Boys 2028 mess - considerations and solutions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

you’re welcome. Did you take my google suggestion?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

It is because that person is wrong they just don't want to admit it. What are these "dozens of programs in the area" that are no affiliated with the county as 501(c) entities. As stated before, they get reduced rates, if not free field time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

It is because that person is wrong they just don't want to admit it. What are these "dozens of programs in the area" that are no affiliated with the county as 501(c) entities. As stated before, they get reduced rates, if not free field time.

Our county rates for affiliated organizations is $175. Maybe by coincidence, a poster commented Mont Co is also $175. That is all that anything was put forth. That it's become too expensive as a result. There was math for you as well.

Club has decimated rec, in multiple ways. Now you're getting the fallout. Public schools, and now privates. Club's thriving, tho. So there's that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

It is because that person is wrong they just don't want to admit it. What are these "dozens of programs in the area" that are no affiliated with the county as 501(c) entities. As stated before, they get reduced rates, if not free field time.

Our county rates for affiliated organizations is $175. Maybe by coincidence, a poster commented Mont Co is also $175. That is all that anything was put forth. That it's become too expensive as a result. There was math for you as well.

Club has decimated rec, in multiple ways. Now you're getting the fallout. Public schools, and now privates. Club's thriving, tho. So there's that.

Sigh, again, that is the advertised rate for just some schmoe off the street wanting to rent 1 hr. I've been involved in this stuff. You are just wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

It is because that person is wrong they just don't want to admit it. What are these "dozens of programs in the area" that are no affiliated with the county as 501(c) entities. As stated before, they get reduced rates, if not free field time.

Our county rates for affiliated organizations is $175. Maybe by coincidence, a poster commented Mont Co is also $175. That is all that anything was put forth. That it's become too expensive as a result. There was math for you as well.

Club has decimated rec, in multiple ways. Now you're getting the fallout. Public schools, and now privates. Club's thriving, tho. So there's that.

Sigh, again, that is the advertised rate for just some schmoe off the street wanting to rent 1 hr. I've been involved in this stuff. You are just wrong.

Sigh. Again, no it's not. It's the local club's rate. And it's why 100% of their practices are on grass. You are not the only one involved in this stuff. And it's what other local clubs face as well and how they have to adjust (checked on with others).

Here I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that you say it's set in stone for you that it's free, but multiple times you've said it also might be discounted instead. But won't state what that discounted rate is. Then you or another guy has a "big file" and doesn't want to give away big trade secrets (they weren't asked for, just rates). If everything is free, why not just say that? Now multiple people have told you what rates are, but you're the dug-in guy that can't fathom anyone has a different experience than you.

Are you just a big club backer? No one has stated clubs are evil for this. And for fields at least, "clubs" mean of all sports.

[Anonymous]

Let's steer this back to the original purpose of the thread.

US Lacrosse rankings are out and DCE is ranked 28, Next Level is 24, and MadLax Capital/Supreme National is ranked 42/43. All three teams have robust rosters, and B teams for players who want to play competitive lacrosse but don't make the top team.

All three programs have their pros and cons.

DCE played Madlax this summer and it was a competitive 6-3 game. Not sure if NL played either DCE or MadLax this summer.

It looks like VLC did not get a team off the ground.

Is the mess now somewhat solved?

[Anonymous]

oops, NextLevel is 34, not 24, sorry for the typo

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

It is because that person is wrong they just don't want to admit it. What are these "dozens of programs in the area" that are no affiliated with the county as 501(c) entities. As stated before, they get reduced rates, if not free field time.

Our county rates for affiliated organizations is $175. Maybe by coincidence, a poster commented Mont Co is also $175. That is all that anything was put forth. That it's become too expensive as a result. There was math for you as well.

Club has decimated rec, in multiple ways. Now you're getting the fallout. Public schools, and now privates. Club's thriving, tho. So there's that.

Sigh, again, that is the advertised rate for just some schmoe off the street wanting to rent 1 hr. I've been involved in this stuff. You are just wrong.

Sigh. Again, no it's not. It's the local club's rate. And it's why 100% of their practices are on grass. You are not the only one involved in this stuff. And it's what other local clubs face as well and how they have to adjust (checked on with others).

Here I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that you say it's set in stone for you that it's free, but multiple times you've said it also might be discounted instead. But won't state what that discounted rate is. Then you or another guy has a "big file" and doesn't want to give away big trade secrets (they weren't asked for, just rates). If everything is free, why not just say that? Now multiple people have told you what rates are, but you're the dug-in guy that can't fathom anyone has a different experience than you.

Are you just a big club backer? No one has stated clubs are evil for this. And for fields at least, "clubs" mean of all sports.

You are never going to get it and I'm wasting my time because you don't understand the difference between county rec, affiliated teams, and club teams and how rates are charged to them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

It is because that person is wrong they just don't want to admit it. What are these "dozens of programs in the area" that are no affiliated with the county as 501(c) entities. As stated before, they get reduced rates, if not free field time.

Our county rates for affiliated organizations is $175. Maybe by coincidence, a poster commented Mont Co is also $175. That is all that anything was put forth. That it's become too expensive as a result. There was math for you as well.

Club has decimated rec, in multiple ways. Now you're getting the fallout. Public schools, and now privates. Club's thriving, tho. So there's that.

Sigh, again, that is the advertised rate for just some schmoe off the street wanting to rent 1 hr. I've been involved in this stuff. You are just wrong.

Sigh. Again, no it's not. It's the local club's rate. And it's why 100% of their practices are on grass. You are not the only one involved in this stuff. And it's what other local clubs face as well and how they have to adjust (checked on with others).

Here I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that you say it's set in stone for you that it's free, but multiple times you've said it also might be discounted instead. But won't state what that discounted rate is. Then you or another guy has a "big file" and doesn't want to give away big trade secrets (they weren't asked for, just rates). If everything is free, why not just say that? Now multiple people have told you what rates are, but you're the dug-in guy that can't fathom anyone has a different experience than you.

Are you just a big club backer? No one has stated clubs are evil for this. And for fields at least, "clubs" mean of all sports.

You are never going to get it and I'm wasting my time because you don't understand the difference between county rec, affiliated teams, and club teams and how rates are charged to them.

Thank the lord. You saying it over and over while I've been involved in all 3 of those doesn't make you correct. Appreciate you no longer continuing this.

[Anonymous]

I payed $50 for 3 hrs so my 10 year old son could have a flag football bday party.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I payed $50 for 3 hrs so my 10 year old son could have a flag football bday party.

Sounds like a summer birthday. You reclassing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a COVID impact. Lacrosse will rebound….

Maybe a factor, but the emphasis on club over local isn't only a lacrosse phenomenon. Additionally, the clubification of youth sports in general has also started an arms race for reserving fields, with deeper pocketed clubs (of all sports) pushing out rec and local teams.

The overall climate of youth sports is beyond the pale.

Except in NOVA county facilities give precedent to county/rec teams. Then travel teams get the remainder. So that isn’t true at all

Thanks, Cabell.
Maybe you misunderstood his post or don't know how supply and demand works.
Rec charges(d) $150-200 a year. Fields saw they can charge $175-250 an hour to clubs and rec can't afford that.

You can charge thousands and unless you're an idiot take home half even while doing that and $4-5000+ tournaments.

I understand it completely. The PP is just wrong.

You don’t know how field space is allocated. Again, when the county sends out county field space reservation. Time is given to rec teams 1st at no charge or extremely low rates. Then outside parties are give their choice at much higher rates.

This^^^ I do the schedule for our rec organization.

So how much does field space cost per hour for you, turf vs grass, and where?

i didnt respond None ya, but i don’t really care to sumbit our field schedule to you. sits complicated and a big file.

You can easily google that or you can call PRCS and see what they offer for 501(c)(3)’s for the times you need and location and type of field you need to rent.

NP, these are the responses I expected. Vague assertions and then I can't tell you anything, top secret. You backed a guy that didn't understand that a singular point, turf field rates, is an issue. Not priority.

It's not complicated, even if you have it in a big file. But thanks for chiming in.

Not the PP but...

Again, you don't understand the process. You seem to think it is backwards - club gets the pick of fields first, then rec. DPR's charge low or no charge field use to their own rec programs use. Any charges is for accounting purposes. So even if they charged their own programs for field use, it is really just one hand moving money to the other. Come each season, DPR gives rec organizations priority when picking fields. Then what is left over is provided to outside organizations at higher rates.

There is a reason most lax clubs rent private school fields because they can get priority through paying more. They don't like using DPRs because they are in the back of the line.

If you don't believe me, do what the PP stated, just call or google. It isn't hard to find.

quote]THE. ONLY. PEOPLE. THAT. ARE. TALKING. ABOUT. PRIORITY. ARE. THOSE. THAT. ARE. NOT. FOLLOWING. THE. DISCUSSION.

If you are given priority to buy a $3 million dollar home, but cannot afford it, it does not matter that you had "priority".

Here is the simple math:
- 20 players × $165 - 175 = $3,300- 3500 in revenue

- 10- 11 weeks of practice 2x per week (on a half field to be split, no less)
- your share of 8 games

- that is expenses of 21-22.5x $175 per hour (10-11 + 4 x 1.5 hours):
or $3,675 - 3,937 expense for field time only

So you are in the hole from $4-600 before paying for:
- refs
- uniforms
- NVYLL or other
- equipment
- balls
- anything else

The point was that the proliferation of expensive club has priced out rec for good fields. The counties know they can fill fields with them, so they can set prices high. There is no such thing as free turf fields for everyone in rec. CYA et.al. may have had a good thing going (though that's ending for them), but parks and rec is charging.

Can they still get on for games? Yes. Practices rained out in the rainy season? Too bad.

you’re forgetting that we are getting much of our field time FOR FREE not a discount FREE. READ THIS AGAIN FREE. This is very clearly outlined in the field allocation policies and procedures the prices for commercial use which is clearly defined vs501(c) orgs that meet the criteria as Affiliated Leagues.

you people are so lazy. you can’t even google.

No one is "forgetting that". Just because you get whatever deal you get, doesn't mean there aren't dozens of programs in the area that do not. This was a simple point made by the OP and has turned in to a $&!+ show by a bunch of know-it-alls. Please go be Mr. Helper somewhere else.

you clearly are out of your depth of understanding how this all works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let's steer this back to the original purpose of the thread.

US Lacrosse rankings are out and DCE is ranked 28, Next Level is 24, and MadLax Capital/Supreme National is ranked 42/43. All three teams have robust rosters, and B teams for players who want to play competitive lacrosse but don't make the top team.

All three programs have their pros and cons.

DCE played Madlax this summer and it was a competitive 6-3 game. Not sure if NL played either DCE or MadLax this summer.

It looks like VLC did not get a team off the ground.

Is the mess now somewhat solved?

Solved? Having no DMV teams in the top 5 top 10 or top 20 was unthinkable a few years ago. Club is not thriving. Talent in the DMV is way down due to the fact the clubs did not support rec leagues. This is the result. In the 2018-2023 years all the top kids played rec and the top did club but it was easy to do both.