"A Cheap, Race-Neutral Way to Close the Racial Wealth Gap..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$50,000 a year is not "cheap," especially in our current budget situation. We'd be saddling all of our kids, including black kids, with paying off the debt for generations. Even Clinton was only talking about $1,000 to $2,000 per kid. I have a feeling this wouldn't live up to peoples' expectations.

The study quoted in the article estimated the cost at $80 billion.
After the $700 billion bank bailout in 2008 and the recent $2 trillion stimulus package it seems cheap in comparison.

$80 billion a year, presumably in perpetuity, presumably rising with inflation every year.

I'd totally support a more modest nest egg, though, of a few thousand.

[Anonymous]

It's crap and has been debunked - Ezra Klein and Annie Lowrey are the neoliberal shill versions of Matt and LIz Bruenig.

[Anonymous]

The fascinating thing about all this is that "white" America is rapidly declining as a share of the population and the country rapidly diversifying. I think the reason why the racial, or rather, black racial issues, have become so intensified and bitter in recent years is that the old argument of blaming all their problems on racism has gotten harder when at the same time tens of millions non-whites have immigrated to the United States and in that time, despite not being white, have outperformed black America, and many have even outperformed white America. This substantially weakens the old racial arguments.

That's why it's shifted away from personal, direct individual racism to institutional racism. 50 years ago the racial argument was based on too many individual racists, teachers, employers, politicians, neighbors, being racist, and that to fight racism you had to combat the racists populating the institutions through educating them, and welcoming blacks into the institutions. But flash forward 50 years of Affirmative Action and a white population that is incredibly more tolerant and race blind, and (which is often ignored these days) a flourishing black middle class and many more blacks in leadership position, so many of the problems facing particularly poorer blacks remain. Blacks continue to commit disproportionate amounts of crime and urban deprived neighborhoods remain disproportionately black.

Now the blame for the problems is shifting, not to any individual responsibility, but to a focus on "institutional racism," calling for racism within the framework of American society and American institutions rather than the individuals, and by making it institutional, the proponents override all the current racial tolerance and diversity and affirmative action programs to reach back to the past as an excuse for today's behavior. That's why if Hispanic gang members shoot each other, it's not racism, but when black gang members shoot each other, it's racism. That's why poor white people in places of generational poverty, such as rural America and Appalachia, are not absolved of their poverty, and even openly mocked and trashed, but poor blacks in inner cities are absolved of any responsibilities for their poverty and it's racist to make fun of their cultural behaviors.

I do see and understand why. A focus on blaming "institutional" racism of the past to present allows people to avoid looking at other things more close to home and provides an easy scrapegoat for angers and frustrations.

But ultimately, I suspect it won't go much beyond severely worsening many things. And, ironically, it is still going to the white man with a begging bowl.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So we incentivize people not to work hard and rather just to be lazy and crap out more kids they can't afford. Great.

Isn’t that what we have been doing already?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's crap and has been debunked - Ezra Klein and Annie Lowrey are the neoliberal shill versions of Matt and LIz Bruenig.

Source, please? I'm actually curious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The fascinating thing about all this is that "white" America is rapidly declining as a share of the population and the country rapidly diversifying. I think the reason why the racial, or rather, black racial issues, have become so intensified and bitter in recent years is that the old argument of blaming all their problems on racism has gotten harder when at the same time tens of millions non-whites have immigrated to the United States and in that time, despite not being white, have outperformed black America, and many have even outperformed white America. This substantially weakens the old racial arguments.

That's why it's shifted away from personal, direct individual racism to institutional racism. 50 years ago the racial argument was based on too many individual racists, teachers, employers, politicians, neighbors, being racist, and that to fight racism you had to combat the racists populating the institutions through educating them, and welcoming blacks into the institutions. But flash forward 50 years of Affirmative Action and a white population that is incredibly more tolerant and race blind, and (which is often ignored these days) a flourishing black middle class and many more blacks in leadership position, so many of the problems facing particularly poorer blacks remain. Blacks continue to commit disproportionate amounts of crime and urban deprived neighborhoods remain disproportionately black.

Now the blame for the problems is shifting, not to any individual responsibility, but to a focus on "institutional racism," calling for racism within the framework of American society and American institutions rather than the individuals, and by making it institutional, the proponents override all the current racial tolerance and diversity and affirmative action programs to reach back to the past as an excuse for today's behavior. That's why if Hispanic gang members shoot each other, it's not racism, but when black gang members shoot each other, it's racism. That's why poor white people in places of generational poverty, such as rural America and Appalachia, are not absolved of their poverty, and even openly mocked and trashed, but poor blacks in inner cities are absolved of any responsibilities for their poverty and it's racist to make fun of their cultural behaviors.

I do see and understand why. A focus on blaming "institutional" racism of the past to present allows people to avoid looking at other things more close to home and provides an easy scrapegoat for angers and frustrations.

But ultimately, I suspect it won't go much beyond severely worsening many things. And, ironically, it is still going to the white man with a begging bowl.

No quotes needed for the institutional in institutional racism. It is in fact very real. The US racial caste system puts Black descendants of slavery and Native Americans at the lowest ranks below non-white immigrants. The failure of people like you to acknowledge it, allows it to continue. There are also systems that keep people impoverished which often overlap with race, but that doesn't change the fact that the biggest predictor of how much lifetime wealth you will accumulate is race. A white high school dropout earns more than a black college grad because institutions protect white mediocrity by deferring black opportunity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is SO stupid.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The fascinating thing about all this is that "white" America is rapidly declining as a share of the population and the country rapidly diversifying. I think the reason why the racial, or rather, black racial issues, have become so intensified and bitter in recent years is that the old argument of blaming all their problems on racism has gotten harder when at the same time tens of millions non-whites have immigrated to the United States and in that time, despite not being white, have outperformed black America, and many have even outperformed white America. This substantially weakens the old racial arguments.

That's why it's shifted away from personal, direct individual racism to institutional racism. 50 years ago the racial argument was based on too many individual racists, teachers, employers, politicians, neighbors, being racist, and that to fight racism you had to combat the racists populating the institutions through educating them, and welcoming blacks into the institutions. But flash forward 50 years of Affirmative Action and a white population that is incredibly more tolerant and race blind, and (which is often ignored these days) a flourishing black middle class and many more blacks in leadership position, so many of the problems facing particularly poorer blacks remain. Blacks continue to commit disproportionate amounts of crime and urban deprived neighborhoods remain disproportionately black.

Now the blame for the problems is shifting, not to any individual responsibility, but to a focus on "institutional racism," calling for racism within the framework of American society and American institutions rather than the individuals, and by making it institutional, the proponents override all the current racial tolerance and diversity and affirmative action programs to reach back to the past as an excuse for today's behavior. That's why if Hispanic gang members shoot each other, it's not racism, but when black gang members shoot each other, it's racism. That's why poor white people in places of generational poverty, such as rural America and Appalachia, are not absolved of their poverty, and even openly mocked and trashed, but poor blacks in inner cities are absolved of any responsibilities for their poverty and it's racist to make fun of their cultural behaviors.

I do see and understand why. A focus on blaming "institutional" racism of the past to present allows people to avoid looking at other things more close to home and provides an easy scrapegoat for angers and frustrations.

But ultimately, I suspect it won't go much beyond severely worsening many things. And, ironically, it is still going to the white man with a begging bowl.

No quotes needed for the institutional in institutional racism. It is in fact very real. The US racial caste system puts Black descendants of slavery and Native Americans at the lowest ranks below non-white immigrants. The failure of people like you to acknowledge it, allows it to continue. There are also systems that keep people impoverished which often overlap with race, but that doesn't change the fact that the biggest predictor of how much lifetime wealth you will accumulate is race. A white high school dropout earns more than a black college grad because institutions protect white mediocrity by deferring black opportunity.

How does it put them below if they have the following that immigrants don't have:

- they speak fluent English (most of the immigrants come here either without speaking any English or with a very poor English)
- they was offered free English grammar education for 12 years (all the immigrants can hope is free ESL classes in a local library at the large urban areas)
- they have family support (sometimes extensive family with grandparents, siblings, aunts and anckles)
- they have legal status to work
- they have Affirmative Action to go to college
- they can join military (for some immigrants this is not an option)
- if they are poor, they are eligible for financial aid in college (immigrants don't )
- they can drive (a lot of immigrants moving from big cities or rural areas never drove)

All the listed above put blacks way above any white or non-white immigrant at the starting point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

The country owes a debt

I disagree. I don't believe in reparations.

I believe in addressing systemic poverty regardless of race. Not all poor POC in the US came from slaves.

Do you not believe in reparations? Or do you just not believe in reparations for slavery?... because of to whom the payments would go. The disproportional existence of poverty among POC is a relic of slavery. Paying restitution for the biggest wrong in American history is the first step towards truly addressing wealth gap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$50,000 a year is not "cheap," especially in our current budget situation. We'd be saddling all of our kids, including black kids, with paying off the debt for generations. Even Clinton was only talking about $1,000 to $2,000 per kid. I have a feeling this wouldn't live up to peoples' expectations.

The study quoted in the article estimated the cost at $80 billion.
After the $700 billion bank bailout in 2008 and the recent $2 trillion stimulus package it seems cheap in comparison.

Exactly. Like Canadian health care, it is faster, cheaper and better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$50,000 a year is not "cheap," especially in our current budget situation. We'd be saddling all of our kids, including black kids, with paying off the debt for generations. Even Clinton was only talking about $1,000 to $2,000 per kid. I have a feeling this wouldn't live up to peoples' expectations.

The study quoted in the article estimated the cost at $80 billion.
After the $700 billion bank bailout in 2008 and the recent $2 trillion stimulus package it seems cheap in comparison.

Exactly. Like Canadian health care, it is faster, cheaper and better.

From a policy standpoint, I'd quibble on the "better" part.

Call me paternalistic, but I'd want to see this actually be used to build wealth or human capital (aka education).

I'd be happy to spend $80 billion, or more. But on drastic reform of schools in low-income areas; increasing the mortgage interest deduction for low-income taxpayers (thereby making homeownership cheaper for them); and universal healthcare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is SO stupid.

+1

It's actually beyond stupid.

[Anonymous]

Or we could have free quality childcare for the under 5 set. Classes with 20 kids max for everyone with reading and math support. Pretty much scaffold and I do as many community issues (if they exist) as we can and lift all those kids up and up and give them portions beyond getting pregnant at 16 etc. and yes tracking. Talented people are needed for all sorts of trades and jobs that don't need college but can lead to a successful life and independence from the govt. Teach budgeting and proper shop and intro to nursing along with college prep.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Or we could have free quality childcare for the under 5 set. Classes with 20 kids max for everyone with reading and math support. Pretty much scaffold and I do as many community issues (if they exist) as we can and lift all those kids up and up and give them portions beyond getting pregnant at 16 etc. and yes tracking. Talented people are needed for all sorts of trades and jobs that don't need college but can lead to a successful life and independence from the govt. Teach budgeting and proper shop and intro to nursing along with college prep.

This. I'd pay $800 billion for this. But I don't want to pay $80 billion when there's no assurance the money will actually lead to better lives beyond immediate consumption.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The fascinating thing about all this is that "white" America is rapidly declining as a share of the population and the country rapidly diversifying. I think the reason why the racial, or rather, black racial issues, have become so intensified and bitter in recent years is that the old argument of blaming all their problems on racism has gotten harder when at the same time tens of millions non-whites have immigrated to the United States and in that time, despite not being white, have outperformed black America, and many have even outperformed white America. This substantially weakens the old racial arguments.

That's why it's shifted away from personal, direct individual racism to institutional racism. 50 years ago the racial argument was based on too many individual racists, teachers, employers, politicians, neighbors, being racist, and that to fight racism you had to combat the racists populating the institutions through educating them, and welcoming blacks into the institutions. But flash forward 50 years of Affirmative Action and a white population that is incredibly more tolerant and race blind, and (which is often ignored these days) a flourishing black middle class and many more blacks in leadership position, so many of the problems facing particularly poorer blacks remain. Blacks continue to commit disproportionate amounts of crime and urban deprived neighborhoods remain disproportionately black.

Now the blame for the problems is shifting, not to any individual responsibility, but to a focus on "institutional racism," calling for racism within the framework of American society and American institutions rather than the individuals, and by making it institutional, the proponents override all the current racial tolerance and diversity and affirmative action programs to reach back to the past as an excuse for today's behavior. That's why if Hispanic gang members shoot each other, it's not racism, but when black gang members shoot each other, it's racism. That's why poor white people in places of generational poverty, such as rural America and Appalachia, are not absolved of their poverty, and even openly mocked and trashed, but poor blacks in inner cities are absolved of any responsibilities for their poverty and it's racist to make fun of their cultural behaviors.

I do see and understand why. A focus on blaming "institutional" racism of the past to present allows people to avoid looking at other things more close to home and provides an easy scrapegoat for angers and frustrations.

But ultimately, I suspect it won't go much beyond severely worsening many things. And, ironically, it is still going to the white man with a begging bowl.

No quotes needed for the institutional in institutional racism. It is in fact very real. The US racial caste system puts Black descendants of slavery and Native Americans at the lowest ranks below non-white immigrants. The failure of people like you to acknowledge it, allows it to continue. There are also systems that keep people impoverished which often overlap with race, but that doesn't change the fact that the biggest predictor of how much lifetime wealth you will accumulate is race. A white high school dropout earns more than a black college grad because institutions protect white mediocrity by deferring black opportunity.

How does it put them below if they have the following that immigrants don't have:

- they speak fluent English (most of the immigrants come here either without speaking any English or with a very poor English)
- they was offered free English grammar education for 12 years (all the immigrants can hope is free ESL classes in a local library at the large urban areas)
- they have family support (sometimes extensive family with grandparents, siblings, aunts and anckles)
- they have legal status to work
- they have Affirmative Action to go to college
- they can join military (for some immigrants this is not an option)
- if they are poor, they are eligible for financial aid in college (immigrants don't )
- they can drive (a lot of immigrants moving from big cities or rural areas never drove)

All the listed above put blacks way above any white or non-white immigrant at the starting point.

Lol you do realize that for many of the people that immigrate here these descriptors do not apply or disappear after a few years. I know this definition of immigrant you provided is all too convenient for your argument, but immigrants come from a broad range of socioeconomic classes and individual circumstances.