Tell me about St Andrews in Scotland

[Anonymous]

I’m the pp who said one of the op’s was having an American-style tantrum and based on the pages of responses and ranting about your specific situation with your child, I stand by my comment more strongly.

The Op”s question was to learn about StAndrews. You told your story once. In detail. Fine. Then when others shared different experiences and perspectives you proceeded to hijack this thread to come back time and again to validate what you see as the great injustices perpetrated on your child. It’s enough already.

Our child goes there and loves it. Student services are not what they are in the US -everyone gets that, but you seem to have a mission to make your specific experience a cautionary tale. It is unfortunate your child was ill but in reading the details of your experience it does sound like your child may not have done some of the things they should have in terms of notifying the university of their situation. We get you think the university acted to harshly but that does not mean that is relevant to all readers.

To original Poster. There are so many pro’s to the school- great academics, wonderful school traditions and spirit, great societies and social opportunities, quaint atmosphere. Low price in comparison to some US schools, ability to travel, lots of internationalKids
Downsides: weather, housing crunch, no handholding from the school.
It’s not perfect but our child is thriving and learning and becoming way more independent living overseas.

[Anonymous]

Gotcha. I am sincerely happy your child is having a good experience there. I am glad you like it.

[Anonymous]

The original poster started this thread in 2021

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hi My DC is OBSESSED with St Andrew's in Scotland, based on pictures online, the website and anecdotal info. He is a junior so we have a little time. Hopefully, maybe we can visit it things calm down with Covid.

Can you tell me the good, the bad, the ugly, the unexpected etc. THANKS!

“Can you tell me the good, the bad, the ugly, the unexpected” from the OP

I don’t think the recent poster who shared stories about dealing with the administration and health services was hijacking this thread at all. In fact, the Stoxbridge poster(s)kept asking for clarification and details over and over again. There also seemed to be multiple posters chiming in, not just one. As a current parent, I think it’s helpful to hear these stories. That doesn’t mean I like the school any less.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hey there! I'm the current parent with an "agenda" mentioned in the post you just quoted. According to them I am in the midst of an entitled American-style tantrum. We are actually a nice, low-key family that doesn't make waves at schools. We also don't require smoothie bars and think dorm food is fine. In fact, we really like St Andrews. But- St Andrews has been a mixed bag for us. In our case- undiagnosed covid during 2021, leading to long covid, leading to bad grades because it was too late to drop classes at the time this was happening, was a huge stumbling block that was not forgiven by the University. I have had all manner of snide remarks hurled at me for this unfortunate situation and it's a real eye opener. It has been truly disappointing the school was not willing to be more flexible. If our student had been enrolled stateside, we would have just jumped in the car to bring them home. Health situation would have been treated sooner, crisis averted. Despite the amount of recruiting they do here, St Andrews hasn't been flexible for us in this situation even though it was exacerbated by being an international student.

I think people forget long covid is a real issue for a handful of people. My daughter got it second semester senior year. She was fainting and for some weird reason had trouble reading. Her NE SLAC was amazing! She got books on tape. Had more time. Some assignments were thrown out. If we hadn't gotten accommodations, she would not have graduated. And when you feel really sick it's hard to have tge energy to get accommodations. We are lucky. She recovered. Took a little over a year. And while she had been a speed reader now reads at a normal speed. All good with us. So if a school doesn't help their sick students. I'd be wary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:in a country with a national health service, it makes very little sense for universities to run their own health system. you can learn to use the system in the country in which you are residing. that would take a little effort.

Have you lived in the UK? Unless you are private pay, clinics are wildly understaffed. There isn't any except private clinics in St Andrews that sees sick kids. (Yhe hospital there treats injuries only) You have to travel to dundee. Social medicine is great for the pocket book buy you pay on long waits and inconveniences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The folks in student services are wonderful. I know of three private school students who have had to leave St A in the last 3 years, not because they couldn’t handle the work, but because the admin wouldn’t forgive various protocol irregularities. These wouldn’t have been major issues to hammer out in a stateside school, but the UK approach doesn’t offer a way to work through these types of problems. They expel you, and then you can reapply if you want.

What type of irregularities?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:in a country with a national health service, it makes very little sense for universities to run their own health system. you can learn to use the system in the country in which you are residing. that would take a little effort.

Have you lived in the UK? Unless you are private pay, clinics are wildly understaffed. There isn't any except private clinics in St Andrews that sees sick kids. (Yhe hospital there treats injuries only) You have to travel to dundee. Social medicine is great for the pocket book buy you pay on long waits and inconveniences.

If you have broken bones or overdoses or any emergency, local is fine. But any longer term issue, travel to the big city. Which is a bus ride away. Kids commute that far just to give an idea of journey.

It’s not a lot different than going to a place like Bates in this way.

[Anonymous]

Our DC is there and had a persistent cough. Paid 80 pounds to see a local practitioner rather than go to Dundee. Also got inexpensive cough medicine with Codeine and antibiotics directly from the pharmacist. So for a few bucks more than our $50 copay in the US our child saw a doctor and got cheap medication. We feel like that small extra expense is a fine tradeoff to paying 90K a year a private US school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The folks in student services are wonderful. I know of three private school students who have had to leave St A in the last 3 years, not because they couldn’t handle the work, but because the admin wouldn’t forgive various protocol irregularities. These wouldn’t have been major issues to hammer out in a stateside school, but the UK approach doesn’t offer a way to work through these types of problems. They expel you, and then you can reapply if you want.

What type of irregularities?

Not reporting a diagnosed chronic illness in time to have poor grades resulting from those illnesses excused and allowing the students the ability to retake the classes and remain enrolled. (For two students I know - that meant long covid that interferes with an ability to do well academically. They didn’t know what illness they had at the time it was happening, that was the problem. For one student it was chronic
migraines possibly covid induced possible Lyme. Murky.). University policies re illness were written before covid times. Some students are lucky enough to get sympathetic professors reading their academic appeals asking for
a second chance to make up failed work due to illness. But a lot aren’t. And before you jump all over me saying Americans are having tantrums, I’d like to add I’ve heard promising news from the University that these policies are being changed in light of world events and common sense. So -it pays to work with the University toward change. It’s just happening slowly. The way St Andrews has handled dozens and dozens of these cases since the beginning of
Lockdowns meant leaning on their old policies which aren’t very flexible, but times changed and it sounds like the University is beginning to change with them. American outspokenness was probably a good thing in this case.

[Anonymous]

You can't retake classes at Stanford (and I assume other schools) if you dont drop before add/drop. It messes up the system to have kids who have already taken a class (and not been graded for whatever reason) to take the exact same class again.

Even for legit medical reasons you can't do this. Even if you drop out of college and reenroll.

I've never heard of getting a grade already recorded "excused" for any reason at a university.

[Anonymous]

Just to clarify- I meant before *anyone accuses me of an American tantrum- namely that one Stockbridge poster. St Andrew’s is a special place, but it’s got flaws that American intl students should consider. It’s perfectly ok to work toward sensible change if the need exists. If that Stockbridge poster is American, they sound like the type of American who takes a two week holiday in Europe and returns home with an accent and a disdain for all things American. lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just to clarify- I meant before *anyone accuses me of an American tantrum- namely that one Stockbridge poster. St Andrew’s is a special place, but it’s got flaws that American intl students should consider. It’s perfectly ok to work toward sensible change if the need exists. If that Stockbridge poster is American, they sound like the type of American who takes a two week holiday in Europe and returns home with an accent and a disdain for all things American. lol

Legit medical reasons- exactly! They were not excusing legit medical reasons, but hopefully that’s changing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You can't retake classes at Stanford (and I assume other schools) if you dont drop before add/drop. It messes up the system to have kids who have already taken a class (and not been graded for whatever reason) to take the exact same class again.

Even for legit medical reasons you can't do this. Even if you drop out of college and reenroll.

I've never heard of getting a grade already recorded "excused" for any reason at a university.

Legit medical reasons- exactly! They were not excusing legit medical reasons but that’s changing.

[Anonymous]

American Universities more sensitive to lawsuits and willing to work with students. Maybe not Stanford as poster mentions, but Stanford is usually the exception rather than the rule in many ways. All of this is anecdotal. It sounds like St Andrews is becoming more open minded about situations they didn’t need to be open minded about five years ago.