Antizionism is not antisemitism/the current conflict
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Anonymous
Sounds like you were born on October 7th, so I can't blame you for posting something so astoundingly ignorant. |
Anonymous
DP Your raging belief in your own natural superiority above others, along with your astonishing track record of inability to coexist peacefully with literally anyone else, as ironically evidenced by your posts in this thread, are the reasons that some people have hated people like you for thousands of years. |
Anonymous
I can’t believe this person calls you a friend. This is some absurd minimizing/gaslighting BS. I’ll preface this by saying I don’t agree at all with what Trump is doing wrt universities, but please put yourself in the shoes of a Jewish person on, say, the Columbia campus: -Day after day after day for MONTHS you walk to class and hear protestors chant things like “globalize the intifada,” "Al-Qassam you make us proud, kill another soldier now!" “we are Hamas,” and “Jews go back to Europe/Poland" -One of your Jewish professors has her office vandalized with swastikas: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/11/29/us/swastika-vandalism-columbia-university. -Another professor, who is somehow STILL EMPLOYED by Columbia openly calls October 7 a "resistance offensive" and "awesome.” -a Jewish student who places a mezuza (Jewish religious symbol) on her dorm's doorway is targeted for months, leading her to leave the dorm -Another Jewish student is spat at for wearing a Jewish head covering -Three DEANS of the university, again still employed, attend a panel ON ANTISEMITISM and exchange antisemitic text messages there, such as “Amazing what $$$$ can do'' in reference to an op-ed on antisemitism by a campus rabbi. -Yet another professor says Israeli students should not be allowed on campus because they are dangerous. It does not take three steps to get from any of the above to antisemitism. All of the above is blatantly antisemitic. No Jew/Zionist I know (and I know many) thinks any and all criticism of Israel is antisemitic. That is an idea constantly trotted out to silence Jews and minimize their legitimate concerns, like you are currently doing. “They are convinced the existence of Israeli is fundamentally tied to their own existence.” Ma’am, seven million Jews, half the world’s Jewish population, DOES IN FACT live in Israel. The destruction of the state would result in a lot of those Jews ending up refugees or dead. That’s not like, a conspiracy theory your “friend” cooked up in her head. JFC. |
Anonymous
If you want to say “Hitler was right,” just say it my dude. No need to beat around the bush. |
Anonymous
Nice! Why trifle with the “some people” distinction anyway? Totally didn’t see that coming, my dude! Actually, the way to handle you is to educate you and socially rehabilitate you to an understanding that you’re not, in fact, naturally superior and that only through peaceful coexistence will you find yourself free from the hatred from others. |
Anonymous
This is all horrible and backwards, it’s barbaric. But it doesn’t answer the question as to why Jewish persons are fixated, obsessed with all things Israel simply because God told them so. Ultimately this is the reason for much of this controversy, the fact that God supposedly said this land belongs to people who identify as being Jewish. This fictional book was written thousands of years ago. This shouldn’t be taken literally as no religious book shouldn’t be taken literally as no religious book should. I am not antizionist but rather anti religion period. This will never end because people continue to hold onto outdated rules and principles. Surely there’s another less controversial land mass Jewish persons could occupy? God doesn’t really care where you live. |
Anonymous
DP I’ve not been part of this particular exchange, but the shoes you describe a Jewish student walking in at Columbia are exaggerated. And your “tale of the tape” is also obnoxiously one-sided in that it somehow fails to mention any of the hateful Zionist rhetoric, threats, and physical attacks that have also occurred on that campus over the past few years. But what’s most appalling in your post is this … The destruction of the state would result in a lot of those Jews ending up refugees or dead. Have you literally no idea how ironic this comes across to those of us living in reality ? To those of us who are aware that what’s bolder above is PRECISELY the origin story of the State of Israel, albeit with the native, indigenous population dealing with that awful fate for the past 75 years? I’m for an outcome that allows both Israelis and Palestinians to live in peace. Israel never should have been allowed to declare its independence because the world should never have allowed anyone to believe that safety can only be found in one already occupied strip of land. But the time to litigate that fact has passed, so the direction forward is to impose peaceful co-existence on both sides. If the U.S. can one day shed its clear and sustained bias in the matter, perhaps we can help lead both sides to that path. |
Anonymous
You are making a bunch of assumptions about Jews and Israelis that are flatly incorrect. Jews are not “obsessed with all things Israel simply because God told them so.” 43% of Jewish Israelis are completely secular. Early Zionist sentiment was predominantly secular, with many early Zionists identifying as socialist and atheist. The Zionist movement didn’t arise because a bunch of Jews got together out of the blue and said “we own this land because God said so.” It came about because the rest of the world SLAUGHTERED HALF OF ALL JEWS IN A MASSIVE GENOCIDE. I don’t get how this is so completely lost on people. The people that founded the state of Israel had JUST experienced WWII. They had nowhere else to go - the US restricted immigration, they couldn’t go back to Europe for reasons that should be obvious. So they looked at Israel and said “hey, we have cultural/religious ties to this place, there’s no existing country here, the British who are in charge want us to have it, there’s already a Jewish community here…..this looks like our best bet.” They actually DID consider other places, including Uganda, Madagascar, Japan, the USSR, but were rebuffed for various reasons: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposals_for_a_Jewish_state. Mind you, I’m sure wherever they had decided to settle, people would now be screaming about them being evil white coloniser genocidaires. |
Anonymous
But why did the early zionists decide to return? Why not immigrate to the US or Canada where life is generally more accepting? Why the constant pull toward Israel? Why Israel specifically? And again not to minimize the Holocaust but Jewish people weren’t the only people slaughtered. Romanis and other groups, as you are aware, lost huge percentages of their population and they still have no homeland. Do they not count? Why were they not given land somewhere to ensure their safety? |
Anonymous
Oh please. Spare me. “the shoes you describe a Jewish student walking in at Columbia are exaggerated.” Ok, what’s your evidence for that? All of the incidents I mentioned are well-documented, many on video. “fails to mention any of the hateful Zionist rhetoric, threats, and physical attacks that have also occurred on that campus.” Ok, what’s your evidence for that? Literally anyone with eyes can see that, even if there are isolated examples of this, they don’t rise to anywhere NEAR what the encampments have unleashed on Jewish students. “Have you literally no idea how ironic this comes across to those of us living in reality ? To those of us who are aware that what’s bolder above is PRECISELY the origin story of the State of Israel …” Let’s forget for a moment that Palestinians were not the only ones killed/displaced (roughly the same number of Jews, 800,000, were expelled from middle eastern countries. My parents included). Palestinians were killed/made refugees in 1948 so Jews should be killed/made refugees now? You would mock someone for not wanting that outcome? I agree with you that peaceful co-existence is the only way forward, so at least there’s that. |
Anonymous
Can you not read? The US and Canada were restricting immigration severely. The US famously sent a ship full of German Jewish refugees BACK to Germany to be slaughtered in Auschwitz. Stop bringing up the Romani and using their tragedy as a rhetorical weapon. Nobody “gave” the Jews Israel. They settled there, built it up, established cities, agriculture, infrastructure, government, education, etc. (largely in portions of the land that were uninhabited or sparsely inhabited), obtained international recognition through established channels, and fought several wars to hold on to what they had built. If the Romani had done the same, yes, they’d have a country now and I’d support that. |
Anonymous
DP You apparently know nothing of the origins of Zionism. Otherwise, I’d love to hear about the Time Machine possessed by the late 19th century Zionists who saw 50 - 60 years into the future to fuel their vision. |
Anonymous
What’s my evidence that proves the non-existence of a claim you made? You’re quite the logician. |
Anonymous
But the Balfour Declaration and the UN after WWII essentially established a separate Jewish state correct? There were people, including Jewish people, living on this land since its inception however the people who immigrated here after the Holocaust were European correct? So again, like the Jewish Europeans, Romani Europeans also had no homeland to return to, and still don’t. |
Anonymous
Believe it or not, Jews were very widely persecuted in the late 19th century too, and though they couldn’t necessarily foresee the Holocaust happening, they could definitely perceive the need for a Jewish state. Alas, Zionism was mostly a fringe ideology before WWII and didn’t really gain real momentum until after the Holocaust, so millions of people died needlessly. |