Families that never volunteer - swim team

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The number of officials and timers required for summer swim meets seems overly excessive for a rec league. Even for USA swimming, dual meets only require 3-4 officials and 2 timers per lane. Regular timed final meets only require 4 officials. Are summer swim meet times official as per USA swimming? If not, I would advise to drop the dog pony show of 3 watches per lane and so many stroke and turn officials. Those stopwatch times, whether one or three, are not very accurate anyway. They are almost always faster than the real time.

Do you really not understand that the two timers are backups for the touchpad in higher-level swim?

I do, actually, because I am a usa swimming official. My point is that summer swim meets are not USA swimming meets, so they don’t follow the same rules. The officials do not need to be USA swimming officials, the pools don’t have to be standard size, the age rules are not followed, etc etc. So why do you have to follow their timing rules?

In USA swimming meets, you need 3 watches if there are no primary or secondary automated or semi automated timing systems. Why can’t summer swim only have one timer? Accuracy isn’t a great answer because as I said before, watch times are not even very accurate. And having three timers just ensures that people will get complacent and make mistakes. The officials also note order of finish to confirm or question watch times.

Arguing that you need 3 timers because it’s tedious to average 2 watch times is a weak argument. Anyway, meet manager will do the calculation, so it’s more a matter of data entry. Meet manager takes one backup time, averages two backup times, or takes the median of 3 backup times when there is no primary time. It’s easier to take one watch time than to inspect 3 watch times for the median, but that not the reason to go to one timer. It’s to alleviate the volunteer burden, which is obviously an issue because so so so many people complain about it.

FYI, minimum number officials for usa swim meets


https://www.usaswimming.org/docs/default-source/officialsdocuments/misc-officials/meet-considerations-clarification.pdf

Summer swim is a team sport. Teams are competing against each other to win. After every race, the times are posted on timing boards so people can see who got 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. Kids freak out at close races. It’s fun. By averaging the times in software you are removing that whole element in swimming and making it much more like the boring club meets all the rest of the year. No thanks. If this is how you feel, stick with club swim and skip the fun summer swim.

It’s not fair to the athletes in summer swim to act like their times don’t matter. They do. The kids care.

At a USA Swim Meet, you don't necessarily have the number of DQs a summer swim meet might have. Think about how many of those 8&us (and even some older kids) are not legal in breast or fly. 4 stroke and turn officials are important to make sure that those infractions are caught, not necessarily to punish the kid/team, but so that the coaches and team rep know what the kid is doing wrong and they can improve. We do a lot of DQs at B meets and we check off every infraction so the coaches have a better understanding of what the swimmer is doing incorrectly. It's also not that hard for most teams to staff officials...oddly enough it's timers for those long long B meets.

Try a two day 8u meet with kids swimming 100im and 100 breast. Those meets are actually the best ones for new officials to train. For the referee and starter - so many dq’s, so many false starts. For the admin official - so many soft or no touches, so many new parent timers who forget to push the button/stopwatch. And for the computer operator- so many timers and kids stepping on the pads.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The number of officials and timers required for summer swim meets seems overly excessive for a rec league. Even for USA swimming, dual meets only require 3-4 officials and 2 timers per lane. Regular timed final meets only require 4 officials. Are summer swim meet times official as per USA swimming? If not, I would advise to drop the dog pony show of 3 watches per lane and so many stroke and turn officials. Those stopwatch times, whether one or three, are not very accurate anyway. They are almost always faster than the real time.

Do you really not understand that the two timers are backups for the touchpad in higher-level swim?

I do, actually, because I am a usa swimming official. My point is that summer swim meets are not USA swimming meets, so they don’t follow the same rules. The officials do not need to be USA swimming officials, the pools don’t have to be standard size, the age rules are not followed, etc etc. So why do you have to follow their timing rules?

In USA swimming meets, you need 3 watches if there are no primary or secondary automated or semi automated timing systems. Why can’t summer swim only have one timer? Accuracy isn’t a great answer because as I said before, watch times are not even very accurate. And having three timers just ensures that people will get complacent and make mistakes. The officials also note order of finish to confirm or question watch times.

Arguing that you need 3 timers because it’s tedious to average 2 watch times is a weak argument. Anyway, meet manager will do the calculation, so it’s more a matter of data entry. Meet manager takes one backup time, averages two backup times, or takes the median of 3 backup times when there is no primary time. It’s easier to take one watch time than to inspect 3 watch times for the median, but that not the reason to go to one timer. It’s to alleviate the volunteer burden, which is obviously an issue because so so so many people complain about it.

FYI, minimum number officials for usa swim meets


https://www.usaswimming.org/docs/default-source/officialsdocuments/misc-officials/meet-considerations-clarification.pdf

Summer swim is a team sport. Teams are competing against each other to win. After every race, the times are posted on timing boards so people can see who got 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. Kids freak out at close races. It’s fun. By averaging the times in software you are removing that whole element in swimming and making it much more like the boring club meets all the rest of the year. No thanks. If this is how you feel, stick with club swim and skip the fun summer swim.

It’s not fair to the athletes in summer swim to act like their times don’t matter. They do. The kids care.

At a USA Swim Meet, you don't necessarily have the number of DQs a summer swim meet might have. Think about how many of those 8&us (and even some older kids) are not legal in breast or fly. 4 stroke and turn officials are important to make sure that those infractions are caught, not necessarily to punish the kid/team, but so that the coaches and team rep know what the kid is doing wrong and they can improve. We do a lot of DQs at B meets and we check off every infraction so the coaches have a better understanding of what the swimmer is doing incorrectly. It's also not that hard for most teams to staff officials...oddly enough it's timers for those long long B meets.

Also at a USA swimming meet you have professional judges who are passionate about swimming and probably swam themselves.

I have never swum competitively. I might be legal in 25 m freestyle and backstroke but nothing else. I am not passionate at all about swimming, just about my kids being happy. I am very able to believe that a paid judge could watch more lanes than me!

The stroke and turn judges at your kids USA swimming meets are not professionals. They are volunteers and are not getting paid. Most are parents. At best they are getting some sort of discount on club fees.

I know, I am one. My point is that it’s ridiculous to compare me to the USA swimming judges, and totally reasonable for me to need more help/fewer lanes!

I USA swimming stroke and turn official is not a 'paid professional judge.' it is a volunteer, who is certified by USA swimming ast a stroke and turn official. Yes, the qualification standards to become a USA swmming official are higher- but we are not 'paid professionals.' I'm also confused by the link someone gave suggesting that USA swimming/ PVS meets have way less officials- I think that was a 'bare minimum in response to covid' file. Hardly the norm.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The number of officials and timers required for summer swim meets seems overly excessive for a rec league. Even for USA swimming, dual meets only require 3-4 officials and 2 timers per lane. Regular timed final meets only require 4 officials. Are summer swim meet times official as per USA swimming? If not, I would advise to drop the dog pony show of 3 watches per lane and so many stroke and turn officials. Those stopwatch times, whether one or three, are not very accurate anyway. They are almost always faster than the real time.

Do you really not understand that the two timers are backups for the touchpad in higher-level swim?

I do, actually, because I am a usa swimming official. My point is that summer swim meets are not USA swimming meets, so they don’t follow the same rules. The officials do not need to be USA swimming officials, the pools don’t have to be standard size, the age rules are not followed, etc etc. So why do you have to follow their timing rules?

In USA swimming meets, you need 3 watches if there are no primary or secondary automated or semi automated timing systems. Why can’t summer swim only have one timer? Accuracy isn’t a great answer because as I said before, watch times are not even very accurate. And having three timers just ensures that people will get complacent and make mistakes. The officials also note order of finish to confirm or question watch times.

Arguing that you need 3 timers because it’s tedious to average 2 watch times is a weak argument. Anyway, meet manager will do the calculation, so it’s more a matter of data entry. Meet manager takes one backup time, averages two backup times, or takes the median of 3 backup times when there is no primary time. It’s easier to take one watch time than to inspect 3 watch times for the median, but that not the reason to go to one timer. It’s to alleviate the volunteer burden, which is obviously an issue because so so so many people complain about it.

FYI, minimum number officials for usa swim meets


https://www.usaswimming.org/docs/default-source/officialsdocuments/misc-officials/meet-considerations-clarification.pdf

Summer swim is a team sport. Teams are competing against each other to win. After every race, the times are posted on timing boards so people can see who got 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. Kids freak out at close races. It’s fun. By averaging the times in software you are removing that whole element in swimming and making it much more like the boring club meets all the rest of the year. No thanks. If this is how you feel, stick with club swim and skip the fun summer swim.

It’s not fair to the athletes in summer swim to act like their times don’t matter. They do. The kids care.

At a USA Swim Meet, you don't necessarily have the number of DQs a summer swim meet might have. Think about how many of those 8&us (and even some older kids) are not legal in breast or fly. 4 stroke and turn officials are important to make sure that those infractions are caught, not necessarily to punish the kid/team, but so that the coaches and team rep know what the kid is doing wrong and they can improve. We do a lot of DQs at B meets and we check off every infraction so the coaches have a better understanding of what the swimmer is doing incorrectly. It's also not that hard for most teams to staff officials...oddly enough it's timers for those long long B meets.

Also at a USA swimming meet you have professional judges who are passionate about swimming and probably swam themselves.

I have never swum competitively. I might be legal in 25 m freestyle and backstroke but nothing else. I am not passionate at all about swimming, just about my kids being happy. I am very able to believe that a paid judge could watch more lanes than me!

Good grief you people are clueless! USA swimming-certified judges might be paid at the highest levels but they are absolutely volunteers at the youth level. Trained, sure, but not getting paid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The number of officials and timers required for summer swim meets seems overly excessive for a rec league. Even for USA swimming, dual meets only require 3-4 officials and 2 timers per lane. Regular timed final meets only require 4 officials. Are summer swim meet times official as per USA swimming? If not, I would advise to drop the dog pony show of 3 watches per lane and so many stroke and turn officials. Those stopwatch times, whether one or three, are not very accurate anyway. They are almost always faster than the real time.

Do you really not understand that the two timers are backups for the touchpad in higher-level swim?

I do, actually, because I am a usa swimming official. My point is that summer swim meets are not USA swimming meets, so they don’t follow the same rules. The officials do not need to be USA swimming officials, the pools don’t have to be standard size, the age rules are not followed, etc etc. So why do you have to follow their timing rules?

In USA swimming meets, you need 3 watches if there are no primary or secondary automated or semi automated timing systems. Why can’t summer swim only have one timer? Accuracy isn’t a great answer because as I said before, watch times are not even very accurate. And having three timers just ensures that people will get complacent and make mistakes. The officials also note order of finish to confirm or question watch times.

Arguing that you need 3 timers because it’s tedious to average 2 watch times is a weak argument. Anyway, meet manager will do the calculation, so it’s more a matter of data entry. Meet manager takes one backup time, averages two backup times, or takes the median of 3 backup times when there is no primary time. It’s easier to take one watch time than to inspect 3 watch times for the median, but that not the reason to go to one timer. It’s to alleviate the volunteer burden, which is obviously an issue because so so so many people complain about it.

FYI, minimum number officials for usa swim meets


https://www.usaswimming.org/docs/default-source/officialsdocuments/misc-officials/meet-considerations-clarification.pdf

Summer swim is a team sport. Teams are competing against each other to win. After every race, the times are posted on timing boards so people can see who got 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. Kids freak out at close races. It’s fun. By averaging the times in software you are removing that whole element in swimming and making it much more like the boring club meets all the rest of the year. No thanks. If this is how you feel, stick with club swim and skip the fun summer swim.

It’s not fair to the athletes in summer swim to act like their times don’t matter. They do. The kids care.

At a USA Swim Meet, you don't necessarily have the number of DQs a summer swim meet might have. Think about how many of those 8&us (and even some older kids) are not legal in breast or fly. 4 stroke and turn officials are important to make sure that those infractions are caught, not necessarily to punish the kid/team, but so that the coaches and team rep know what the kid is doing wrong and they can improve. We do a lot of DQs at B meets and we check off every infraction so the coaches have a better understanding of what the swimmer is doing incorrectly. It's also not that hard for most teams to staff officials...oddly enough it's timers for those long long B meets.

Also at a USA swimming meet you have professional judges who are passionate about swimming and probably swam themselves.

I have never swum competitively. I might be legal in 25 m freestyle and backstroke but nothing else. I am not passionate at all about swimming, just about my kids being happy. I am very able to believe that a paid judge could watch more lanes than me!

Good grief you people are clueless! USA swimming-certified judges might be paid at the highest levels but they are absolutely volunteers at the youth level. Trained, sure, but not getting paid.

Then why did the link above that suggested minimums include their fees?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The entitlement on this thread is insane. The fact remains that summer swim teams rely on many volunteers throughout the season. If everyone said f it, this team takes the volunteer commitment too seriously, then it won’t happen. The team shuts down.

What’s wrong with showing and investing in your kids’ activities? Summer swim is a community thing, invest in it or don’t participate.

Always the same parents that step up to help. It’s a shame, what are you teaching your children?

So selfish.

It's a bandwidth thing. Thankfully our team isn't run by people like you.

Your team is run by volunteers like PP and me, and we all have important jobs and a million other things to do. The difference is that we invest our time and effort in our communities and our kids, while you don’t. Maybe get off DCUM and do something productive with your time.

I can't. I literally can't. I would if I could. Does attacking a struggling person make you feel better?

Respectfully, getting out of your own head and helping others is exactly what you need.

What if it's not just in her head? You don't know.

You don't know if she has cancer, chronic daily migraines, somebody dying, a wrecking ball hit her house, divorcing, working 75 hours a week, tied up volunteering to give impoverished kids free surgeries to correct birth defects or representing battered women in court, or is some top secret CIA mixed martial arts lady in the middle of fighting some foreign adversary dude hanging off a balcony like Jason Bourne. You just don't know.

I've got one of those issues daily and have had multiple of those issues at one time and I find ways to volunteer at home. And, sure, its great to be a surgeon volunteering or a lawyer volunteering your time to help others, but that shouldn't be at the expense of your kids, who also need your attention and support and part of that is if you have them summer swim and the expectation is you help out there, since you are such a generous and giving person, no reason you cannot help out on swim team. Really, its less than two months.

Ok. Cases are in trial. Should I ask the judge for a continuance for summer swim team? Aside from death of parent, another parent just paralyzed weeks ago, my long covid, plus a wrecking ball to my house. Maybe that can get a continuance to show face to the swim mommies with nothing better to do then feign business and moral superiority?

A wrecking ball hit your house?

And you are in court on Saturday mornings?

I am very sorry about these things. I would have thought that the house hit by a wrecking ball would have made the news though.

I do pro bono on weekends, because I can't do it during my FT lawyer job hours, which also requires overtime work on yes weekends. I work days, nights, and weekends. Sorry moms like me can't tackle more urgent needs facing the swim community. Perhaps a call to your elected officials could bring about change for this important issue of absent swim moms devastating local swim teams. And 7 On Your Side.

So.
Then.
Your.
Kids.
Don’t.
Do.
Swim.
Team.
If.
You.
And/Or.
Their.
Other.
Parent.
Or.
Other.
Family.
Member.
Can’t.
Or.
Won’t.
Meet.
The.
Volunteer.
Requirements.

I’m so glad I could help clear this up for you.

If you are working, all day, all evening and all weekend, who is caring for your kids?

I am. I type, get up, type, get up, type get up. I have not sat on a couch to watch TV in probably 3 years. I don't in bed either. I did sit on the couch for 5 minutes once this year. Some moms are just super busy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The number of officials and timers required for summer swim meets seems overly excessive for a rec league. Even for USA swimming, dual meets only require 3-4 officials and 2 timers per lane. Regular timed final meets only require 4 officials. Are summer swim meet times official as per USA swimming? If not, I would advise to drop the dog pony show of 3 watches per lane and so many stroke and turn officials. Those stopwatch times, whether one or three, are not very accurate anyway. They are almost always faster than the real time.

Do you really not understand that the two timers are backups for the touchpad in higher-level swim?

I do, actually, because I am a usa swimming official. My point is that summer swim meets are not USA swimming meets, so they don’t follow the same rules. The officials do not need to be USA swimming officials, the pools don’t have to be standard size, the age rules are not followed, etc etc. So why do you have to follow their timing rules?

In USA swimming meets, you need 3 watches if there are no primary or secondary automated or semi automated timing systems. Why can’t summer swim only have one timer? Accuracy isn’t a great answer because as I said before, watch times are not even very accurate. And having three timers just ensures that people will get complacent and make mistakes. The officials also note order of finish to confirm or question watch times.

Arguing that you need 3 timers because it’s tedious to average 2 watch times is a weak argument. Anyway, meet manager will do the calculation, so it’s more a matter of data entry. Meet manager takes one backup time, averages two backup times, or takes the median of 3 backup times when there is no primary time. It’s easier to take one watch time than to inspect 3 watch times for the median, but that not the reason to go to one timer. It’s to alleviate the volunteer burden, which is obviously an issue because so so so many people complain about it.

FYI, minimum number officials for usa swim meets


https://www.usaswimming.org/docs/default-source/officialsdocuments/misc-officials/meet-considerations-clarification.pdf

Summer swim is a team sport. Teams are competing against each other to win. After every race, the times are posted on timing boards so people can see who got 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. Kids freak out at close races. It’s fun. By averaging the times in software you are removing that whole element in swimming and making it much more like the boring club meets all the rest of the year. No thanks. If this is how you feel, stick with club swim and skip the fun summer swim.

It’s not fair to the athletes in summer swim to act like their times don’t matter. They do. The kids care.

At a USA Swim Meet, you don't necessarily have the number of DQs a summer swim meet might have. Think about how many of those 8&us (and even some older kids) are not legal in breast or fly. 4 stroke and turn officials are important to make sure that those infractions are caught, not necessarily to punish the kid/team, but so that the coaches and team rep know what the kid is doing wrong and they can improve. We do a lot of DQs at B meets and we check off every infraction so the coaches have a better understanding of what the swimmer is doing incorrectly. It's also not that hard for most teams to staff officials...oddly enough it's timers for those long long B meets.

Also at a USA swimming meet you have professional judges who are passionate about swimming and probably swam themselves.

I have never swum competitively. I might be legal in 25 m freestyle and backstroke but nothing else. I am not passionate at all about swimming, just about my kids being happy. I am very able to believe that a paid judge could watch more lanes than me!

Good grief you people are clueless! USA swimming-certified judges might be paid at the highest levels but they are absolutely volunteers at the youth level. Trained, sure, but not getting paid.

Then why did the link above that suggested minimums include their fees?

No idea. But if they are paid then i am due a lot of money. I’ve probably done 40 meets and haven’t seen a dime. In fact, I had to pay them to do a background check.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The number of officials and timers required for summer swim meets seems overly excessive for a rec league. Even for USA swimming, dual meets only require 3-4 officials and 2 timers per lane. Regular timed final meets only require 4 officials. Are summer swim meet times official as per USA swimming? If not, I would advise to drop the dog pony show of 3 watches per lane and so many stroke and turn officials. Those stopwatch times, whether one or three, are not very accurate anyway. They are almost always faster than the real time.

If you only had two timers per lane at a pool with no touchpads, instead of just taking the middle time, those two times would have to be averaged after every, single swim. And the table workers would have to confirm every single one of those those averages.

Wait. Are you saying that every single lane in a local kids swim meet has three adults standing there timing each kid? So like 15 adults timing a bunch of 8 year olds swimming across their local pool? That's.... insane.
Will some kid get stuck with a timer with a slow finger now and then? Yeah, probably. Just like every pitcher has to deal with umpires who don't know the strike zone and every soccer team has refs that make crappy calls. That's life.

Have you never attended any of these meets? What are you doing here?

+2. You clearly have never been to a meet. But please comment away. Your insights are enlightening .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The entitlement on this thread is insane. The fact remains that summer swim teams rely on many volunteers throughout the season. If everyone said f it, this team takes the volunteer commitment too seriously, then it won’t happen. The team shuts down.

What’s wrong with showing and investing in your kids’ activities? Summer swim is a community thing, invest in it or don’t participate.

Always the same parents that step up to help. It’s a shame, what are you teaching your children?

So selfish.

It's a bandwidth thing. Thankfully our team isn't run by people like you.

Your team is run by volunteers like PP and me, and we all have important jobs and a million other things to do. The difference is that we invest our time and effort in our communities and our kids, while you don’t. Maybe get off DCUM and do something productive with your time.

I can't. I literally can't. I would if I could. Does attacking a struggling person make you feel better?

Respectfully, getting out of your own head and helping others is exactly what you need.

What if it's not just in her head? You don't know.

You don't know if she has cancer, chronic daily migraines, somebody dying, a wrecking ball hit her house, divorcing, working 75 hours a week, tied up volunteering to give impoverished kids free surgeries to correct birth defects or representing battered women in court, or is some top secret CIA mixed martial arts lady in the middle of fighting some foreign adversary dude hanging off a balcony like Jason Bourne. You just don't know.

I've got one of those issues daily and have had multiple of those issues at one time and I find ways to volunteer at home. And, sure, its great to be a surgeon volunteering or a lawyer volunteering your time to help others, but that shouldn't be at the expense of your kids, who also need your attention and support and part of that is if you have them summer swim and the expectation is you help out there, since you are such a generous and giving person, no reason you cannot help out on swim team. Really, its less than two months.

Ok. Cases are in trial. Should I ask the judge for a continuance for summer swim team? Aside from death of parent, another parent just paralyzed weeks ago, my long covid, plus a wrecking ball to my house. Maybe that can get a continuance to show face to the swim mommies with nothing better to do then feign business and moral superiority?

A wrecking ball hit your house?

And you are in court on Saturday mornings?

I am very sorry about these things. I would have thought that the house hit by a wrecking ball would have made the news though.

I do pro bono on weekends, because I can't do it during my FT lawyer job hours, which also requires overtime work on yes weekends. I work days, nights, and weekends. Sorry moms like me can't tackle more urgent needs facing the swim community. Perhaps a call to your elected officials could bring about change for this important issue of absent swim moms devastating local swim teams. And 7 On Your Side.

So.
Then.
Your.
Kids.
Don’t.
Do.
Swim.
Team.
If.
You.
And/Or.
Their.
Other.
Parent.
Or.
Other.
Family.
Member.
Can’t.
Or.
Won’t.
Meet.
The.
Volunteer.
Requirements.

I’m so glad I could help clear this up for you.

If you are working, all day, all evening and all weekend, who is caring for your kids?

I am. I type, get up, type, get up, type get up. I have not sat on a couch to watch TV in probably 3 years. I don't in bed either. I did sit on the couch for 5 minutes once this year. Some moms are just super busy.

You're just better than everyone else. You win the mommy game. Congrats?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The entitlement on this thread is insane. The fact remains that summer swim teams rely on many volunteers throughout the season. If everyone said f it, this team takes the volunteer commitment too seriously, then it won’t happen. The team shuts down.

What’s wrong with showing and investing in your kids’ activities? Summer swim is a community thing, invest in it or don’t participate.

Always the same parents that step up to help. It’s a shame, what are you teaching your children?

So selfish.

It's a bandwidth thing. Thankfully our team isn't run by people like you.

Your team is run by volunteers like PP and me, and we all have important jobs and a million other things to do. The difference is that we invest our time and effort in our communities and our kids, while you don’t. Maybe get off DCUM and do something productive with your time.

I can't. I literally can't. I would if I could. Does attacking a struggling person make you feel better?

Respectfully, getting out of your own head and helping others is exactly what you need.

What if it's not just in her head? You don't know.

You don't know if she has cancer, chronic daily migraines, somebody dying, a wrecking ball hit her house, divorcing, working 75 hours a week, tied up volunteering to give impoverished kids free surgeries to correct birth defects or representing battered women in court, or is some top secret CIA mixed martial arts lady in the middle of fighting some foreign adversary dude hanging off a balcony like Jason Bourne. You just don't know.

I've got one of those issues daily and have had multiple of those issues at one time and I find ways to volunteer at home. And, sure, its great to be a surgeon volunteering or a lawyer volunteering your time to help others, but that shouldn't be at the expense of your kids, who also need your attention and support and part of that is if you have them summer swim and the expectation is you help out there, since you are such a generous and giving person, no reason you cannot help out on swim team. Really, its less than two months.

Ok. Cases are in trial. Should I ask the judge for a continuance for summer swim team? Aside from death of parent, another parent just paralyzed weeks ago, my long covid, plus a wrecking ball to my house. Maybe that can get a continuance to show face to the swim mommies with nothing better to do then feign business and moral superiority?

A wrecking ball hit your house?

And you are in court on Saturday mornings?

I am very sorry about these things. I would have thought that the house hit by a wrecking ball would have made the news though.

I do pro bono on weekends, because I can't do it during my FT lawyer job hours, which also requires overtime work on yes weekends. I work days, nights, and weekends. Sorry moms like me can't tackle more urgent needs facing the swim community. Perhaps a call to your elected officials could bring about change for this important issue of absent swim moms devastating local swim teams. And 7 On Your Side.

So.
Then.
Your.
Kids.
Don’t.
Do.
Swim.
Team.
If.
You.
And/Or.
Their.
Other.
Parent.
Or.
Other.
Family.
Member.
Can’t.
Or.
Won’t.
Meet.
The.
Volunteer.
Requirements.

I’m so glad I could help clear this up for you.

If you are working, all day, all evening and all weekend, who is caring for your kids?

I am. I type, get up, type, get up, type get up. I have not sat on a couch to watch TV in probably 3 years. I don't in bed either. I did sit on the couch for 5 minutes once this year. Some moms are just super busy.

Martyr away

[Anonymous]

It's clear that the volunteer requirements are more than many bargained for and are the cause of a lot of resentment. Rah rah parents who spend the most time and run the whole thing seem more sympathetic than the proles who crowd three deep behind a lane and leave the meet with wet sandals. Parents who pay to belong to the club think they get a pass from volunteering because they are really super busy like you wouldn't believe.

Asking for a hefty volunteer deposit doesn't really solve the problem because no one wants to show up for a 2 hour shift. It just alleviates the guilt of the people who are happy to pay and squeezes the rest of the suckers who now have to assume those shifts.

Since timers put the biggest burden on the meet, I don't think it would ruin the fun by going down to one or two timers per lane. And for those who say, "but we have always had 3 timers per lane", no you haven't. It used to be one timer and a starting gun. Times change. Three crappy stopwatch times are not much better than one crappy stopwatch time. Have those would be timers pass out popsicles or sit at a cupcake decorating table instead. I guarantee kids would appreciate that more than another timer at the end of the lane. Or better yet, let them watch their kids swim.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's clear that the volunteer requirements are more than many bargained for and are the cause of a lot of resentment. Rah rah parents who spend the most time and run the whole thing seem more sympathetic than the proles who crowd three deep behind a lane and leave the meet with wet sandals. Parents who pay to belong to the club think they get a pass from volunteering because they are really super busy like you wouldn't believe.

Asking for a hefty volunteer deposit doesn't really solve the problem because no one wants to show up for a 2 hour shift. It just alleviates the guilt of the people who are happy to pay and squeezes the rest of the suckers who now have to assume those shifts.

Since timers put the biggest burden on the meet, I don't think it would ruin the fun by going down to one or two timers per lane. And for those who say, "but we have always had 3 timers per lane", no you haven't. It used to be one timer and a starting gun. Times change. Three crappy stopwatch times are not much better than one crappy stopwatch time. Have those would be timers pass out popsicles or sit at a cupcake decorating table instead. I guarantee kids would appreciate that more than another timer at the end of the lane. Or better yet, let them watch their kids swim.

Just stop it already. You are in a small minority in favor of this. Most people are very happy with the way NVSL meets are run and don’t want this aspect to change. Besides, timing is a relatively enjoyable volunteer experience. I would do it every meet if our pool wasn’t short on certified judges. You should just find a pool in a league that does it the way you suggest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The entitlement on this thread is insane. The fact remains that summer swim teams rely on many volunteers throughout the season. If everyone said f it, this team takes the volunteer commitment too seriously, then it won’t happen. The team shuts down.

What’s wrong with showing and investing in your kids’ activities? Summer swim is a community thing, invest in it or don’t participate.

Always the same parents that step up to help. It’s a shame, what are you teaching your children?

So selfish.

It's a bandwidth thing. Thankfully our team isn't run by people like you.

Your team is run by volunteers like PP and me, and we all have important jobs and a million other things to do. The difference is that we invest our time and effort in our communities and our kids, while you don’t. Maybe get off DCUM and do something productive with your time.

I can't. I literally can't. I would if I could. Does attacking a struggling person make you feel better?

Respectfully, getting out of your own head and helping others is exactly what you need.

What if it's not just in her head? You don't know.

You don't know if she has cancer, chronic daily migraines, somebody dying, a wrecking ball hit her house, divorcing, working 75 hours a week, tied up volunteering to give impoverished kids free surgeries to correct birth defects or representing battered women in court, or is some top secret CIA mixed martial arts lady in the middle of fighting some foreign adversary dude hanging off a balcony like Jason Bourne. You just don't know.

I've got one of those issues daily and have had multiple of those issues at one time and I find ways to volunteer at home. And, sure, its great to be a surgeon volunteering or a lawyer volunteering your time to help others, but that shouldn't be at the expense of your kids, who also need your attention and support and part of that is if you have them summer swim and the expectation is you help out there, since you are such a generous and giving person, no reason you cannot help out on swim team. Really, its less than two months.

Ok. Cases are in trial. Should I ask the judge for a continuance for summer swim team? Aside from death of parent, another parent just paralyzed weeks ago, my long covid, plus a wrecking ball to my house. Maybe that can get a continuance to show face to the swim mommies with nothing better to do then feign business and moral superiority?

A wrecking ball hit your house?

And you are in court on Saturday mornings?

I am very sorry about these things. I would have thought that the house hit by a wrecking ball would have made the news though.

I do pro bono on weekends, because I can't do it during my FT lawyer job hours, which also requires overtime work on yes weekends. I work days, nights, and weekends. Sorry moms like me can't tackle more urgent needs facing the swim community. Perhaps a call to your elected officials could bring about change for this important issue of absent swim moms devastating local swim teams. And 7 On Your Side.

So.
Then.
Your.
Kids.
Don’t.
Do.
Swim.
Team.
If.
You.
And/Or.
Their.
Other.
Parent.
Or.
Other.
Family.
Member.
Can’t.
Or.
Won’t.
Meet.
The.
Volunteer.
Requirements.

I’m so glad I could help clear this up for you.

If you are working, all day, all evening and all weekend, who is caring for your kids?

I am. I type, get up, type, get up, type get up. I have not sat on a couch to watch TV in probably 3 years. I don't in bed either. I did sit on the couch for 5 minutes once this year. Some moms are just super busy.

Martyr away

I didn't start a thread about it. The martyrs are the swim moms complaining

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The entitlement on this thread is insane. The fact remains that summer swim teams rely on many volunteers throughout the season. If everyone said f it, this team takes the volunteer commitment too seriously, then it won’t happen. The team shuts down.

What’s wrong with showing and investing in your kids’ activities? Summer swim is a community thing, invest in it or don’t participate.

Always the same parents that step up to help. It’s a shame, what are you teaching your children?

So selfish.

It's a bandwidth thing. Thankfully our team isn't run by people like you.

Your team is run by volunteers like PP and me, and we all have important jobs and a million other things to do. The difference is that we invest our time and effort in our communities and our kids, while you don’t. Maybe get off DCUM and do something productive with your time.

I can't. I literally can't. I would if I could. Does attacking a struggling person make you feel better?

Respectfully, getting out of your own head and helping others is exactly what you need.

What if it's not just in her head? You don't know.

You don't know if she has cancer, chronic daily migraines, somebody dying, a wrecking ball hit her house, divorcing, working 75 hours a week, tied up volunteering to give impoverished kids free surgeries to correct birth defects or representing battered women in court, or is some top secret CIA mixed martial arts lady in the middle of fighting some foreign adversary dude hanging off a balcony like Jason Bourne. You just don't know.

I've got one of those issues daily and have had multiple of those issues at one time and I find ways to volunteer at home. And, sure, its great to be a surgeon volunteering or a lawyer volunteering your time to help others, but that shouldn't be at the expense of your kids, who also need your attention and support and part of that is if you have them summer swim and the expectation is you help out there, since you are such a generous and giving person, no reason you cannot help out on swim team. Really, its less than two months.

Ok. Cases are in trial. Should I ask the judge for a continuance for summer swim team? Aside from death of parent, another parent just paralyzed weeks ago, my long covid, plus a wrecking ball to my house. Maybe that can get a continuance to show face to the swim mommies with nothing better to do then feign business and moral superiority?

A wrecking ball hit your house?

And you are in court on Saturday mornings?

I am very sorry about these things. I would have thought that the house hit by a wrecking ball would have made the news though.

I do pro bono on weekends, because I can't do it during my FT lawyer job hours, which also requires overtime work on yes weekends. I work days, nights, and weekends. Sorry moms like me can't tackle more urgent needs facing the swim community. Perhaps a call to your elected officials could bring about change for this important issue of absent swim moms devastating local swim teams. And 7 On Your Side.

So.
Then.
Your.
Kids.
Don’t.
Do.
Swim.
Team.
If.
You.
And/Or.
Their.
Other.
Parent.
Or.
Other.
Family.
Member.
Can’t.
Or.
Won’t.
Meet.
The.
Volunteer.
Requirements.

I’m so glad I could help clear this up for you.

If you are working, all day, all evening and all weekend, who is caring for your kids?

I am. I type, get up, type, get up, type get up. I have not sat on a couch to watch TV in probably 3 years. I don't in bed either. I did sit on the couch for 5 minutes once this year. Some moms are just super busy.

Martyr away

I didn't start a thread about it. The martyrs are the swim moms complaining

Sweetie you posted about a wrecking ball hitting your house, how you apparently get up, type, get up, type, all day, and your crushing pro bono work. You win the whiniest poster award because you aren’t as special as you think you are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's clear that the volunteer requirements are more than many bargained for and are the cause of a lot of resentment. Rah rah parents who spend the most time and run the whole thing seem more sympathetic than the proles who crowd three deep behind a lane and leave the meet with wet sandals. Parents who pay to belong to the club think they get a pass from volunteering because they are really super busy like you wouldn't believe.

Asking for a hefty volunteer deposit doesn't really solve the problem because no one wants to show up for a 2 hour shift. It just alleviates the guilt of the people who are happy to pay and squeezes the rest of the suckers who now have to assume those shifts.

Since timers put the biggest burden on the meet, I don't think it would ruin the fun by going down to one or two timers per lane. And for those who say, "but we have always had 3 timers per lane", no you haven't. It used to be one timer and a starting gun. Times change. Three crappy stopwatch times are not much better than one crappy stopwatch time. Have those would be timers pass out popsicles or sit at a cupcake decorating table instead. I guarantee kids would appreciate that more than another timer at the end of the lane. Or better yet, let them watch their kids swim.

PREACH sister!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's clear that the volunteer requirements are more than many bargained for and are the cause of a lot of resentment. Rah rah parents who spend the most time and run the whole thing seem more sympathetic than the proles who crowd three deep behind a lane and leave the meet with wet sandals. Parents who pay to belong to the club think they get a pass from volunteering because they are really super busy like you wouldn't believe.

Asking for a hefty volunteer deposit doesn't really solve the problem because no one wants to show up for a 2 hour shift. It just alleviates the guilt of the people who are happy to pay and squeezes the rest of the suckers who now have to assume those shifts.

Since timers put the biggest burden on the meet, I don't think it would ruin the fun by going down to one or two timers per lane. And for those who say, "but we have always had 3 timers per lane", no you haven't. It used to be one timer and a starting gun. Times change. Three crappy stopwatch times are not much better than one crappy stopwatch time. Have those would be timers pass out popsicles or sit at a cupcake decorating table instead. I guarantee kids would appreciate that more than another timer at the end of the lane. Or better yet, let them watch their kids swim.

Again - this is an actual sport and this method relies on one person not making a mistake for an entire meet. Have you ever timed a meet and not had at least one time really off?

I think you need to find another sport.