Why do parents get so worked up about prepping their kid to get into AAP?

[Anonymous]

No. I’m not sure how you interpreted that. Wow - what a crazy stretch!

I’ve heard from folks in education that have be concern about AAP and the high numbers is that it often seems like White flight. Sad but true is that many immigrants/children of immigrants are unaware of how the education system works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying that brown people will not push themselves and try to participate/perform in the AAP program? Are you also implying that by not allowing self selection we are making sure to provide diversity opportunities for brown people?

DP. Yes, this is the reason that the program was expanded, to bring in more diverse students. It hasn't been wholly successful.

[Anonymous]

Happy New Year! Welcome to the 2018 edition of the "Down with the preppers" edition of DCUM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everybody would have something to gain if FCPS has a system where no one can prep into AAP so that you can preserve the quality of the program and accept only those kids who really need the services as originally designed. This prepping issue will never go away unless FCPS addresses this. Obviously looking at everything else besides test scores such as GBRS work examples is helping to solve the problem.

Maybe at the end of each year, the teacher can make a placement recommendation--based on the work performed in the AAP classroom---Continue with AAP or Do Not Continue with AAP. That way the kids that prepped but can't keep up are weeded out for the following year.

Sometimes they do. I know someone who had a 3rd grade teacher tell her that one of her kids (twins) should not be in AAP. The mom said "thanks for your advice." She kept the kid in AAP. He's doing just fine as a 6th grader. I'm glad that mom didn't listen. Parents can opt out if their kid is stuggling and stressing too much... that's a choice they have. I've known a few who did that. Once the kid qualifies, I think the school has an obligation to meet the kid's needs (even if that involves some ADHD or perfectionism or anxiety). If they want to increase the requirements or scores to get in -- fine with me. But, I do not like the idea of a single teacher thinking that they should oust a kid from AAP. It takes more than one person's opinion to get the kid into AAP. It should take a lot more than one person pushing a kid out.

+1. When my son was in second grade he was not in pool. He also had a low GBRS (under 12). Based on everything I read here, he is the kid who waters down AAP by being selected. What he did have was a 147 WISC. He got into AAP. His 3rd grade teacher suggested he shouldn't be there because he was on level in language arts (which she deemed meant he was behind) and had anxiety which showed up in the classroom. We didn't listen to her. Fast forward to middle school and he got all A's his first semester in all AAP classes. Thankfully we never listened to her. We will see what the rest of the year brings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Make AAP and general education self-selective. But the fear is that gen ed will be “Brown” and aap will be “white” and “Asian” but this is already the fact. Alternatively, our country could start CONTROLLING our borders because the issue in gen ed is the number of low learners that the teachers/schools focus on to receive a pass rate, and the just fine kids are not stimulated or challenged. Until we fix a broken policy, aap will remain the choice for educated parents.

Are you saying that brown people will not push themselves and try to participate/perform in the AAP program? Are you also implying that by not allowing self selection we are making sure to provide diversity opportunities for brown people?

In a way, we already see this in the TJ applications... just look at the demographics of applicants:
https://www.fcps.edu/news/fcps-offers-admission-tjhsst-490-students

Brown is very underrepresented.

[Anonymous]

A simple solution would be to reverse the current approach -- instead of going through all these efforts to select kids for AAP, make AAP the default for FCPS, and create a special program (call it whatever) for those kids who can't keep up or need the extra help. This would also raise the overall standard for elementary education. Even the FCPS AAP is far behind the education standards of other countries, if not other parts of the US.

Yes, make AAP the standard curriculum for all kids. Have a separate program for the kids "who can't keep up or need the extra help," as noted above. And then have a small program for the four or five percent of kids who learn and understand new things so quickly that they really need a different learning environment than the regular classroom. Those kids do better in a really different learning situation and with teachers who understand how they are different and can support educational needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

A simple solution would be to reverse the current approach -- instead of going through all these efforts to select kids for AAP, make AAP the default for FCPS, and create a special program (call it whatever) for those kids who can't keep up or need the extra help. This would also raise the overall standard for elementary education. Even the FCPS AAP is far behind the education standards of other countries, if not other parts of the US.

Yes, make AAP the standard curriculum for all kids. Have a separate program for the kids "who can't keep up or need the extra help," as noted above. And then have a small program for the four or five percent of kids who learn and understand new things so quickly that they really need a different learning environment than the regular classroom. Those kids do better in a really different learning situation and with teachers who understand how they are different and can support educational needs.

+infinity

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying that brown people will not push themselves and try to participate/perform in the AAP program? Are you also implying that by not allowing self selection we are making sure to provide diversity opportunities for brown people?

DP. Yes, this is the reason that the program was expanded, to bring in more diverse students. It hasn't been wholly successful.

Well, currently we do NOT allow self selection. If self selection is allowed what would stop the diverse student groups from participating? We stop them now, and include a few. Most of their parents lack knowledge and ability to fill out a parent referral, and can't afford outside testing. Very few ones who are handpicked by the teacher, or have high scores get screened.

Anyway, it's OK as long as the integrity of the program stays intact, and level IV does not become just another regular classroom, which from what I read it seems it is already heading that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

A simple solution would be to reverse the current approach -- instead of going through all these efforts to select kids for AAP, make AAP the default for FCPS, and create a special program (call it whatever) for those kids who can't keep up or need the extra help. This would also raise the overall standard for elementary education. Even the FCPS AAP is far behind the education standards of other countries, if not other parts of the US.

Yes, make AAP the standard curriculum for all kids. Have a separate program for the kids "who can't keep up or need the extra help," as noted above. And then have a small program for the four or five percent of kids who learn and understand new things so quickly that they really need a different learning environment than the regular classroom. Those kids do better in a really different learning situation and with teachers who understand how they are different and can support educational needs.

Sounds excellent but haven't we been there and done that? I mean isn't this the way it was back in the dark ages? You really think singling out the slow learners is a good idea?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

A simple solution would be to reverse the current approach -- instead of going through all these efforts to select kids for AAP, make AAP the default for FCPS, and create a special program (call it whatever) for those kids who can't keep up or need the extra help. This would also raise the overall standard for elementary education. Even the FCPS AAP is far behind the education standards of other countries, if not other parts of the US.

Yes, make AAP the standard curriculum for all kids. Have a separate program for the kids "who can't keep up or need the extra help," as noted above. And then have a small program for the four or five percent of kids who learn and understand new things so quickly that they really need a different learning environment than the regular classroom. Those kids do better in a really different learning situation and with teachers who understand how they are different and can support educational needs.

Sounds excellent but haven't we been there and done that? I mean isn't this the way it was back in the dark ages? You really think singling out the slow learners is a good idea?

Why not do it by subject, rather than wholesale? Few kids are so advanced in both math and language arts that they require different learning environments for both. Likewise, few kids are so behind in everything that they need remedial services for everything. There would be both less prestige and less stigma if math/science and language arts had different AAP-> resource tiers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. I’m not sure how you interpreted that. Wow - what a crazy stretch!

I’ve heard from folks in education that have be concern about AAP and the high numbers is that it often seems like White flight. Sad but true is that many immigrants/children of immigrants are unaware of how the education system works.

That's how it looks at my kids' (base) school. If you look at the yearbook, grades K-2 are very diverse. Grades 3+ are very brown. Basically, all of the South Asians, the majority of the East Asians, half of the white kids, and basically none of the brown kids head to the center in 3rd, which greatly changes the demographics of each classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

A simple solution would be to reverse the current approach -- instead of going through all these efforts to select kids for AAP, make AAP the default for FCPS, and create a special program (call it whatever) for those kids who can't keep up or need the extra help. This would also raise the overall standard for elementary education. Even the FCPS AAP is far behind the education standards of other countries, if not other parts of the US.

Yes, make AAP the standard curriculum for all kids. Have a separate program for the kids "who can't keep up or need the extra help," as noted above. And then have a small program for the four or five percent of kids who learn and understand new things so quickly that they really need a different learning environment than the regular classroom. Those kids do better in a really different learning situation and with teachers who understand how they are different and can support educational needs.

Sounds excellent but haven't we been there and done that? I mean isn't this the way it was back in the dark ages? You really think singling out the slow learners is a good idea?

Why not do it by subject, rather than wholesale? Few kids are so advanced in both math and language arts that they require different learning environments for both. Likewise, few kids are so behind in everything that they need remedial services for everything. There would be both less prestige and less stigma if math/science and language arts had different AAP-> resource tiers.

AAP Level III is for that reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Why not do it by subject, rather than wholesale? Few kids are so advanced in both math and language arts that they require different learning environments for both. Likewise, few kids are so behind in everything that they need remedial services for everything. There would be both less prestige and less stigma if math/science and language arts had different AAP-> resource tiers.

AAP Level III is for that reason.

AAP Level III is a one hour pull out once/week. It's not even remotely comparable to full time AAP instruction in an area of strength. A lot of the AAP angst is that kids who rightfully should be in Level III (strong in only one area) are either being placed in Level IV, thus slowing things down for the entire AAP class in their weaker subject, or they are not placed in Level IV, and thus are completely denied AAP instruction in their areas of strength.

[Anonymous]

What slows down the instruction are kids with HFA or undiagnosed HFA or a behavioral/emotional issue. These kids slow it down by having outbursts, tantrums, rude behavior, inappropriate talking. And these are generally the know-it-all kids who think they’re superior. Ugh. Don’t get me started. The only ones slowing it down are the kids that should be medicated but aren’t!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. I’m not sure how you interpreted that. Wow - what a crazy stretch!

I’ve heard from folks in education that have be concern about AAP and the high numbers is that it often seems like White flight. Sad but true is that many immigrants/children of immigrants are unaware of how the education system works.

That's how it looks at my kids' (base) school. If you look at the yearbook, grades K-2 are very diverse. Grades 3+ are very brown. Basically, all of the South Asians, the majority of the East Asians, half of the white kids, and basically none of the brown kids head to the center in 3rd, which greatly changes the demographics of each classroom.

I'm confused.. Are you calling the AAP classes "very brown" because of all the South Asians or are you calling the non-AAP classes "very brown" because most of them are left behind in non-AAP?