Aka Charlie Sheen Documentary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Omg I did not realize until today and this chain that Charlie Sheen and Emilio Estevez are brothers ?!?!?!

How old are you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish there was an edit function…, I meant to say lost his virginity at 15 to a prostitute in Vegas. Not normal.

Well that is sad. I wonder who took him?

It might explain why he used commercial sex workers later in life. That was his introduction to sex!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish there was an edit function…, I meant to say lost his virginity at 15 to a prostitute in Vegas. Not normal.

Well that is sad. I wonder who took him?

It might explain why he used commercial sex workers later in life. That was his introduction to sex!

He mentioned it so off-handedly, as an example of how he really respects sex workers, and appreciates how he lost his virginity to one. I was appalled that wasn't like a record scratch moment, and that isn't something that he's unpacked a little in therapy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish there was an edit function…, I meant to say lost his virginity at 15 to a prostitute in Vegas. Not normal.

Well that is sad. I wonder who took him?

It might explain why he used commercial sex workers later in life. That was his introduction to sex!

He mentioned it so off-handedly, as an example of how he really respects sex workers, and appreciates how he lost his virginity to one. I was appalled that wasn't like a record scratch moment, and that isn't something that he's unpacked a little in therapy.

Wasn't he hanging out with other celebrity kids like Sean Penn? Maybe not uncommon.

I know my ex, poor working class NYC his Uncle offered to pay for a sex worker to take his V card in the 90s. I also wouldn't be surprised if he did...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Denise had a reality show a long time ago that I watched and her parents were in it. I remember how likeable, normal and loving she came across, like someone I would want to be friends with or live in my neighborhood. I can’t remember what it was called or what channel it was on (probably E) but it seemed to take place after her divorce and while she was helping care for her father.

I loved that show. It was on E and she had a bunch of animals. Her mother had cancer, maybe leukemia, for a number of years before passing. Both parents and her sister were so down to earth and I think really gave a lot of emotional support that Denise needed during those post-divorce years.

Denise gets a lot of crap online from Bravo fans, but that show, taking care of Charlie and Brooke’s kids, inviting Charlie’s escorts to Thanksgiving, etc, show that Denise is truly a kind and generous woman.

No she’s a crappy mother

She didn’t educate her kids she taught them how to be only fans

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Denise had a reality show a long time ago that I watched and her parents were in it. I remember how likeable, normal and loving she came across, like someone I would want to be friends with or live in my neighborhood. I can’t remember what it was called or what channel it was on (probably E) but it seemed to take place after her divorce and while she was helping care for her father.

I loved that show. It was on E and she had a bunch of animals. Her mother had cancer, maybe leukemia, for a number of years before passing. Both parents and her sister were so down to earth and I think really gave a lot of emotional support that Denise needed during those post-divorce years.

Denise gets a lot of crap online from Bravo fans, but that show, taking care of Charlie and Brooke’s kids, inviting Charlie’s escorts to Thanksgiving, etc, show that Denise is truly a kind and generous woman.

No she’s a crappy mother

She didn’t educate her kids she taught them how to be only fans

The crappy mother is Brooke.

[Anonymous]

On a non serious note, I really liked all the music and was pleasantly surprised to find someone had already made a playlist on Spotify of the soundtrack in case any one else was interested.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Brooke Mueller looks and sounds like she’s so high in every interview. I feel terrible for their twins to have two crack head parents. Even if both are “sober”, their brains seem so fried from past drug use.

And the drug dealer being painted like a good guy, his best friend, and the reason he became sober because he lessened the potency of the crack he sold him. WTF?

Charlie Sheen is a classic addict. Unfortunately I have multiple substance abuse addicts in my close family and Sheen is exactly the same. So charismatic, can charm almost anyone, narcissistic, so convincing, but for those closest to him, who have a regular close relationship, he sucks the life right out of you and pulls you into their hurricane of chaos and not caring. He’s not a great guy.

THIS!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He ruined a lot of people and they don’t get a book or documentary. I won’t be watching this.

I don't remember thus part - who did he ruin?

Your mum

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Brooke Mueller looks and sounds like she’s so high in every interview. I feel terrible for their twins to have two crack head parents. Even if both are “sober”, their brains seem so fried from past drug use.

And the drug dealer being painted like a good guy, his best friend, and the reason he became sober because he lessened the potency of the crack he sold him. WTF?

Charlie Sheen is a classic addict. Unfortunately I have multiple substance abuse addicts in my close family and Sheen is exactly the same. So charismatic, can charm almost anyone, narcissistic, so convincing, but for those closest to him, who have a regular close relationship, he sucks the life right out of you and pulls you into their hurricane of chaos and not caring. He’s not a great guy.

Sure, but the docuseries essentially demonstrates that he is sober and has been for quite some time. Interviews and articles in other outlets as he promotes the series demonstrate he’s very close with his father, brothers, etc. as well as with Denise and even Brooke.

Re: the segment with his friend/dealer - Isn’t that just a restatement of facts? If that’s what he did to ween him off, then that’s a fact. It’s not a lie or sugarcoating, it’s just his truth. And isn’t that the point of the series?

I think Denise was put through Hell by him but she seemed committed to doing whatever she could to keep him alive. She’s a saint imho. And hearing her say she still loves him tracks.

Brooke is obviously impaired due to years of heavy drug use, but she’s also had some cosmetic stuff that seems to have impacted her mouth and speech. I wonder if she also has fake teeth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Brooke Mueller looks and sounds like she’s so high in every interview. I feel terrible for their twins to have two crack head parents. Even if both are “sober”, their brains seem so fried from past drug use.

And the drug dealer being painted like a good guy, his best friend, and the reason he became sober because he lessened the potency of the crack he sold him. WTF?

Charlie Sheen is a classic addict. Unfortunately I have multiple substance abuse addicts in my close family and Sheen is exactly the same. So charismatic, can charm almost anyone, narcissistic, so convincing, but for those closest to him, who have a regular close relationship, he sucks the life right out of you and pulls you into their hurricane of chaos and not caring. He’s not a great guy.

Sure, but the docuseries essentially demonstrates that he is sober and has been for quite some time. Interviews and articles in other outlets as he promotes the series demonstrate he’s very close with his father, brothers, etc. as well as with Denise and even Brooke.

Re: the segment with his friend/dealer - Isn’t that just a restatement of facts? If that’s what he did to ween him off, then that’s a fact. It’s not a lie or sugarcoating, it’s just his truth. And isn’t that the point of the series?

I think Denise was put through Hell by him but she seemed committed to doing whatever she could to keep him alive. She’s a saint imho. And hearing her say she still loves him tracks.

Brooke is obviously impaired due to years of heavy drug use, but she’s also had some cosmetic stuff that seems to have impacted her mouth and speech. I wonder if she also has fake teeth.

Other than the dealer cutting the potency, what seems to be behind him finally getting and staying sober? I ask because it seems so hopeless sometimes for long term addicts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Brooke Mueller looks and sounds like she’s so high in every interview. I feel terrible for their twins to have two crack head parents. Even if both are “sober”, their brains seem so fried from past drug use.

And the drug dealer being painted like a good guy, his best friend, and the reason he became sober because he lessened the potency of the crack he sold him. WTF?

Charlie Sheen is a classic addict. Unfortunately I have multiple substance abuse addicts in my close family and Sheen is exactly the same. So charismatic, can charm almost anyone, narcissistic, so convincing, but for those closest to him, who have a regular close relationship, he sucks the life right out of you and pulls you into their hurricane of chaos and not caring. He’s not a great guy.

Sure, but the docuseries essentially demonstrates that he is sober and has been for quite some time. Interviews and articles in other outlets as he promotes the series demonstrate he’s very close with his father, brothers, etc. as well as with Denise and even Brooke.

Re: the segment with his friend/dealer - Isn’t that just a restatement of facts? If that’s what he did to ween him off, then that’s a fact. It’s not a lie or sugarcoating, it’s just his truth. And isn’t that the point of the series?

I think Denise was put through Hell by him but she seemed committed to doing whatever she could to keep him alive. She’s a saint imho. And hearing her say she still loves him tracks.

Brooke is obviously impaired due to years of heavy drug use, but she’s also had some cosmetic stuff that seems to have impacted her mouth and speech. I wonder if she also has fake teeth.

Charlie may be sober, but he still has an addict personality. An alcoholic who is in recovery is often still a dry drunk. His intensity in his movements and speech, his attitude, his F you personality, it's all still there. 3 of his 5 children did not participate. His other daughter with Richards has been very vocal on social media re her trauma at being his daughter (and people are surprised she ended up doing OF, hmmmmmmmm). I think Denise keeps relations with him for the sake of her children.

John Cryer's accounts are rather heart breaking and show how an average, regular person would probably react to this insanity. he just looks so stunned the entire time he's talking. And his explanation re how he hesitated to take part in this, how he doesn't want to build Charlie up or tear him down. Just the facts. And sounds like they are not in touch.

Wondering what Selma Blair has to think re all of this. It is so disappointing to learn how much studios enabled Sheen in multiple shows (and in that talking tour) just to keep making money because the public loves this addict.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Brooke Mueller looks and sounds like she’s so high in every interview. I feel terrible for their twins to have two crack head parents. Even if both are “sober”, their brains seem so fried from past drug use.

And the drug dealer being painted like a good guy, his best friend, and the reason he became sober because he lessened the potency of the crack he sold him. WTF?

Charlie Sheen is a classic addict. Unfortunately I have multiple substance abuse addicts in my close family and Sheen is exactly the same. So charismatic, can charm almost anyone, narcissistic, so convincing, but for those closest to him, who have a regular close relationship, he sucks the life right out of you and pulls you into their hurricane of chaos and not caring. He’s not a great guy.

Sure, but the docuseries essentially demonstrates that he is sober and has been for quite some time. Interviews and articles in other outlets as he promotes the series demonstrate he’s very close with his father, brothers, etc. as well as with Denise and even Brooke.

Re: the segment with his friend/dealer - Isn’t that just a restatement of facts? If that’s what he did to ween him off, then that’s a fact. It’s not a lie or sugarcoating, it’s just his truth. And isn’t that the point of the series?

I think Denise was put through Hell by him but she seemed committed to doing whatever she could to keep him alive. She’s a saint imho. And hearing her say she still loves him tracks.

Brooke is obviously impaired due to years of heavy drug use, but she’s also had some cosmetic stuff that seems to have impacted her mouth and speech. I wonder if she also has fake teeth.

Charlie may be sober, but he still has an addict personality. An alcoholic who is in recovery is often still a dry drunk. His intensity in his movements and speech, his attitude, his F you personality, it's all still there. 3 of his 5 children did not participate. His other daughter with Richards has been very vocal on social media re her trauma at being his daughter (and people are surprised she ended up doing OF, hmmmmmmmm). I think Denise keeps relations with him for the sake of her children.

John Cryer's accounts are rather heart breaking and show how an average, regular person would probably react to this insanity. he just looks so stunned the entire time he's talking. And his explanation re how he hesitated to take part in this, how he doesn't want to build Charlie up or tear him down. Just the facts. And sounds like they are not in touch.

Wondering what Selma Blair has to think re all of this. It is so disappointing to learn how much studios enabled Sheen in multiple shows (and in that talking tour) just to keep making money because the public loves this addict.

Sure.

His personality is what it is.

But Trump has a similar personality and he’s not an addict, so I’m not sure it’s accurate to say it’s an addict personality.

My sibling was an addict and it killed them. They were nothing like Charlie personality-wise. They were fun and had a need to constantly be around others, but they weren’t arrogant or hostile or anything like Sheen. And neither were their addict friends.

I suspect Sheen’s older daughter with Denise will likely end up like Sheen. His oldest seems fine.

I’m not following the Selma Blair reference. Did she date him at some point?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t usually like this sort of thing but find his story such a tragedy that I was pulled in. I thought it could have been better done. I hate Md the fake enactments—felt cheesy. I think it would have been much better if Emilio and his parents had agreed to participate. His dad has spoken out a lot about him so they had many clips but his mom and Emilio have been pretty quiet over the decades and must have a lot of trauma from all this. Not that they need to share it but I think it would have been more honest to have that all out there. Denise agreed to participate for precisely this reason — she said withi it her it would be a sugar coated turd. Denise comes off great in this. I had not realized she is tough as nails and has a tremendous heart. She mentioned her dad is a Vietnam vet, and I think her family is blue collar — she just seems both down to earth and also like she’s a tough broad.
I also felt like they skimmed by the 80s too quickly as maybe we’d understand better how he got so messed up if we understood that more. I did love seeing the old super max films of him and his brother and sean Penn, who was a neighbor. Did he hang out with Rob Lowe back in the day? I feel like Rob would have an interesting perspective given his own struggles.

There were also some weird throw away -/ like he mentioned off handedly that he lost his virginity at 25 to a posture in Vegas. I was like “hold up — that’s not normal. How that hell did that happen and do you think maybe those circumstances contributed to your general train crash of a life?” He otherwise seemed very quiet and buttoned up in HS (although he was apparently a terrible student. ). He y seemed to me like something had happened in his teen years or earlier but they just didn’t delve into that. I wondered if he’d been molested or something and has just blocked it out. Emilio seems pretty well balanced and his parents actually seem pretty great. It could be that he just has some screws loose (and they mentioned he was actually dead on delivery so maybe even perinatal brain damage), but it seems like something just went wrong with Charlie.

I don’t know what to make of the Cory haim allegations. Sheen denies them vehemently and there’s nothing else in his history that suggests he was into boys or children. Haim has his own issues and the whole allegation seemed weird. I think it’s hard to say what happened there. They are both men with a lot of damage.

One thing that did come through clearly is how people mostly just wanted to make money off him. There was a film where he was bleeding copiously from the noise due to cocain overuse and they just kept cleaning him up. His best chance to turn it around seemed like when he married Denise—he was good for a while then. She said when he went back on drugs she tried to get help and people just told her she was hormonal post partum and imagining it. I do wonder what her relationship was with his parents — she didn’t mention them and I wonder if she went to Martin for help.

Yes, he went to school with both brothers and was close to them growing up. There's a lot about it in Rob Lowe's (excellent) memoir.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’ve got to believe Emilio loathes Charlie and his financial success. After all, Emilio was the “good” kid who didn’t fall apart like Charlie yet his career stumbled, he never got rich, and he’s not famous the way his screwed up brother is.

I lost a sibling to drugs/alcohol, so I lived through the nightmare as a sibling and watching my parents. We were upper middle class, private schools, nice house, loving parents, etc. Nobody else in our family/extended family had these issues. My take is that the addict has underlying mental health issues they were likely born with or developed over time. Sometimes there’s a traumatic incident, but sometimes it just happens and there’s nobody to blame.

Charlie—like most of the addicts I know—comes across as very charismatic. He seems like someone who needs to be around people (another common trait of addicts). It’s a miracle he’s still alive, and I think Denise played a critical role in that over the last couple decades.

Emilio Estevez is plenty rich and definitely famous. He's not particularly good looking and a not a great actor, but he's in some of the most famous Brat Pack stuff (Outsiders, Breakfast Club, Young Guns, St. Elmo's Fire) and transitioned into commercially successful (Mighty Ducks) and critically successful (Bobby) adult roles + directing... So it seems a stretch to say his career wasn't reasonably successful. Lots of rich people don't want to do TV shows (which is really the only thing that made Charlie Sheen's career "better") because it's such a hard slog.