How to answer questions about job loss when you were fired

[Anonymous]

DH and I are about 99% sure he is going to be fired on Monday. He has been accused of violating a company ethics policy. He has no proof other than his word that he did not do what his bosses think. They have some circumstantial evidence, but nothing really solid. He has been a great employee up to this point, earning stellar reviews, raises, bonuses, etc. This is all completely out of the blue. (For the record, I support and believe him 100%-- he is the most honest person I have ever known, which is what makes this all so ironic / hard.)

Anyway, of course this is all extremely upsetting to us/him. We will be OK financially for at least a few months, but he is trying to figure out how to handle this professionally. How do you gracefully explain to prospective employers, colleagues, friends, etc. why you are suddenly out of work?

Anyone BTDT or have any tips or words of wisdom?

TIA.

[Anonymous]

First of all, is this a Fed job? If so, even at-will Feds usually get put on some kind of probation before they are actually fired.

Have they initiated any proceedings? Given any formal reprimands? Brought him in to HR to question him?

I would call an employment attorney. An ethics violation is a serious issue, and if your husband is innocent (even if difficult to prove), he should talk to an employment attorney to see if he has any recourse.

Beyond that, if he is certain they are going to fire him, why doesn't he just resign? I've never done that, but it seems to me a better option than being fired.

I don't know. Maybe some HR people can weigh in.

[Anonymous]

The job I just started a month and a half ago existed because the guy who had it before me got fired. He accidentally told the other side privileged information (law firm). From what he left behind I can tell he was REALLY enthusiastic about his work and it seems like they were sad to have had to fire him. But what he did created a liability and they had no other option. He is a smart guy and I'm sure he learned a huge (though painful) lesson from his mistake and won't do it again. I saw that they wrote him a nice letter of recommendation about how they mutually parted ways after realizing it wasn't a good fit or something (I was reading fast).

So it's possible to land on your feet.

[Anonymous]

OP here-- thanks for these replies.

I've also suggested an employment attorney (not a Fed job). DH doesn't think it would help and doesn't want to spend the money if we're about to lose his income. He has tried to plead his case with the CEO, who basically told him, "We like you, it's hard for me to imagine that you did XYZ, and I think we should keep you. But it's not entirely up to me." His direct boss also told him that he doesn't think he did this, but again, it's not up to him.

Until Thursday, DH had some reasons to think this would get cleared up (including the above conversations.) But his boss suddenly stopped returning calls and has been avoiding him since Thursday, except an email to ask if DH would be in the office on Monday. I think we're in agreement that if he isn't fired on Monday morning, he will resign. He was first notified of this situation about 2 weeks ago, and it's been miserable. I think we both just want this to be over on Monday, one way or another.

[Anonymous]

Pp here. Why doesn't he just resign Monday morning?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here-- thanks for these replies.

I've also suggested an employment attorney (not a Fed job). DH doesn't think it would help and doesn't want to spend the money if we're about to lose his income. He has tried to plead his case with the CEO, who basically told him, "We like you, it's hard for me to imagine that you did XYZ, and I think we should keep you. But it's not entirely up to me." His direct boss also told him that he doesn't think he did this, but again, it's not up to him.

Until Thursday, DH had some reasons to think this would get cleared up (including the above conversations.) But his boss suddenly stopped returning calls and has been avoiding him since Thursday, except an email to ask if DH would be in the office on Monday. I think we're in agreement that if he isn't fired on Monday morning, he will resign. He was first notified of this situation about 2 weeks ago, and it's been miserable. I think we both just want this to be over on Monday, one way or another.

Tell DH not to be upset at his CEO and direct boss - it sounds like they were advised by Legal and/or HR to limit their communication with DH. He should expect that when he goes in on Monday they very well may invite him to resign in lieu of being fired. Tell him to hold his head high, tell him to look them in the eyes, shake hands, thank them for whatever, etc. Go out a mensch. Have him come home and apply for unemployment.

FYI, men turn sadness into anger, and turn anger inward when they can't express it at the person they're angry at. Basically, men suck at dealing with their feelings. Please plan something physical for your husband to do Monday. Send him to the gym if you guys have a membership, send him out for a run, hand him a basketball or tennis racquet or something. He will be able to get out his anger physically.

[Anonymous]

Wait. If they can't prove this, he should not get fired for cause. Make sure that doesn't happen.

I would consult an employment attorney. Getting fired for an ethics offense is a huge black mark.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DH and I are about 99% sure he is going to be fired on Monday. He has been accused of violating a company ethics policy. He has no proof other than his word that he did not do what his bosses think. They have some circumstantial evidence, but nothing really solid. He has been a great employee up to this point, earning stellar reviews, raises, bonuses, etc. This is all completely out of the blue. (For the record, I support and believe him 100%-- he is the most honest person I have ever known, which is what makes this all so ironic / hard.)

Anyway, of course this is all extremely upsetting to us/him. We will be OK financially for at least a few months, but he is trying to figure out how to handle this professionally. How do you gracefully explain to prospective employers, colleagues, friends, etc. why you are suddenly out of work?

Anyone BTDT or have any tips or words of wisdom?

TIA.

Wow! What a difficult circumstance. If only he could figure out who set him up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait. If they can't prove this, he should not get fired for cause. Make sure that doesn't happen.

I would consult an employment attorney. Getting fired for an ethics offense is a huge black mark.

And if he doesn't get fired for cause and they give him an option out - to resign he should be prepared to put forth some terms. If he doesn't have a contract that has a severance clause, spend some time working on that this weekend. Spend time now preparing for the worst so that he is ready and doesn't walk out getting fired and screwed. Make a plan for how he will handle it if they fire him for cause. And make a plan for how he will handle it if they are not planning to fire him for cause and give him an option to resign.

I'm really sorry OP, this is a shitty situation. Our family has BTDT, and the internet didn't help matters. Make sure you are getting the support you need too, the situation will effect your whole family. After things calmed down for us, I adopted the term "disassociated" when it came up -- helped a lot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait. If they can't prove this, he should not get fired for cause. Make sure that doesn't happen.

I would consult an employment attorney. Getting fired for an ethics offense is a huge black mark.

And if he doesn't get fired for cause and they give him an option out - to resign he should be prepared to put forth some terms. If he doesn't have a contract that has a severance clause, spend some time working on that this weekend. Spend time now preparing for the worst so that he is ready and doesn't walk out getting fired and screwed. Make a plan for how he will handle it if they fire him for cause. And make a plan for how he will handle it if they are not planning to fire him for cause and give him an option to resign.

I'm really sorry OP, this is a shitty situation. Our family has BTDT, and the internet didn't help matters. Make sure you are getting the support you need too, the situation will effect your whole family. After things calmed down for us, I adopted the term "disassociated" when it came up -- helped a lot.

I would think the best situation would be to negotiate not only severance but more time on the job. It is easier to find a job when you have a job.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pp here. Why doesn't he just resign Monday morning?

Or Sunday by email.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here-- thanks for these replies.

I've also suggested an employment attorney (not a Fed job). DH doesn't think it would help and doesn't want to spend the money if we're about to lose his income. He has tried to plead his case with the CEO, who basically told him, "We like you, it's hard for me to imagine that you did XYZ, and I think we should keep you. But it's not entirely up to me." His direct boss also told him that he doesn't think he did this, but again, it's not up to him.

Until Thursday, DH had some reasons to think this would get cleared up (including the above conversations.) But his boss suddenly stopped returning calls and has been avoiding him since Thursday, except an email to ask if DH would be in the office on Monday. I think we're in agreement that if he isn't fired on Monday morning, he will resign. He was first notified of this situation about 2 weeks ago, and it's been miserable. I think we both just want this to be over on Monday, one way or another.

Tell DH not to be upset at his CEO and direct boss - it sounds like they were advised by Legal and/or HR to limit their communication with DH. He should expect that when he goes in on Monday they very well may invite him to resign in lieu of being fired. Tell him to hold his head high, tell him to look them in the eyes, shake hands, thank them for whatever, etc. Go out a mensch. Have him come home and apply for unemployment.

FYI, men turn sadness into anger, and turn anger inward when they can't express it at the person they're angry at. Basically, men suck at dealing with their feelings. Please plan something physical for your husband to do Monday. Send him to the gym if you guys have a membership, send him out for a run, hand him a basketball or tennis racquet or something. He will be able to get out his anger physically.

Thanks for this response especially, but for all of them. Good suggestions all around, so we will spend the rest of the weekend strategizing. And maybe one last trip to the gym on Monday will be good for him, right before that membership gets cancelled.

I really appreciate the kindness on this thread-- DCUM can be harsh, but you have all been compassionate during a difficult time for us. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Not to be a jerk, but I would also keep open the possibility that he did do something unethical, perhaps connected to some other motive he doesn't want to talk about with you. It doesn't change the getting fired, but perhaps it's why he doesn't want to talk to an employment attorney (which otherwise seems like a reasonable move). Regardless, he can move forward from this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait. If they can't prove this, he should not get fired for cause. Make sure that doesn't happen.

I would consult an employment attorney. Getting fired for an ethics offense is a huge black mark.

And if he doesn't get fired for cause and they give him an option out - to resign he should be prepared to put forth some terms. If he doesn't have a contract that has a severance clause, spend some time working on that this weekend. Spend time now preparing for the worst so that he is ready and doesn't walk out getting fired and screwed. Make a plan for how he will handle it if they fire him for cause. And make a plan for how he will handle it if they are not planning to fire him for cause and give him an option to resign.

I'm really sorry OP, this is a shitty situation. Our family has BTDT, and the internet didn't help matters. Make sure you are getting the support you need too, the situation will effect your whole family. After things calmed down for us, I adopted the term "disassociated" when it came up -- helped a lot.

I would think the best situation would be to negotiate not only severance but more time on the job. It is easier to find a job when you have a job.

Or if they won't let him actually stay (physically-they may want to close all his accounts, etc.), maybe they will let him have the severance and an end date of employment in the future, provided he doesn't come in...

I'm sorry OP. Sending you good thoughts.

[Anonymous]

NP here. I do not know what is going on, of course. But, this is touchy. Ethics violation could mean anything from gossiping to being anchorage of TDI emissions testing in the USA. In general, I would not consider a person who was fired for cause without understanding the details of the cause.

People are offering suggestions, but it really matters as to the accused issue.