NCLB will be rewritten!

[Anonymous]

New bill passed in house. Expected to pass in Senate. What will this mean for the "State" of DC? Idea is to return power to the states.

[Anonymous]

Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

Yes. Because NCLB and all education is really about teachers, and not students. We should not test students and teachers should not be accountable for students' results. Thank god. Especially here in DC where everything was great before Rhee.

[Anonymous]

20:42 Clearly you jest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

Yes. Because NCLB and all education is really about teachers, and not students. We should not test students and teachers should not be accountable for students' results. Thank god. Especially here in DC where everything was great before Rhee.

Hence, 'refocus' rather than 'trash / get rid of'. Or do you think that what we have now is just fantastic?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:20:42 Clearly you jest.

Indeed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

Yes. Because NCLB and all education is really about teachers, and not students. We should not test students and teachers should not be accountable for students' results. Thank god. Especially here in DC where everything was great before Rhee.

Hence, 'refocus' rather than 'trash / get rid of'. Or do you think that what we have now is just fantastic?

Wow, you almost fooled me with that creative word play. "Are you or are not still beating your wife?" I don't know that it is fantastic but I don't know that I object to testing. And the PARCC results are new, but I have to say that from the practice test questions I've seen I'm not sure it isn't testing the tight things the right way. I believe in testing, data and feedback. And I believe in teacher accountability. I have lived in DC for a long time and I was here before the all-hated Rhee imploded central admin. I was here when there was lots and lots of dead weight teaching in schools. I also believe that teachers don't have necessary perspective about what a job is like outside of DC (or other schools). I have teachers in my family who say things like, "You don't understand, without tenure I could be fired just because my boss dislikes me." And I try and explain that's how most of the rest of us live. I believe teachers need to be measured and held to account for failures. I believe that teachers aren't saviors (and just today I hugged an aid in my kid's class because she has one kid who is out of control and she needed some support), but that it's not enough to say they testing isn't perfect so there should be no standards. And I believe that the teacher lobby and outspoken people (on DCUM and elsewhere) do more damage to their cause than they realize when they take intractable positions that defy logic and reason. I think that's why people like me have tuned out the teacher lobby because at some point you just ignore the obstructionist child in the corner.

If WTU or the DCPS teachers have a proposal to reform testing and teacher measurements, I'm listening. But you're losing the battle with the false choices and all or none approach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

Yes. Because NCLB and all education is really about teachers, and not students. We should not test students and teachers should not be accountable for students' results. Thank god. Especially here in DC where everything was great before Rhee.

Teachers test students all the time -- it's the glut of standardized testing that teachers, and some students and a growing number of parents don't like.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

Yes. Because NCLB and all education is really about teachers, and not students. We should not test students and teachers should not be accountable for students' results. Thank god. Especially here in DC where everything was great before Rhee.

Hence, 'refocus' rather than 'trash / get rid of'. Or do you think that what we have now is just fantastic?

Wow, you almost fooled me with that creative word play. "Are you or are not still beating your wife?" I don't know that it is fantastic but I don't know that I object to testing. And the PARCC results are new, but I have to say that from the practice test questions I've seen I'm not sure it isn't testing the tight things the right way. I believe in testing, data and feedback. And I believe in teacher accountability. I have lived in DC for a long time and I was here before the all-hated Rhee imploded central admin. I was here when there was lots and lots of dead weight teaching in schools. I also believe that teachers don't have necessary perspective about what a job is like outside of DC (or other schools). I have teachers in my family who say things like, "You don't understand, without tenure I could be fired just because my boss dislikes me." And I try and explain that's how most of the rest of us live. I believe teachers need to be measured and held to account for failures. I believe that teachers aren't saviors (and just today I hugged an aid in my kid's class because she has one kid who is out of control and she needed some support), but that it's not enough to say they testing isn't perfect so there should be no standards. And I believe that the teacher lobby and outspoken people (on DCUM and elsewhere) do more damage to their cause than they realize when they take intractable positions that defy logic and reason. I think that's why people like me have tuned out the teacher lobby because at some point you just ignore the obstructionist child in the corner.

If WTU or the DCPS teachers have a proposal to reform testing and teacher measurements, I'm listening. But you're losing the battle with the false choices and all or none approach.

And you don't seem to understand that teachers can be subject to unjust criticism, not just from their boss, but from the community, because their jobs are much more public than most. And would you really want to see a turnover in teachers every time there was a turnover in political power in your city? How would that help your kids?

And gee thanks for the hug - but I doubt that it's a good substitute for job protection for school personnel dealing with difficult children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

Yes. Because NCLB and all education is really about teachers, and not students. We should not test students and teachers should not be accountable for students' results. Thank god. Especially here in DC where everything was great before Rhee.

Hence, 'refocus' rather than 'trash / get rid of'. Or do you think that what we have now is just fantastic?

Wow, you almost fooled me with that creative word play. "Are you or are not still beating your wife?" I don't know that it is fantastic but I don't know that I object to testing. And the PARCC results are new, but I have to say that from the practice test questions I've seen I'm not sure it isn't testing the tight things the right way. I believe in testing, data and feedback. And I believe in teacher accountability. I have lived in DC for a long time and I was here before the all-hated Rhee imploded central admin. I was here when there was lots and lots of dead weight teaching in schools. I also believe that teachers don't have necessary perspective about what a job is like outside of DC (or other schools). I have teachers in my family who say things like, "You don't understand, without tenure I could be fired just because my boss dislikes me." And I try and explain that's how most of the rest of us live. I believe teachers need to be measured and held to account for failures. I believe that teachers aren't saviors (and just today I hugged an aid in my kid's class because she has one kid who is out of control and she needed some support), but that it's not enough to say they testing isn't perfect so there should be no standards. And I believe that the teacher lobby and outspoken people (on DCUM and elsewhere) do more damage to their cause than they realize when they take intractable positions that defy logic and reason. I think that's why people like me have tuned out the teacher lobby because at some point you just ignore the obstructionist child in the corner.

If WTU or the DCPS teachers have a proposal to reform testing and teacher measurements, I'm listening. But you're losing the battle with the false choices and all or none approach.

And you don't seem to understand that teachers can be subject to unjust criticism, not just from their boss, but from the community, because their jobs are much more public than most. And would you really want to see a turnover in teachers every time there was a turnover in political power in your city? How would that help your kids?

And gee thanks for the hug - but I doubt that it's a good substitute for job protection for school personnel dealing with difficult children.

1. I don't want you to have "job protection". I want you to have support to succeed and for the kids to thrive, but that's not the same thing as job protection. Maybe that's where we differ. Or maybe you're just not grasping that concept.
2. We're all subject to unjust criticism at work. Get over yourselves. That's life. The construct that says that the solution to unjust criticism is to make teachers impervious to constructive criticism or accountability is not a workable construct. If my choice is lose a few good teachers or have to keep bad ones, I'll take the the former.
3. Lots of jobs come with public scrutiny. And many of those come with no job protections. I do not know when teachers developed a persecution complex, but it's not serving them or their constituency.

[Anonymous]

+100.

[Anonymous]

Shouldn't police officers have the protection of tenure?

They can be subject to unjust criticism, not just from their boss, but from the community, because their jobs are much more public than most. And would we really want to see a turnover in officers every time there was a turnover in political power in the city? How would that help the community?

Firefighters? Judges? Politicians?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Either Kaya needs to refocus the whole testing / teacher evaluation scheme or she needs to go. What we have now is just not good enough for students or teachers.

Yes. Because NCLB and all education is really about teachers, and not students. We should not test students and teachers should not be accountable for students' results. Thank god. Especially here in DC where everything was great before Rhee.

Hence, 'refocus' rather than 'trash / get rid of'. Or do you think that what we have now is just fantastic?

Wow, you almost fooled me with that creative word play. "Are you or are not still beating your wife?" I don't know that it is fantastic but I don't know that I object to testing. And the PARCC results are new, but I have to say that from the practice test questions I've seen I'm not sure it isn't testing the tight things the right way. I believe in testing, data and feedback. And I believe in teacher accountability. I have lived in DC for a long time and I was here before the all-hated Rhee imploded central admin. I was here when there was lots and lots of dead weight teaching in schools. I also believe that teachers don't have necessary perspective about what a job is like outside of DC (or other schools). I have teachers in my family who say things like, "You don't understand, without tenure I could be fired just because my boss dislikes me." And I try and explain that's how most of the rest of us live. I believe teachers need to be measured and held to account for failures. I believe that teachers aren't saviors (and just today I hugged an aid in my kid's class because she has one kid who is out of control and she needed some support), but that it's not enough to say they testing isn't perfect so there should be no standards. And I believe that the teacher lobby and outspoken people (on DCUM and elsewhere) do more damage to their cause than they realize when they take intractable positions that defy logic and reason. I think that's why people like me have tuned out the teacher lobby because at some point you just ignore the obstructionist child in the corner.

If WTU or the DCPS teachers have a proposal to reform testing and teacher measurements, I'm listening. But you're losing the battle with the false choices and all or none approach.

I think we agree on everything. I think that testing / data is great, just not the way it's currently implemented. So fix it, don't trash it.
Sorry I fooled you - it looks pretty clear to me.
(By the way, what's up with the wife beating thing??)

[Anonymous]

I'm not optimistic. States are absolutely terrible at managing ed standards. Just look at the states of the Deep South, where they consider a low-skilled, poorly educated workers to be a competitive advantage. The last thing politicians and bureaucrats want is for the public to be able to easily compare educational outcomes by state (see the uproar over prelim PARCC data)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:New bill passed in house. Expected to pass in Senate. What will this mean for the "State" of DC? Idea is to return power to the states.

Hopefully!