AP English teacher never read Orwell?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m an English teacher. Yes, I have taught Orwell: 1984, Animal Farm, and an extensive collection of his essays

…and I’m saddened by OP’s question. There are so many works out there. So many. This teacher shouldn’t be criticized because she isn’t familiar with one of them.

I had a parent call me out for not being intimately familiar with Tolstoy. I recall being horrified that my 20 years of successful teaching were being erased because I wasn’t ready for an impromptu discussion about Anna Karenina. Somehow that became such a fault, as if I couldn’t teach a proper thesis statement because Tolstoy was absent from my nightstand.

You should not be teaching

Orwell is 100 percent required reading for a competent English teacher

I wrote that I’ve taught Orwell. One can assume, therefore, that I’ve also read it. Can I keep my teaching certification? Is that okay with you?

Now what about Fitzgerald? Morrison? Whitman? Hawthorne? Elliot? Faulkner? Salinger? Hurston? Vonnegut? Angelou? Baldwin? Poe? Bradbury? Kerouac? London?

Which authors are required reading for “competent” English teachers? Let’s get that list compiled so we can start firing right away. I mean, there’s a TON of people out there begging to try out the workload of an English teacher. We should give them a chance (as long as they’ve read Orwell).

This. Anyone who's studied English will tell you there is no "cannon" that everyone has read.

And that's also not a terribly helpful way to look at the study of English. It's not about having read a certain list of books. It's about teaching how to read, to recognize how authors are employing certain tactics, and how to write about literature. No AP English test just grills you on random books, it's a test of analysis.

I was actually discussing this with my mom, we studied literature in college (she majored, I minored) almost 40 years apart and our experiences were actually very different. We both read Moby Dick, for instance, but my mom's class approached it as this very serious book whereas my class fully embraced pointing out the humor and sex jokes.

There is a canon, though.

[Anonymous]

I would not care if a HS English teacher had read or not read Orwell.

Why that particular author, OP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m an English teacher. Yes, I have taught Orwell: 1984, Animal Farm, and an extensive collection of his essays

…and I’m saddened by OP’s question. There are so many works out there. So many. This teacher shouldn’t be criticized because she isn’t familiar with one of them.

I had a parent call me out for not being intimately familiar with Tolstoy. I recall being horrified that my 20 years of successful teaching were being erased because I wasn’t ready for an impromptu discussion about Anna Karenina. Somehow that became such a fault, as if I couldn’t teach a proper thesis statement because Tolstoy was absent from my nightstand.

You should not be teaching

Orwell is 100 percent required reading for a competent English teacher

I wrote that I’ve taught Orwell. One can assume, therefore, that I’ve also read it. Can I keep my teaching certification? Is that okay with you?

Now what about Fitzgerald? Morrison? Whitman? Hawthorne? Elliot? Faulkner? Salinger? Hurston? Vonnegut? Angelou? Baldwin? Poe? Bradbury? Kerouac? London?

Which authors are required reading for “competent” English teachers? Let’s get that list compiled so we can start firing right away. I mean, there’s a TON of people out there begging to try out the workload of an English teacher. We should give them a chance (as long as they’ve read Orwell).

This. Anyone who's studied English will tell you there is no "cannon" that everyone has read.

And that's also not a terribly helpful way to look at the study of English. It's not about having read a certain list of books. It's about teaching how to read, to recognize how authors are employing certain tactics, and how to write about literature. No AP English test just grills you on random books, it's a test of analysis.

I was actually discussing this with my mom, we studied literature in college (she majored, I minored) almost 40 years apart and our experiences were actually very different. We both read Moby Dick, for instance, but my mom's class approached it as this very serious book whereas my class fully embraced pointing out the humor and sex jokes.

There is a canon, though.

Where’s the list?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child is taking 11th grade DE through FCPS and they haven't read even one book. 9th grader in honors also hasn't read one book. Just "excerpts". Honestly, its very disappointing.

This. It’s just so so bad out there right now. Unless your child is in a magnet school or a great private, you have to be supplementing at home. Still- in high school. My teen is in AP english lang and they haven’t read a single book yet, and won’t this semester. Next semester, I think there are two on the syllabus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m an English teacher. Yes, I have taught Orwell: 1984, Animal Farm, and an extensive collection of his essays

…and I’m saddened by OP’s question. There are so many works out there. So many. This teacher shouldn’t be criticized because she isn’t familiar with one of them.

I had a parent call me out for not being intimately familiar with Tolstoy. I recall being horrified that my 20 years of successful teaching were being erased because I wasn’t ready for an impromptu discussion about Anna Karenina. Somehow that became such a fault, as if I couldn’t teach a proper thesis statement because Tolstoy was absent from my nightstand.

You should not be teaching

Orwell is 100 percent required reading for a competent English teacher

I wrote that I’ve taught Orwell. One can assume, therefore, that I’ve also read it. Can I keep my teaching certification? Is that okay with you?

Now what about Fitzgerald? Morrison? Whitman? Hawthorne? Elliot? Faulkner? Salinger? Hurston? Vonnegut? Angelou? Baldwin? Poe? Bradbury? Kerouac? London?

Which authors are required reading for “competent” English teachers? Let’s get that list compiled so we can start firing right away. I mean, there’s a TON of people out there begging to try out the workload of an English teacher. We should give them a chance (as long as they’ve read Orwell).

Of those? London, Kerouac, Bradbury, Baldwin, Hurston, Salinger and Hawthorne would not be required.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m an English teacher. Yes, I have taught Orwell: 1984, Animal Farm, and an extensive collection of his essays

…and I’m saddened by OP’s question. There are so many works out there. So many. This teacher shouldn’t be criticized because she isn’t familiar with one of them.

I had a parent call me out for not being intimately familiar with Tolstoy. I recall being horrified that my 20 years of successful teaching were being erased because I wasn’t ready for an impromptu discussion about Anna Karenina. Somehow that became such a fault, as if I couldn’t teach a proper thesis statement because Tolstoy was absent from my nightstand.

You should not be teaching

Orwell is 100 percent required reading for a competent English teacher

I wrote that I’ve taught Orwell. One can assume, therefore, that I’ve also read it. Can I keep my teaching certification? Is that okay with you?

Now what about Fitzgerald? Morrison? Whitman? Hawthorne? Elliot? Faulkner? Salinger? Hurston? Vonnegut? Angelou? Baldwin? Poe? Bradbury? Kerouac? London?

Which authors are required reading for “competent” English teachers? Let’s get that list compiled so we can start firing right away. I mean, there’s a TON of people out there begging to try out the workload of an English teacher. We should give them a chance (as long as they’ve read Orwell).

Of those? London, Kerouac, Bradbury, Baldwin, Hurston, Salinger and Hawthorne would not be required.

Why is Hawthorne more worthy of study than Bradbury? I’d love to hear your argument.

Personally, I can’t believe that you so easily dismissed Hurston. Is it because you aren’t as familiar with her work and its place in American literary history?

Ultimately, there are far more authors worthy of study than there is time to study them. The OP’s teacher didn’t have the opportunity to study Orwell. Somebody else didn’t get the opportunity to study Chaucer, who is also part of the Western Canon. Is one more qualified to teach English than the other?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, Op's 11th grader is suggesting Animal Farm as a high school curriculum option. I read it in middle school a gazillion years ago, and my MCPS 8th grader is also reading it in 8th grade.

OP here. Yes, we moved here from DC and my son had also read it as a middle schooler. His teacher was looking for suggestions for the general-level 9th grade English class, not the honors English class.

That said, our first year here, DC was in 9th grade, and took Honors English. That teacher decided it would be too hard for the students to read the Shakespeare play they were required to study under the district syllabus, so instead they watched the Leonardo DiCaprio/Claire Danes movie. In Honors English.

The PP who said to appreciate the education available in DC has a point!

Wha do you mean "instead"?

It takes weeks to study a play, but 3 days to watch the movie.

Also, FYI, Shakespeare wasn't a novelist. Shakespeare was a playwright.

By “instead” I mean that instead of reading even one act, they read nothing and watched a movie as a substitute for reading the play. That is not an adequate substitute for reading the play.

I’m not sure why you are pointing out that Shakespeare is not a novelist, but you are correct. Shakespeare was a playwright. 👍

Actually since Romeo and Juliet is a play, I think it's fine to just watch the movie. That's closer to the original intent of the work of art than analyzing the script. The Leo/Claire version is really good compared to the Zeffirelli version that teachers used to show before it.

Seeing it acted out likely helps with comprehension of the lines, builds interest, and saves class time for other works that exist only in written format. For example, you could then spend a class covering the sonnets.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone is going to have some gaps in what they've read, but Orwell is a weird one for someone who teaches high school English, yeah.

Yes this is a strange one to have missed— both as a former student and as a teacher. I’m also in my 30s and Orwell was required reading at least twice in my life, as a non-English or education major! Maybe even three times??

I’d also just think you’d want to read 1984, as a citizen, just to get what everyone is referring to…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, Op's 11th grader is suggesting Animal Farm as a high school curriculum option. I read it in middle school a gazillion years ago, and my MCPS 8th grader is also reading it in 8th grade.

OP here. Yes, we moved here from DC and my son had also read it as a middle schooler. His teacher was looking for suggestions for the general-level 9th grade English class, not the honors English class.

That said, our first year here, DC was in 9th grade, and took Honors English. That teacher decided it would be too hard for the students to read the Shakespeare play they were required to study under the district syllabus, so instead they watched the Leonardo DiCaprio/Claire Danes movie. In Honors English.

The PP who said to appreciate the education available in DC has a point!

Whaaat? We read Romeo and Juliet and the “reward” was watching the Baz Luhrman version (which is very good) in my 8th grade English class….

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m an English teacher. Yes, I have taught Orwell: 1984, Animal Farm, and an extensive collection of his essays

…and I’m saddened by OP’s question. There are so many works out there. So many. This teacher shouldn’t be criticized because she isn’t familiar with one of them.

I had a parent call me out for not being intimately familiar with Tolstoy. I recall being horrified that my 20 years of successful teaching were being erased because I wasn’t ready for an impromptu discussion about Anna Karenina. Somehow that became such a fault, as if I couldn’t teach a proper thesis statement because Tolstoy was absent from my nightstand.

You should not be teaching

Orwell is 100 percent required reading for a competent English teacher

I wrote that I’ve taught Orwell. One can assume, therefore, that I’ve also read it. Can I keep my teaching certification? Is that okay with you?

Now what about Fitzgerald? Morrison? Whitman? Hawthorne? Elliot? Faulkner? Salinger? Hurston? Vonnegut? Angelou? Baldwin? Poe? Bradbury? Kerouac? London?

Which authors are required reading for “competent” English teachers? Let’s get that list compiled so we can start firing right away. I mean, there’s a TON of people out there begging to try out the workload of an English teacher. We should give them a chance (as long as they’ve read Orwell).

Of those? London, Kerouac, Bradbury, Baldwin, Hurston, Salinger and Hawthorne would not be required.

Why is Hawthorne more worthy of study than Bradbury? I’d love to hear your argument.

Personally, I can’t believe that you so easily dismissed Hurston. Is it because you aren’t as familiar with her work and its place in American literary history?

Ultimately, there are far more authors worthy of study than there is time to study them. The OP’s teacher didn’t have the opportunity to study Orwell. Somebody else didn’t get the opportunity to study Chaucer, who is also part of the Western Canon. Is one more qualified to teach English than the other?

He isn't. They were both listed. Farenheit 451, the Scarlet Letter and They're Eyes Were Watching Gid are important and worthy works but I wouldn't blink twice if an English teacher hadn't read them. Because, as you say, there are too many worthy books to read all of the A- tier.

FWIW Canterbury Tales is also a must read of English Lit.[twitter]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m an English teacher. Yes, I have taught Orwell: 1984, Animal Farm, and an extensive collection of his essays

…and I’m saddened by OP’s question. There are so many works out there. So many. This teacher shouldn’t be criticized because she isn’t familiar with one of them.

I had a parent call me out for not being intimately familiar with Tolstoy. I recall being horrified that my 20 years of successful teaching were being erased because I wasn’t ready for an impromptu discussion about Anna Karenina. Somehow that became such a fault, as if I couldn’t teach a proper thesis statement because Tolstoy was absent from my nightstand.

You should not be teaching

Orwell is 100 percent required reading for a competent English teacher

I wrote that I’ve taught Orwell. One can assume, therefore, that I’ve also read it. Can I keep my teaching certification? Is that okay with you?

Now what about Fitzgerald? Morrison? Whitman? Hawthorne? Elliot? Faulkner? Salinger? Hurston? Vonnegut? Angelou? Baldwin? Poe? Bradbury? Kerouac? London?

Which authors are required reading for “competent” English teachers? Let’s get that list compiled so we can start firing right away. I mean, there’s a TON of people out there begging to try out the workload of an English teacher. We should give them a chance (as long as they’ve read Orwell).

This. Anyone who's studied English will tell you there is no "cannon" that everyone has read.

And that's also not a terribly helpful way to look at the study of English. It's not about having read a certain list of books. It's about teaching how to read, to recognize how authors are employing certain tactics, and how to write about literature. No AP English test just grills you on random books, it's a test of analysis.

I was actually discussing this with my mom, we studied literature in college (she majored, I minored) almost 40 years apart and our experiences were actually very different. We both read Moby Dick, for instance, but my mom's class approached it as this very serious book whereas my class fully embraced pointing out the humor and sex jokes.

There is a canon, though.

There simply isn't and no degree requires you to have read a set list of books.

I mean how many books? And which ones? And are we adding to the Canon? The whole concept is ridiculous. If you asked 100 English professors to name say, 20 essential works, you'd get 100 different answers.

[Anonymous]

Shakespeare was primarily meant to be seen and heard, in performance. Reading it is secondary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Shakespeare was primarily meant to be seen and heard, in performance. Reading it is secondary.

What's really interesting is to find someone reading Shakespeare in original pronunciation (sounds a bit Welsh). Some jokes/puns come through that we miss.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child is taking 11th grade DE through FCPS and they haven't read even one book. 9th grader in honors also hasn't read one book. Just "excerpts". Honestly, its very disappointing.

This can’t be the norm. My 8th grader’s English class is on their 3rd book. How hard is to pass out 20 paperback books so they can bring them home and read them?

I wonder how many students ended up buying the book to find out how it ends or how it begins or what it was actually about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I think every college-bound HS student should read 1984 and Animal Farm in some HS class.

If you’re basing this on the political messages in the books then everyone in high school should read it not just some of them.