I regret buying in ACPS...should we try to move before ES or wait until DC is older?

[Anonymous]

We feed into an ES on the West End which is decent (according to my neighbors) but not highly rated by Great Schools. (I know GS isn't the be-all-end-all arbiter of school quality.) Our school of course has a high % (>60%) of free/reduced lunch. Those in our demographic score well, but our demographic is a small minority at the school, which I'm OK with in theory but find myself worrying about it in reality. I liked the *idea* of diversity when we bought here, but as it turns out, our immediate neighborhood isn't very diverse NOR is it very friendly. Many people (most?) move out of the neighborhood by the time their children get near middle school and/or go private.

I'm now having regrets now about buying here. We did so primarily because of my commute (~15 min) and what we could afford inside the Beltway. DH has a longer reverse commute. Both of our jobs could theoretically take us into the city if we leave our current employers, which would be harder to do if we lived further out. DC1 will start K in 2017 if we start on time. I don't really want to move, as we will have only been in our house ~5 years if we sold next spring, so we'd probably only be around 70% LTV. There are also a lot of half-started upgrades we're working through as we can afford them, but if we had a year warning we could hopefully finish those up. I feel like we will outgrow our house by MS (poor layout for kids), but I was hoping to hold on to that great commute for a little bit longer and think that being close to my kids' school during the week is a big advantage. The MS/HS are quite poor and unlikely to improve, and it's unlikely that we could afford private on our incomes, so I feel like a move at SOME point is probably inevitable. We like the house but don't love it. Our neighborhood is OK, but maybe we'd feel better about it after we start ES and get to know families better? Most likely if we were to move we would be considering the West Springfield area for pricing, proximity to friends, public transport, proximity to DH work, and housing stock in our likely price range (~$600k in today's values). We would consider other areas, too. I think an area like N. Arlington would be really out of reach for us. Even S. Arl. would be a stretch at this point. Our incomes also won't increase much more than 3% a year, and home values in our zip seem to have stagnated.

I don't know what I'm looking for exactly. Maybe experiences from people who hung out in ACPS (and not the Lyles-Crouch/Charles Barrett/Maury) and were happy, or who moved out at some point and realized the grass really is greener? A friend who works at ACPS HQ tells me we have nothing to worry about at our ES, but I am worried. I also think pulling up and moving after establishing DC at ES might be disruptive, but maybe it wouldn't be at a lower grade?

I appreciate withholding the judgment and condescension. This was our first home purchase and a learning experience for us both. I know that ACPS schools are often disparaged on here, but when we bought our ES seemed OK enough. It has actually slid a bit on the GS ratings since we bought (probably one reason prices have stagnated). Thanks for any insight or thoughts you can share.

[Anonymous]

I can tell you that we have several friends with kids in ACPS elementary schools and they are happy with the schools their kids are in. That said, they are mostly planning to move before Middle School.

I can't blame people who move to ACPS- some of the neighborhoods are awesome and the housing stock is mostly a little nicer than what you can get for the same price in Arlington and the parts of Fairfax with highly-rated schools. (and you're closer-in than most of FFX.)

In your situation, I might consider looking in the FFX county parts of Alexandria - some of our friends found a great neighborhood that will eventually feed into West Potomac, and they are very happy. They aren't really further from DC, and they spent less than they would in Arlington, plus they got the large parks & rec system that is Fairfax vs. the smaller city of alexandria system.

[Anonymous]

Op, I would suggest doing some more homework to find out more about the school and actual family experiences there, instead of just having your generic concerns. Attend an open house. Find out about the PTA, consider attending a meeting even before you have a student there. We are in ACPS (not west end, but not one of the schools you listed in your post either), and I too had the "acps is crummy do we need to move" fears before my kid started. So I did some real homework, talked to people, etc and now four years later we are quite happy in our school, and I'm glad that I didn't uproot our family. I've said that we will have to do the same thing as MS approaches, because I do have some concerns (generic ones, much as I did about ES.) That being said, seeing older siblings of my child's friends head to MS, I'm wondering if my fears are unsubstantiated, much like they were re ES (hearing good reports from the sibs who have moved up). We're not at that point yet, but I'm definitely going to do as much as I can to get real data and input (not just rely on people who hang out on dcum) to make our decision. I think it would be helpful for you to do the same!

[Anonymous]

I am sure there are schools in ACPS that are excellent, but I would be wary of the West End. Eventually you feed into TC Williams too and you need to consider how you feel about that.

We were first time homebuyers too and did not know the area well so I hear you. I am, however, in the Fairfax section of Alexandria, which another poster suggested, and I would be careful there as well. I am very happy with our ES for my DS, but we are considering moving or switching to private for middle school and up. We knew this might be an issue going into this. The options here: Edison, Hayfield, South County, West Potomac aren't all that great.

[Anonymous]

OP, I agree with 11:31. In fact, I could have typed pretty much the same story. Given what you have written about your commute/job/financial situation, I would stay put. Make efforts to get to know the school and the families that are there already. Also - are there things you can do to get to know neighboring families with kids better? I know for us, our kid was in daycare/preschool in DC, which made it hard to know families headed to our school because the kids were from all over the metro area. We switched to a neighborhood preschool the year before K and developed a great social circle of families all going to our ACPS school. But maybe you have a citizens' association or neighborhood events. Now that we are headed for better weather it's a lot easier to meet people out and about at various activities. Overall, I'd say try it for K and see how it goes. Chances are you will be fine. And if not, you can make a more informed decision about moving. Kids handle moves to new schools - particularly in the early grades - a lot better than adults do for the most part. (And there should be good stuff coming to the West End over the next few years, so that property value may grow more than you might think.)

[Anonymous]

Op. Where are you and DH commuting to? That might help us with suggestions. If possible it would be good to move before k so that your child doesnt have to change schools and interest rates are low now. But if it makes you feel better I went to an ACPS elementary with a high farms rate back in the 70s/80s and did very well in school and I'm a gainfully employed professional. So the education must've been decent. of course that was a long time ago but the basic point is the farms rate doesn't tell the whole story.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can tell you that we have several friends with kids in ACPS elementary schools and they are happy with the schools their kids are in. That said, they are mostly planning to move before Middle School.

I can't blame people who move to ACPS- some of the neighborhoods are awesome and the housing stock is mostly a little nicer than what you can get for the same price in Arlington and the parts of Fairfax with highly-rated schools. (and you're closer-in than most of FFX.)

In your situation, I might consider looking in the FFX county parts of Alexandria - some of our friends found a great neighborhood that will eventually feed into West Potomac, and they are very happy. They aren't really further from DC, and they spent less than they would in Arlington, plus they got the large parks & rec system that is Fairfax vs. the smaller city of alexandria system.

She said she wanted a better school district. Alexandria, Fairfax County does not offer that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can tell you that we have several friends with kids in ACPS elementary schools and they are happy with the schools their kids are in. That said, they are mostly planning to move before Middle School.

I can't blame people who move to ACPS- some of the neighborhoods are awesome and the housing stock is mostly a little nicer than what you can get for the same price in Arlington and the parts of Fairfax with highly-rated schools. (and you're closer-in than most of FFX.)

In your situation, I might consider looking in the FFX county parts of Alexandria - some of our friends found a great neighborhood that will eventually feed into West Potomac, and they are very happy. They aren't really further from DC, and they spent less than they would in Arlington, plus they got the large parks & rec system that is Fairfax vs. the smaller city of alexandria system.

She said she wanted a better school district. Alexandria, Fairfax County does not offer that.

OP here, and yes, we actually looked at that area extensively when we bought 4 years ago. We decided that for the commute (especially if into the city) it wasn't worth it. There are some nice neighborhoods, and we have friends there, too, but it seems that the area suffers from some of the same issues City of Alexandria does and the schools don't seem to be much better.

To answer other PP's question, DH is in Lorton/Springfield area off 95 and I'm near the Pentagon. If we were to change jobs in DC in our current fields, we'd probably stay in the same areas or be somewhere in downtown DC.

[Anonymous]

Maybe the West Springfield pyramid at some point? Both Irving MS and West Springfield HS are good, although Springfield would be a pain for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We feed into an ES on the West End which is decent (according to my neighbors) but not highly rated by Great Schools. (I know GS isn't the be-all-end-all arbiter of school quality.) Our school of course has a high % (>60%) of free/reduced lunch. Those in our demographic score well, but our demographic is a small minority at the school, which I'm OK with in theory but find myself worrying about it in reality. I liked the *idea* of diversity when we bought here, but as it turns out, our immediate neighborhood isn't very diverse NOR is it very friendly. Many people (most?) move out of the neighborhood by the time their children get near middle school and/or go private.

I'm now having regrets now about buying here. We did so primarily because of my commute (~15 min) and what we could afford inside the Beltway. DH has a longer reverse commute. Both of our jobs could theoretically take us into the city if we leave our current employers, which would be harder to do if we lived further out. DC1 will start K in 2017 if we start on time. I don't really want to move, as we will have only been in our house ~5 years if we sold next spring, so we'd probably only be around 70% LTV. There are also a lot of half-started upgrades we're working through as we can afford them, but if we had a year warning we could hopefully finish those up. I feel like we will outgrow our house by MS (poor layout for kids), but I was hoping to hold on to that great commute for a little bit longer and think that being close to my kids' school during the week is a big advantage. The MS/HS are quite poor and unlikely to improve, and it's unlikely that we could afford private on our incomes, so I feel like a move at SOME point is probably inevitable. We like the house but don't love it. Our neighborhood is OK, but maybe we'd feel better about it after we start ES and get to know families better? Most likely if we were to move we would be considering the West Springfield area for pricing, proximity to friends, public transport, proximity to DH work, and housing stock in our likely price range (~$600k in today's values). We would consider other areas, too. I think an area like N. Arlington would be really out of reach for us. Even S. Arl. would be a stretch at this point. Our incomes also won't increase much more than 3% a year, and home values in our zip seem to have stagnated.

I don't know what I'm looking for exactly. Maybe experiences from people who hung out in ACPS (and not the Lyles-Crouch/Charles Barrett/Maury) and were happy, or who moved out at some point and realized the grass really is greener? A friend who works at ACPS HQ tells me we have nothing to worry about at our ES, but I am worried. I also think pulling up and moving after establishing DC at ES might be disruptive, but maybe it wouldn't be at a lower grade?

I appreciate withholding the judgment and condescension. This was our first home purchase and a learning experience for us both. I know that ACPS schools are often disparaged on here, but when we bought our ES seemed OK enough. It has actually slid a bit on the GS ratings since we bought (probably one reason prices have stagnated). Thanks for any insight or thoughts you can share.

This reality is what made me pull the plug pre-K. I just wanted to start school somewhere and be settled in a community and know we were committed and ok with the options all the way through HS. And it's pretty great to not worry about it. No sweating middle school, high school, boundaries, etc.

Don't regret moving at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I agree with 11:31. In fact, I could have typed pretty much the same story. Given what you have written about your commute/job/financial situation, I would stay put. Make efforts to get to know the school and the families that are there already. Also - are there things you can do to get to know neighboring families with kids better? I know for us, our kid was in daycare/preschool in DC, which made it hard to know families headed to our school because the kids were from all over the metro area. We switched to a neighborhood preschool the year before K and developed a great social circle of families all going to our ACPS school. But maybe you have a citizens' association or neighborhood events. Now that we are headed for better weather it's a lot easier to meet people out and about at various activities. Overall, I'd say try it for K and see how it goes. Chances are you will be fine. And if not, you can make a more informed decision about moving. Kids handle moves to new schools - particularly in the early grades - a lot better than adults do for the most part. (And there should be good stuff coming to the West End over the next few years, so that property value may grow more than you might think.)

The West End "development"...lol. We've been waiting on that since we bought here! Can't wait to see if something actually happens this summer! Fingers crossed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the West Springfield pyramid at some point? Both Irving MS and West Springfield HS are good, although Springfield would be a pain for you.

Would it really be terrible to the Pentagon from there? I worried it would be which was ultimately why we ended up in Alexandria in the first place. What's a realistic commute time for arriving by 7:30? Leaving at 5? I probably am not interested in slugging but would consider driving sluggers. Aren't there non-stop buses to the Pentagon, too?

[Anonymous]

NP here: we have a similar story, but not ACPS, just eastern part of FFX. We moved into our first home and loved the amenities and commute to DC for work. Once we started a family and grew that family to multiple kids, we worried about the schools. In particular, the high school in our pyramid. After sending first 2 kids through ES and MS, it was time to move. We just couldn't shake the anxiety of having our kids in such low-performing schools and wanted something different for the younger kids. It was a very big decision, and selling a home is not for faint hearted, but we are now happy to move into another district. In fact, hubby's commute turned out to be the same, we pay lower in mortgage due to better interest rates, and got a much bigger home for the money. So, no regrets here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op, I would suggest doing some more homework to find out more about the school and actual family experiences there, instead of just having your generic concerns. Attend an open house. Find out about the PTA, consider attending a meeting even before you have a student there. We are in ACPS (not west end, but not one of the schools you listed in your post either), and I too had the "acps is crummy do we need to move" fears before my kid started. So I did some real homework, talked to people, etc and now four years later we are quite happy in our school, and I'm glad that I didn't uproot our family. I've said that we will have to do the same thing as MS approaches, because I do have some concerns (generic ones, much as I did about ES.) That being said, seeing older siblings of my child's friends head to MS, I'm wondering if my fears are unsubstantiated, much like they were re ES (hearing good reports from the sibs who have moved up). We're not at that point yet, but I'm definitely going to do as much as I can to get real data and input (not just rely on people who hang out on dcum) to make our decision. I think it would be helpful for you to do the same!

We are in the West End too, similar experience but we love our house and neighbors. I went to the Kindergarten open house this year at our currently districted school and was blown away by the polish and professionalism of teachers and the behavior and work the kids were doing-- yes, there were a lot of kids on free lunch and most didn't look like my kid, but I was really impressed. (As a point of reference, our child is currently in a very well regarded preschool). I've also joined the PTA list. A couple of big unknowns on the West End... A new school is likely to be opened in 2017 b/t Ramsay and Tucker, pulling overflow from those schools. That will not only change boundaries but kids from those schools may leave where they have been reassigned to and go to that new school. Do you think you will be affected by redistricting-- that is another piece. The last piece is the massive redevelopment that will take place over the next few years-- the Beauregard Plan and others will be full swing my middle school years. At least on predictions that could cause numbers to plummet at ES and definitely by the time your kids are at Hammond.

We are watching things closely this year and haven't ruled anything out yet, but having done the research, I'm cautiously optimistic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I agree with 11:31. In fact, I could have typed pretty much the same story. Given what you have written about your commute/job/financial situation, I would stay put. Make efforts to get to know the school and the families that are there already. Also - are there things you can do to get to know neighboring families with kids better? I know for us, our kid was in daycare/preschool in DC, which made it hard to know families headed to our school because the kids were from all over the metro area. We switched to a neighborhood preschool the year before K and developed a great social circle of families all going to our ACPS school. But maybe you have a citizens' association or neighborhood events. Now that we are headed for better weather it's a lot easier to meet people out and about at various activities. Overall, I'd say try it for K and see how it goes. Chances are you will be fine. And if not, you can make a more informed decision about moving. Kids handle moves to new schools - particularly in the early grades - a lot better than adults do for the most part. (And there should be good stuff coming to the West End over the next few years, so that property value may grow more than you might think.)

The West End "development"...lol. We've been waiting on that since we bought here! Can't wait to see if something actually happens this summer! Fingers crossed.

Me too. Dumb we are. They got our tax money all these years. Hurry up Alexandria City Council and spend on the West End!