Are top private colleges mainly for poor people now?

[Anonymous]

It's fun when the 529 account you sacrificed your retirement savings for and that covers two-thirds of one bachelor's degree ($290,000) entirely disqualifies you from any need-based financial aid that would potentially make the T20 school one of your kids got in to affordable. It's a fun thing, though. And this is when the anti-doughnut-hole troll will come in and say we should have aborted them when we found out they were twins just so eighteen years later we could pay for Cornell for no one who exists.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I was raised in foster care and got my education ( BS and MS) from my state flagship. I worked a number of jobs through college. I also got some aid. I specifically chose a state university because it was the most affordable.

Now, I am in a responsible job and am paying full freight for my kid.

Why do low income kids think they should get aid to attend an expensive private school? This was not even in my thought process when I was trying to get through school. Why isn’t the state school good enough? It was for me and many of my friends.

My kid got accepted to a private college. Nice but no aid for $60,000 per year. Yet the school doles out all these first gen scholarships and me tori g programs and other URM programs out the wazoo. We are going to turn down the private college. It’s too costly for us.

Why do low incom kids think they should get aid to attend expensive private schools? I don't think they do. I think the colleges WANT them. The colleges think that private colleges are entitled to spend their endowment $ to provide financial asisstance as they see fits their vision. Do you think private colleges aren't entitled to make those decisions? If so, why not?

So the low income families are entitled (based on a decision made by the schools rather themselves) to a free private education while the middle income are not (and therefore cannot realistically access it). So some people are entitled and some are not

+1. Yes. The colleges have deemed some more worthy than others.

The colleges have "deemed" it important to include students from a variety of backgrounds, including socioeconomically. They have decided that these "lower income" kids would never be able to attend without this assistance, and they are 100% accurate about that.

You find issue with the fact they have "deemed" it possible for a kid from a $200K+ family to attend without any or much assistance. Shockingly, they expect someone who is in the upper 10% of families to be able to find a way to save for a product they desire. You are upset you have chosen not to save or save enough.

Seriously, do some of you go around complaining that people get food stamps and low income housing?

Yes I do. Particularly if they are irresponsible and have multiple kids they cannot afford. I used my head. I had one kid because I couldn’t afford many. Conscious choice.

And what should a 17 year old applicant do who has 6 siblings? Is that in their control?

State school. Community college to state school.

Why should a talented poor student go to community college while a rich talented student goes to a top private college?

Because not all are so talented

The same question could be asked- why should the child of a low income family go to a private college at no cost while the child of a middle class “plus” family will not be able to go because her parents are unwilling and realistically unable to pay for it?

Because there are many kids like her whose parents are willing and able to pay for it. The low income kid with the grades and ability to succeed at tippy top privates who know enough to apply are more rare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's fun when the 529 account you sacrificed your retirement savings for and that covers two-thirds of one bachelor's degree ($290,000) entirely disqualifies you from any need-based financial aid that would potentially make the T20 school one of your kids got in to affordable. It's a fun thing, though. And this is when the anti-doughnut-hole troll will come in and say we should have aborted them when we found out they were twins just so eighteen years later we could pay for Cornell for no one who exists.

But hey you are “privileged.” So just take a knee and be grateful.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:You’re free to quit your job if being poor is so awesome. *Crickets*

I suspect a lot of families do somehow game the financial aid system this way. Like maybe one parent stops working. Getting 320k of aid bears a pre tax income of 80k or whatever

We are admittedly considering this but for different reasons. Does it work, and how far in advance is it important to do this? (How many years back with tax records)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The ridiculous thing about the title and premise of this thread is that it would actually be great if there were genuinely colleges for poor people. But there aren't.

Poor students only get into top colleges if they win several lotteries: the lottery of intellectual ability that makes it possible for them to do well enough in school to gain admission, the lottery of enough function and stability in their lives (rare in poor families) to actually attend K-12 and graduate, the lottery of avoiding enough major set backs like mental and physical illness (both much more likely in people living in poverty).

And then, even if they win these lotteries and get into one of these colleges and receive a full ride scholarship, they have to navigate a world they've never before been a part of and do well enough to graduate from college. They may have had access to weak K-12 education options so they may find themselves underprepared compared to wealthier classmates, and most will also have serious deficits in terms of the social knowledge to navigate these spaces.

The idea that these schools are "for" poor kids is laughable, they are designed for and by very privileged people.

But what if we had a public education system that was actually designed for poor people? Instead of public colleges where costs continue to skyrocket, community colleges where quality can be poor and where the terminal degree often does not make you marketable on the job market, or for-profit colleges designed to exploit people with limited financial resources or awareness.

Oh, and also some percentage of seats at top colleges go to the very tippy top most qualified poor students in the country who managed to navigate poverty in the US of A and come out functional enough to attend Harvard or whatever. Oh no, a tragedy.

Thank you for writing this out. This thread is exhausting to read.

I get why people are responding like this. If your kid is in range for one of these privates, you know how hard they have worked. How they have put their blood and sweat into building their resume and how rightly proud you are of their accomplishments. It is galling to hear that they cannot get anything they wanted after all this work because they are priced out of some of their top choices. But try to understand that for the kids who make it as far as your kid from a lower income bracket have had to beat even more odds and even with financial aid, have barriers you (and I) cannot understand.

If you want to rail at something, perhaps rail against these schools accepting 15% of their student body from the top 1%. But has been pointed out several times - these are private institutions and can do what they want.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I didn’t know poor people make $150k or $100k.

Yeah, that's us, and I consider us middle class. Do the $200k+ people really think they are middle class? Maybe UMC at closest.

I make $70k. DH makes $150k. But because he's military, people consider us working class. And we certainly couldn't afford $80k a year in tuition.

You can make 150k in the military?

Yes? The salaries are public.

Then why do the military officers need such large subsidies?

Subisidies for

housing - premium
food - commissary
medical care - free and discounted for life

Rent Free for a year!!!

I would rather pay exorbitant combat pay stipends, rather than be on the hook for a lifetime of subsidies to double-dipping and triple-dipping "veterans" who never saw action.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I didn’t know poor people make $150k or $100k.

Yeah, that's us, and I consider us middle class. Do the $200k+ people really think they are middle class? Maybe UMC at closest.

I make $70k. DH makes $150k. But because he's military, people consider us working class. And we certainly couldn't afford $80k a year in tuition.

You can make 150k in the military?

Yes? The salaries are public.

Then why do the military officers need such large subsidies?

Subisidies for

housing - premium
food - commissary
medical care - free and discounted for life

Rent Free for a year!!!

I would rather pay exorbitant combat pay stipends, rather than be on the hook for a lifetime of subsidies to double-dipping and triple-dipping "veterans" who never saw action.

+1 An unpopular sentiment. But many first-line public sector emergency workers are at risk with no guaranteed subsidies.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I didn’t know poor people make $150k or $100k.

Yeah, that's us, and I consider us middle class. Do the $200k+ people really think they are middle class? Maybe UMC at closest.

I make $70k. DH makes $150k. But because he's military, people consider us working class. And we certainly couldn't afford $80k a year in tuition.

You can make 150k in the military?

Yes? The salaries are public.

Then why do the military officers need such large subsidies?

Subisidies for

housing - premium
food - commissary
medical care - free and discounted for life

Rent Free for a year!!!

I would rather pay exorbitant combat pay stipends, rather than be on the hook for a lifetime of subsidies to double-dipping and triple-dipping "veterans" who never saw action.

What do you mean by double and triple dipping?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I didn’t know poor people make $150k or $100k.

Yeah, that's us, and I consider us middle class. Do the $200k+ people really think they are middle class? Maybe UMC at closest.

I make $70k. DH makes $150k. But because he's military, people consider us working class. And we certainly couldn't afford $80k a year in tuition.

You can make 150k in the military?

Yes? The salaries are public.

Then why do the military officers need such large subsidies?

Subisidies for

housing - premium
food - commissary
medical care - free and discounted for life

Rent Free for a year!!!

I would rather pay exorbitant combat pay stipends, rather than be on the hook for a lifetime of subsidies to double-dipping and triple-dipping "veterans" who never saw action.

What do you mean by double and triple dipping?

See Beltway Bandits. Defense contractors. Paying contractors to procure one hammer for $2,500. A waste of taxpayer money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's fun when the 529 account you sacrificed your retirement savings for and that covers two-thirds of one bachelor's degree ($290,000) entirely disqualifies you from any need-based financial aid that would potentially make the T20 school one of your kids got in to affordable. It's a fun thing, though. And this is when the anti-doughnut-hole troll will come in and say we should have aborted them when we found out they were twins just so eighteen years later we could pay for Cornell for no one who exists.

Should not sacrifice retirement for a 529 savings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You’re free to quit your job if being poor is so awesome. *Crickets*

I suspect a lot of families do somehow game the financial aid system this way. Like maybe one parent stops working. Getting 320k of aid bears a pre tax income of 80k or whatever

We are admittedly considering this but for different reasons. Does it work, and how far in advance is it important to do this? (How many years back with tax records)?

Won't work if you have savings/assets

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's fun when the 529 account you sacrificed your retirement savings for and that covers two-thirds of one bachelor's degree ($290,000) entirely disqualifies you from any need-based financial aid that would potentially make the T20 school one of your kids got in to affordable. It's a fun thing, though. And this is when the anti-doughnut-hole troll will come in and say we should have aborted them when we found out they were twins just so eighteen years later we could pay for Cornell for no one who exists.

So you saved in the 529 account. That means you have the money to pay. Right?