Valuable artifact - what to do

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are you looking for here Op?

You sound like an a-hole. If you take it, you will be an a-hole with a vase to look at.

If you don’t, you’ll be an a-hole who wants a vase to look at.

i am looking for ideas, opinions. you have not been helpful.

oh no, whatever shall I do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

Are you willing to lose siblings over an artifact?

no but over having lawyers involved absolutely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

I am not quite sure but I think I would be ok. Artifact’s origin is country B. Some people extracted it there and eventually gave it to my mother as a gift (long story but nothing illegal) in a country A. I don’t think we can legalize this but I find it unlikely that we would have to return it to country B ( countries A and B are often at war).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

I am not quite sure but I think I would be ok. Artifact’s origin is country B. Some people extracted it there and eventually gave it to my mother as a gift (long story but nothing illegal) in a country A. I don’t think we can legalize this but I find it unlikely that we would have to return it to country B ( countries A and B are often at war).

Four pages in and now you're dropping this bombshell on us?

What is with this trickle of information??

Just lay the whole origin story out, or you're only getting partial advice if we don't know ALL of the circumstances.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

I am not quite sure but I think I would be ok. Artifact’s origin is country B. Some people extracted it there and eventually gave it to my mother as a gift (long story but nothing illegal) in a country A. I don’t think we can legalize this but I find it unlikely that we would have to return it to country B ( countries A and B are often at war).

Are you just making this up as you go along? because it kind of sounds that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

I am not quite sure but I think I would be ok. Artifact’s origin is country B. Some people extracted it there and eventually gave it to my mother as a gift (long story but nothing illegal) in a country A. I don’t think we can legalize this but I find it unlikely that we would have to return it to country B ( countries A and B are often at war).

Four pages in and now you're dropping this bombshell on us?

What is with this trickle of information??

Just lay the whole origin story out, or you're only getting partial advice if we don't know ALL of the circumstances.

how is this a bombshell? how did you think we got it?

i am ok with partial advice. what i need are interesting thoughts, arguments, facts, ideas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

I am not quite sure but I think I would be ok. Artifact’s origin is country B. Some people extracted it there and eventually gave it to my mother as a gift (long story but nothing illegal) in a country A. I don’t think we can legalize this but I find it unlikely that we would have to return it to country B ( countries A and B are often at war).

Four pages in and now you're dropping this bombshell on us?

What is with this trickle of information??

Just lay the whole origin story out, or you're only getting partial advice if we don't know ALL of the circumstances.

how is this a bombshell? how did you think we got it?

i am ok with partial advice. what i need are interesting thoughts, arguments, facts, ideas.

DCUM likes nothing more than solving a LSAT question.

You say this object is worth 20k and cannot be exported. But now you say this object did not originate in your home country but from another country. Given that these two countries are often at war with each other, these are nearby countries.

It does make one wonder why this object is prevented from leaving your country if it originated in a different country, so how could it be considered part of the cultural patrimony? Perhaps cultural groups spanned borders (like the Armenians in Armenia and Turkey). This object, however, is a large vase. What large vase is worth 20k? High quality Chinese porcelain can be. But is China at war with surrounding countries? No. Would China restrict the export of a rare Vietnamese vase? I don't know. But is it worth 20k? If you saw a similar object in a Christie's catalogue, keep in mind that object is on the open market, which is a very different context than an object that cannot be exported due to export restrictions. So while it may be worth 20k at auction in New York, it's really probably only worth whatever anyone in the country is willing to pay for it, so the market is quite different. It could be worth only 5k, maybe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

I am not quite sure but I think I would be ok. Artifact’s origin is country B. Some people extracted it there and eventually gave it to my mother as a gift (long story but nothing illegal) in a country A. I don’t think we can legalize this but I find it unlikely that we would have to return it to country B ( countries A and B are often at war).

Four pages in and now you're dropping this bombshell on us?

What is with this trickle of information??

Just lay the whole origin story out, or you're only getting partial advice if we don't know ALL of the circumstances.

how is this a bombshell? how did you think we got it?

i am ok with partial advice. what i need are interesting thoughts, arguments, facts, ideas.

You're smug, sanctimonious & completely insufferable.

I hope your siblings retain attorneys and tie you up in court forever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am thinking now about this and I am realizing that it is very unlikely the siblings will agree to be bought out. A similar things happened with the whole apartment - my siblings refused to sell it, to buy me out or to let me buy them out. As a result I had to buy a separate residence because my parents’ apartment has become unlivable. All their stuff is still there and I have nowhere to put my own things (much less my children’s). The oldest sibling is very dominant and has strong hoarding tendencies. They would either take the artifact for themselves or (more likely) pressure the middle one to stop me from taking it. They want to keep everything in the apartment and the apartment is untouchable.

So, leave it where it is then. Unless they agree, you can't take it.

but I can actually take it.

And your siblings can seek whatever legal remedy they are entitled to.

but they are not going to do it. they would lose the artifact + sibling. i could have legally forced them to sell the apartment but didn't.

They might. If you take the thing, they haven't got it anyway and they might not care if it makes you angry. If you are not legally allowed to have the thing at all, they can cause you a world of hurt. You had only said that you could not sell it, which is not the same thing.

I am not quite sure but I think I would be ok. Artifact’s origin is country B. Some people extracted it there and eventually gave it to my mother as a gift (long story but nothing illegal) in a country A. I don’t think we can legalize this but I find it unlikely that we would have to return it to country B ( countries A and B are often at war).

Four pages in and now you're dropping this bombshell on us?

What is with this trickle of information??

Just lay the whole origin story out, or you're only getting partial advice if we don't know ALL of the circumstances.

how is this a bombshell? how did you think we got it?

i am ok with partial advice. what i need are interesting thoughts, arguments, facts, ideas.

You're smug, sanctimonious & completely insufferable.

I hope your siblings retain attorneys and tie you up in court forever.

don't hate me just because i own a vacation home.

[Anonymous]

OK, OP, the jig is up. Give Santa Anna's leg back.

[Anonymous]

OP: I really want this item. Can I steal it from my siblings?
DCUM: No.
OP: But what if it's a really cool rare object that I really love and want?
DCUM: Still no.
OP: But what can I suggest to my siblings to make them let me have it?
DCUM: Pay them.
OP: No.
DCUM: Then it's stealing and it's wrong.
OP: You aren't helpful!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP: I really want this item. Can I steal it from my siblings?
DCUM: No.
OP: But what if it's a really cool rare object that I really love and want?
DCUM: Still no.
OP: But what can I suggest to my siblings to make them let me have it?
DCUM: Pay them.
OP: No.
DCUM: Then it's stealing and it's wrong.
OP: You aren't helpful!

This, exactly.

[Anonymous]

God, its killing me. Why can't the vase leave the country? Was it stolen in a war from country A? Tell us the story!

[Anonymous]

NP. I think this is what's going on--OP correct me if I'm wrong.

OP is younger than her siblings and unlike them, grew up around the object, so it's sentimental to her and not to them.

Therefore, a copy is not the same to OP. She wants the original.

She is worried that her siblings will get grabby with her and want the object just because she wants it.

She feels more entitled to the object, because she has the sentimental feelings toward it, but believes they'd get grabby either because they are grabby, or because it becomes a power situation.

She's thinking, in tort language..."Take and Pay." That it's easier to ask forgiveness than permission.

All good, OP, until you don't want to pay your siblings.

The object is worth MORE than market value to you because you have sentimental value attached to it.

So if you want this thing AND want to keep your relationships intact, I vote Take and Pay. Take, then offer MORE than 1/3. "There was a water leak so fixed it, but in doing so I had to move Object to my house. Object is worth 20K--see valuation attached to this email-- so I'm mailing each of you a check for 8K, which is over 1/3."

How is that, OP?