you doesn't make someone an uneducated, narrow minded "bigot". It just means someone doesn't agree wth your social activist agenda.

It always interesting when folks throw out the phrase social activist as though that is a bad thing. They forgot that the founding fathers are social activist, the suffragist are social activist, Abolitionist are social activist, Etc etc. I’m pretty sure social activist consider themselves in good company of people who people and movements that have had transformational change good for humanity.

Oh yes the whole founding father’s argument again. Show me where they read pornography to children and didn’t let parents opt out.

Also if you label yourself an activist then don’t tell me that you don’t have an agenda that you want to impose on my kids.

That wasn’t me, I’m no activist. I just want school to be for reading, writing, spelling, math, grammar, etc and think you can do all of that without ever discussing gay sex in kindergarten.

All these new trendy or made up curriclums are why kids are struggling. Get back to the basics. Give spelling and vocabulary books yearly and have weekly quizzes and assignments. Same with the basics for math, like math facts. Kids cannot be successful in MS or HS with the foundation work done in ES.

Which school is not teaching those?

All the ones we’ve been to. Zero vocab, spelling, math facts or grammar. We did it all at home.

Which score is that? Actually, the spelling tests almost killed me. Love to know where there’s no spelling tests., or math minutes, or grammar for that matter

Yeah, seriously. That person clearly doesn't have elementary school kids, the spelling tests are constant, there are quizzes all the time, and there's tons of attention to vocabulary, grammar, math, etc.

I have HSers in MCPS. They did not have constant spelling tests and quizzes all the time. When did that start happening? As my HSers will tell you, there was very little time devoted grammar as all the kids are learning it now for testing.

If your experience with elementary school is years out of date, maybe don't comment on things you're not familiar with?

The curriculum you are referring to is in its first year, so...

[Anonymous]

I am curious why the Jewish and Muslim families who supported this opt out do not see how this opens the way for parents to push for opting out of having kids read story books with Jewish or Muslim characters on the basis of the religious burden that including these characters might do to Christian kids. Christian parents can argue that seeing these characters at a young age could be burdensome to their religious beliefs and that they want to introduce their kids to the existence of these types of beliefs when they are older. I think people forget that respecting diversity that includes your beliefs also means respecting diversity that does not. Anyways, I get why male, straight, Christian conservative white nationalists would celebrate this ruling. I disagree, but it makes sense. For anyone not part of this group, I do not understand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am curious why the Jewish and Muslim families who supported this opt out do not see how this opens the way for parents to push for opting out of having kids read story books with Jewish or Muslim characters on the basis of the religious burden that including these characters might do to Christian kids. Christian parents can argue that seeing these characters at a young age could be burdensome to their religious beliefs and that they want to introduce their kids to the existence of these types of beliefs when they are older. I think people forget that respecting diversity that includes your beliefs also means respecting diversity that does not. Anyways, I get why male, straight, Christian conservative white nationalists would celebrate this ruling. I disagree, but it makes sense. For anyone not part of this group, I do not understand.

I am Jewish and if elementary school kids did not read books about Jewish characters I would not really care. In fact, my kids have not read any school books with Jewish characters in all their time in public school - and they are both in middle school. I would not have pulled my kids out for the books in question in this case, but I also do not think your scenario would be a big concern.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am curious why the Jewish and Muslim families who supported this opt out do not see how this opens the way for parents to push for opting out of having kids read story books with Jewish or Muslim characters on the basis of the religious burden that including these characters might do to Christian kids. Christian parents can argue that seeing these characters at a young age could be burdensome to their religious beliefs and that they want to introduce their kids to the existence of these types of beliefs when they are older. I think people forget that respecting diversity that includes your beliefs also means respecting diversity that does not. Anyways, I get why male, straight, Christian conservative white nationalists would celebrate this ruling. I disagree, but it makes sense. For anyone not part of this group, I do not understand.

I am Jewish and if elementary school kids did not read books about Jewish characters I would not really care. In fact, my kids have not read any school books with Jewish characters in all their time in public school - and they are both in middle school. I would not have pulled my kids out for the books in question in this case, but I also do not think your scenario would be a big concern.

The first Jewish book mine read was in high school. It’s pretty minimal but parents should get choice and the extremes need to go to be culturally sensitive to all. There are far better less offensive books that include all groups.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

What happens when parents their kids opt out of science class when evolution or anything related is taught?

Or science in general?

This is nuts

As parents, its their choice.

No..they are not educational authorities. They shouldn't have the authority to make the choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am curious why the Jewish and Muslim families who supported this opt out do not see how this opens the way for parents to push for opting out of having kids read story books with Jewish or Muslim characters on the basis of the religious burden that including these characters might do to Christian kids. Christian parents can argue that seeing these characters at a young age could be burdensome to their religious beliefs and that they want to introduce their kids to the existence of these types of beliefs when they are older. I think people forget that respecting diversity that includes your beliefs also means respecting diversity that does not. Anyways, I get why male, straight, Christian conservative white nationalists would celebrate this ruling. I disagree, but it makes sense. For anyone not part of this group, I do not understand.

I'm Muslim and don't support this and it's partly for the reasons you describe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

What happens when parents their kids opt out of science class when evolution or anything related is taught?

Or science in general?

This is nuts

As parents, its their choice.

No..they are not educational authorities. They shouldn't have the authority to make the choice.

This isn’t education. And, yes, parents get choice. Teaching tolerance means considering others needs and wishes. You are not a tolerant person.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am curious why the Jewish and Muslim families who supported this opt out do not see how this opens the way for parents to push for opting out of having kids read story books with Jewish or Muslim characters on the basis of the religious burden that including these characters might do to Christian kids. Christian parents can argue that seeing these characters at a young age could be burdensome to their religious beliefs and that they want to introduce their kids to the existence of these types of beliefs when they are older. I think people forget that respecting diversity that includes your beliefs also means respecting diversity that does not. Anyways, I get why male, straight, Christian conservative white nationalists would celebrate this ruling. I disagree, but it makes sense. For anyone not part of this group, I do not understand.

I am Jewish and if elementary school kids did not read books about Jewish characters I would not really care. In fact, my kids have not read any school books with Jewish characters in all their time in public school - and they are both in middle school. I would not have pulled my kids out for the books in question in this case, but I also do not think your scenario would be a big concern.

What about non-fiction books. They can also object because the history class's textbook depicts a belief against theirs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are 2 genders.

And all those troublesome intersex people, but why let biological reality get in the way of a dumb slogan?

That’s high school level biology/genetics curriculum, not kindergarten.

+1 just had this discussion with my 17 yr old DD who has a few gay friends, one who is her bff since 8. She said ES is not age appropriate to bring up these topics.

My older kid had a bff in ES whose parents were gay. It was just matter of fact for them - oh, my bff has two moms, and that was it. ES children don't delve too deeply into the whys and hows. They just accept it. There is no reason to teach them about the rest of the alphabet soup of genders at this age.

Ok. So you asked a cisgender, heterosexual teen, who presumably has cisgender heterosexual parents, and who also has a primarily cisgender and heterosexual peer group, and who has never been a parent, what she thought would be good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents? And you are offering this in the spirit of authority?

DP. Your question was “what’s good for queer kids and kids with same sex parents.” That’s not the charge of our elementary public school system. Getting confused about the mission of public school education is how we got into this situation.

It is absolutely the job of public education to reflect the everyday lives of students, and to create a welcoming environment in which they see their own reality reflected back to them. This contributes to classroom learning.

Then how about doing that for all groups, family styles and disabilities and not just your chosen favorite one.

That's the point! No one is saying only teach about LGBTQ families! Those of us who want "My Uncle's Wedding" read in school ALSO want other books reflecting diverse experiences. Lailah's Lunchbox, Jabari Jumps, Eyes the Kiss Corners, What Happened to You, The Girl who Thought in Pictures.

Why do you want to steal innocence from children? You should reflect on that during therapy.

You think teaching kids about the AAPI experience, or kids with disabilities, is "sealing their innocence?"

Wow.

Wow. This just shows the end agenda of the right-wingers. Nothing but perfect eugenic white families.

I’m not a right winger, I just think school should be for learning. Not your agenda.

Exactly, lets get back to basics. Let politics, personal beliefs, religion and all that to parents' outside the school. They spend more time on this nonsense than they do actual teaching.

Agreed. So why are people trying to force their personal agenda and religion on the school system by demanding the right to review and opt out of what books are read? Let the teachers teach and don't micromanage what books they use to do it or waste their time with having to figure out some complicated opt-out process for your special snowflake You can have your own religion and personal beliefs but you need to communicate those to your children outside of the schools, not tell the schools what they can and can't have in their books.

If you really read this ruling , this is actually another win from Montgomery County Public schools. Because they provided an opt out and they provided excused absences, teachers do not have to change their curriculum. They do not have to ban any books. They do not have to get rid of any of these books.

Yeah, right. You really think our schools have the staffing to pull kids out from classes every time a book like this gets read? They'll have to drop the books for everyone, it's just not feasible. (Or if they do manage to read them with opt outs and pull staff from their duties of actually helping kids to babysitting them because their parents are scared of a children's book, that's still an infuriating imposition of parents' religious beliefs on worsening the effectiveness of our school system. Keep your beliefs at home.)

They will keep it and do like holiday parties and pull out the kids to punish them. How about being culturally sensitive and aware and respecting other’s beliefs. Cultural sensitivity should go both ways and not just your one sided battle view. Keep your views at home if you want others too. Why do you get to impose your values on others but they aren’t allowed to say no? If they imposed their views on your kids, you’d want to be able to say no.

seriously, just have the religious kids in a separate class and on days where everyone else learns about gay people, they can pray instead. but they need to be separated in order to provide material for all kids.

What happens when parents their kids opt out of science class when evolution or anything related is taught?

Or science in general?

This is nuts

As parents, its their choice.

No..they are not educational authorities. They shouldn't have the authority to make the choice.

WTH is an “educational authority?” People who get degrees in education? You’ve got to be kidding.