ECNL moving to school year not calendar

[Anonymous]

We need another blurry email to give BY wackos some hope if we have any chance of seeing 400. We're dangerously close to stating truths and statistics. SY won in a landslide based on math and economics. But please don't prove that quite yet or the party is over.

[Anonymous]

I'm really confused. But excited to see the motivation to get to 400. Why not 500???

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Just a quick note from a parent of a trapped player (Q4). She is best technical player on her team (top 100 nationally) and one of the most valuable in terms of wins and losses, but she is small. I want the status quo as the other two options are not as good. She can either A) stay on the current team but now there will be even bigger/older girls by an additional 5 months so she could be playing with girls 14/15 months. older or B) drop down and totally outclass her correct grade. Both options worse in my eyes.

Also, I dont think trapped, for recruiting purposes, is a big deal at all. Your club should be advocating for you, you should be advocating for you, you should be attending ID camps, etc. If you use trapped as a recruiting excuse it means you aren't trying hard enough. Period.

For girls it's off. Unless you have a U17 or U19 kid, you have no idea what you're talking about. As a trap youre recruitment window is not the same as the majority of your team. Your coach knows this and will hopefully push the kids in the recruitment window forward because it's their time in showcases. When it is your time, you are on a team of seniors. The colleges you want won't be attending your showcases as a young trap player (a junior) in U19. These colleges are looking for seniors who aren't committed yet, mostly smaller schools. Most U19 can't cobble a team together too because half of them are already committed in ECNL and seniors are busy with school and less committed to their team. We in this situation now. U17 isn't any better.as a trap player. Sure, you're playing with kids in the recruitment window, but you aren't . You have a wait another year. SY is best if the end run is recruitment. And ECNL is all about college. This change needs to happen in spring for tryouts so trapped kids are in their window for recruitment. It's more complicated for trap players.

Two best friends are both college soccer coaches. One on boys side and one on girls side. I asked them about this whole dynamic. They said they 100% know about trapped players because they are usually some of the top players in the recruiting class by virtue of them being good enough to make a top team even though they are on the younger side. So to say they get lost in recruiting is a bit of a fallacy. They both did say it would be easier for them to recruit when all the kids are same recruiting class so they are advocates for the change. They also said ID camps are more important to them for recruiting purposes than watching games (in person or video) because they can control the situation, set up specific match ups, move kids into different positions, run specific drills to determine skills, etc.

And once again! Problem solved. No need for change, lol. 20% of recruited kids are January and 5% are from December because Dec kids just need to try harder. Your buddy knows about the Dec kid but for some reason he's not recruiting them. I wonder why...hmmmmm.

Because they are not good enough I suppose? So now you are arguing RAE, not trapped player dynamics? News flash, RAE doesnt change with an artificial birth date range. So now it will be 20% September and 5% August in the future? Try to follow along. Trapped player is a different thing than RAE. A good player is a good player regardless of when they were born.

Now your catching up...nice job! Your correct...20% of future recruited kids will absolutely be September. Nobody is arguing about RAE. It exists and we need to decide where to put it. So ask yourself, does SY make sense or does CY make sense? Its not even a hard question. The current setup is a joke. Combined senior years, missing 8th grade time, recruiting challenges, social challenges when your whole team moves to junior high or HS. If you don't have a trapped kid you don't get it, its a debacle. And its a debacle that never had an upside. Is our National Team stronger because we switched?

Clarification, the switch to CY wasn't meant to improve adult national teams, it was meant to improve youth national teams.

For adult national team, they will pull players from the oldest months based on youth age cutoffs no matter what the cutoffs are.

Reducing the relative age effect at the youth level would help the national teams by giving the younger players a better chance to rise up but addressing the relative age effect has been given nothing more than lip service.

+1. The move to BY was about improving *youth* national team finishes and MLS transfer fees to Europe. At the time of the change, that’s who controlled US Soccer. Since then, those people are gone, and youth soccer reps have gained more control. Unless your kid is going to play for the YNT or MLS, you are more than likely arguing for BY simply because the cutoff helps your kid make a better rec team (even most college soccer is ultimately rec in the context of one’s life) consequences to everyone else be damned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Our director is talking about forming SY teams and having them play up since 25/26 is now a wash. So the 2012 age group is now Aug 1 2012 to July 31 2013. 2013 is now Aug 1 2013 to July 31 2014

Where do Q3 kids who started school early go under the new approach? For example, October 2013 birthday currently playing U12 and already in 6th grade? The above cutoffs would move them down a soccer year, but that would have them playing with kids a grade below them. Maybe an advantage playing against younger kids, but they’re already used to playing with older kids and moving down would mess up their recruiting cycle.

I don’t feel bad for kids who started school early or late. It’s a problem of your own making.

Did someone ask for your sympathy? I’m just trying to understand if the new system is based on the calendar or actual grade.

Its not based on grade and nobody wants that. They have it in other sports and it quickly incentivizes parents to hold kids back in school by ridiculous amounts. Majority of people want it by school dates either 8/1 or 9/1. If you pushed your kid to start school early then sports is going to suffer big time. I assume most parents know that by know and didn't care back when they were 5 or had tough economic circumstances and needed to start early. I feel bad but in these scenarios, even a very talented kid will struggle to play college ball.

Could they take a gap year between high school and college to get back to the “right” school grade, where they’d compare favorably from an athletic perspective?

Not sure I follow. If they graduate HS and didn't get recruited, then they take a year off, will their chances improved of getting a scholarship? Not in my opinion, no. The damage is done. If you started your kid in school a year early its a bad strategy for sports. Your kid would need to significantly above average in athletics and an early bloomer to outshine older kids. Doesn't mean it won't happen, its just tough. You could repeat a grade now to get them back on track. I don't advocate for manipulating academics for sports but just throwing out options depending on your priorities.

You’re a Q3 kid who is among the youngest on your current BY ECNL team yet are still good enough to start. Next year you’ll be among the oldest and clearly one of the best players on your SY team. Because you started school early, you’re a junior when your teammates are sophomores, but you manage the recruiting process as if you’re a sophomore, get a D-1 offer at the beginning of your senior year (when your teammates are getting their D-1 offers at the beginning of their junior year), but it’s for a full academic year after you graduate from highschool (when your club teammates are seniors). You graduate a year ahead of your teammates, spend a year taking random college classes at a local school and/or doing an internship, while still playing with your same club team and teammates, then start college the following year.

Not sure how it works but a gap year is definitely possible between graduating high school and playing D-1 soccer. There are programs in Europe that specifically cater to the gap year concept by giving US kids a place to play during their gap year. Doubt they’d be allowed to continue playing for their US youth club after graduating high school even though they’re eligible from an age perspective.

[Anonymous]

Who’s going to pay for that year in Europe? Another option would be to fix the trapped player issue, then there’s no reason to have a gap year in Europe.

[Anonymous]

We need more posts from the BY guy who posted the 5 steps of SY grief.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just a quick note from a parent of a trapped player (Q4). She is best technical player on her team (top 100 nationally) and one of the most valuable in terms of wins and losses, but she is small. I want the status quo as the other two options are not as good. She can either A) stay on the current team but now there will be even bigger/older girls by an additional 5 months so she could be playing with girls 14/15 months. older or B) drop down and totally outclass her correct grade. Both options worse in my eyes.

Also, I dont think trapped, for recruiting purposes, is a big deal at all. Your club should be advocating for you, you should be advocating for you, you should be attending ID camps, etc. If you use trapped as a recruiting excuse it means you aren't trying hard enough. Period.

For girls it's off. Unless you have a U17 or U19 kid, you have no idea what you're talking about. As a trap youre recruitment window is not the same as the majority of your team. Your coach knows this and will hopefully push the kids in the recruitment window forward because it's their time in showcases. When it is your time, you are on a team of seniors. The colleges you want won't be attending your showcases as a young trap player (a junior) in U19. These colleges are looking for seniors who aren't committed yet, mostly smaller schools. Most U19 can't cobble a team together too because half of them are already committed in ECNL and seniors are busy with school and less committed to their team. We in this situation now. U17 isn't any better.as a trap player. Sure, you're playing with kids in the recruitment window, but you aren't . You have a wait another year. SY is best if the end run is recruitment. And ECNL is all about college. This change needs to happen in spring for tryouts so trapped kids are in their window for recruitment. It's more complicated for trap players.

Two best friends are both college soccer coaches. One on boys side and one on girls side. I asked them about this whole dynamic. They said they 100% know about trapped players because they are usually some of the top players in the recruiting class by virtue of them being good enough to make a top team even though they are on the younger side. So to say they get lost in recruiting is a bit of a fallacy. They both did say it would be easier for them to recruit when all the kids are same recruiting class so they are advocates for the change. They also said ID camps are more important to them for recruiting purposes than watching games (in person or video) because they can control the situation, set up specific match ups, move kids into different positions, run specific drills to determine skills, etc.

And once again! Problem solved. No need for change, lol. 20% of recruited kids are January and 5% are from December because Dec kids just need to try harder. Your buddy knows about the Dec kid but for some reason he's not recruiting them. I wonder why...hmmmmm.

Because they are not good enough I suppose? So now you are arguing RAE, not trapped player dynamics? News flash, RAE doesnt change with an artificial birth date range. So now it will be 20% September and 5% August in the future? Try to follow along. Trapped player is a different thing than RAE. A good player is a good player regardless of when they were born.

Now your catching up...nice job! Your correct...20% of future recruited kids will absolutely be September. Nobody is arguing about RAE. It exists and we need to decide where to put it. So ask yourself, does SY make sense or does CY make sense? Its not even a hard question. The current setup is a joke. Combined senior years, missing 8th grade time, recruiting challenges, social challenges when your whole team moves to junior high or HS. If you don't have a trapped kid you don't get it, its a debacle. And its a debacle that never had an upside. Is our National Team stronger because we switched?

Clarification, the switch to CY wasn't meant to improve adult national teams, it was meant to improve youth national teams.

For adult national team, they will pull players from the oldest months based on youth age cutoffs no matter what the cutoffs are.

Reducing the relative age effect at the youth level would help the national teams by giving the younger players a better chance to rise up but addressing the relative age effect has been given nothing more than lip service.

+1. The move to BY was about improving *youth* national team finishes and MLS transfer fees to Europe. At the time of the change, that’s who controlled US Soccer. Since then, those people are gone, and youth soccer reps have gained more control. Unless your kid is going to play for the YNT or MLS, you are more than likely arguing for BY simply because the cutoff helps your kid make a better rec team (even most college soccer is ultimately rec in the context of one’s life) consequences to everyone else be damned.

Your timeline is wrong. Fees were not an option until 2020 because USSF stood in the way.

YNT develops for SNT in theory. College soccer has actually been the biggest obstacle to that in the US.

[Anonymous]

ECNL to Grad Year! Let’s make it happen.
That way we get an extra year of living through are kids.

[Anonymous]

I’m hoping this is the post for 350 pages

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m hoping this is the post for 350 pages

+1

[Anonymous]

Can’t wait to see this evening’s posts, when everyone is fired up from a day of drinking and arguing over politics!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Who’s going to pay for that year in Europe? Another option would be to fix the trapped player issue, then there’s no reason to have a gap year in Europe.

Don't you dare bring common sense into this forum. This is not the place. We're here to fight for a broken BY system and to discuss justifications to keep it in place. Move along with your simple fixes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We need more posts from the BY guy who posted the 5 steps of SY grief.

That guy had a great 48 hour run. I miss him too.

[Anonymous]

Pretty sure this is the official start of 350

[Anonymous]

Dangit