Oyster- Adams in US News...thoughts?

[Anonymous]

I'd like to see some of the overcrowded monolingual WoTP schools pair up with schools EoTP with high ELL populations. The western school in each pair could offer single-language education and feed to Hardy or Deal, while the eastern school would be bilingual and feed to MacFarland and Roosevelt. Parents in-bounds for each school would be able to rank their preference, so those who wanted a shorter commute or dual language or a better feeder could prioritize that, but there would not be a guarantee except that you got one of the two schools. OOB kids would be admitted only to the extent that there was space. This would free up more space in the Wilson-feeding schools, give more kids the opportunity for bilingual education, and create more socioeconomic integration.

Some folks will hate this (and will couch it in the need for "neighborhood schools" when they really mean "I spent a million dollars for my house and that entitles me to a school where most of the other kids are rich too") but it's more likely to pass muster with DCPS than any other plan to deal with crowding in Ward 3 schools.

Possible pairs: Lafayette-Brightwood, Murch-West (or do Lafayette-Murch-Brightwood as a 3-school choice set since West doesn't have that many ELL kids), Hearst-Powell, Eaton-Bancroft (and move Bancroft from Deal to MacFarland, which I know people would hate but oh well, this is my idea). I'd also suggest shifting Adams so it feeds Roosevelt along with the other immersion elementaries in the District (which either have a programmatic or geographic feeder to MacFarland and then to Roosevelt).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd like to see some of the overcrowded monolingual WoTP schools pair up with schools EoTP with high ELL populations. The western school in each pair could offer single-language education and feed to Hardy or Deal, while the eastern school would be bilingual and feed to MacFarland and Roosevelt. Parents in-bounds for each school would be able to rank their preference, so those who wanted a shorter commute or dual language or a better feeder could prioritize that, but there would not be a guarantee except that you got one of the two schools. OOB kids would be admitted only to the extent that there was space. This would free up more space in the Wilson-feeding schools, give more kids the opportunity for bilingual education, and create more socioeconomic integration.

Some folks will hate this (and will couch it in the need for "neighborhood schools" when they really mean "I spent a million dollars for my house and that entitles me to a school where most of the other kids are rich too") but it's more likely to pass muster with DCPS than any other plan to deal with crowding in Ward 3 schools.

Possible pairs: Lafayette-Brightwood, Murch-West (or do Lafayette-Murch-Brightwood as a 3-school choice set since West doesn't have that many ELL kids), Hearst-Powell, Eaton-Bancroft (and move Bancroft from Deal to MacFarland, which I know people would hate but oh well, this is my idea). I'd also suggest shifting Adams so it feeds Roosevelt along with the other immersion elementaries in the District (which either have a programmatic or geographic feeder to MacFarland and then to Roosevelt).

Ha ha! No.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can set up all the supposed dual immersion public school programs you want (charter of DCPS) to keep affluent families happy. As the article points out, its attracting enough low-income native speakers to ensure successful immersion that's the trick.

Yeah, the whole "low income Latino" thing in the article made me kinda wonder if the author actually talked to any Latino students/parents at Oyster. Sure there are some low income Latino families, but there are a LOT of professionals, embassy staff, NGO employees.

Exactly! Of course there are low income Latino families at Oyster, but they are definitely in the minority. Most of my children's Latino friends at Oyster have very well educated parents who work at the World Bank, IMF, various embassies, etc. There are also several Latino Oyster parents who held positions in President Obama's administration (including a cabinet level position); and one student is the child of a member of the US Congress.

Well aren't you FANCY!?

This is true of charter schools as well.

The difference is that I have never heard people from my charter brag about this, ever. I would be deeply suspicious of any school where this was discussed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oyster wouldn't be Oyster if it wasn't in Woodley Park. Fact.

Adams rides on the coat tails of Oyster.

You're still getting your information from old gossip about Adams' students left over from the 2007 merger. As someone pointed out up thread, Adams is now retaining over 90% of the SAME Oyster students whose coattails you say they're riding. So I guess they're riding their own coattails, right? Oyster also sends a disproportionate number of its graduates to Walls every year.

Affluent children leave in kinder, first, second...not just in fifth grade, dear.
3rd Grade PARCC scores in ELA and Math (54% and 74%, passing or exceeding)
7th grade PARCC scores: 45% and 40% (8th grade data not available)

What a dip! Maybe it's the lead pipes over at the Adams building.

You and Canizales can spin this however you guys like- please continue to blame gossip and I will just stick with the data.

Adams was only retaining around half of its students (in 4th through 6th grades) before Deal was eliminated as a feeder option. Deal hasn't been an option for only 3 years. Watch those Adams PARCC scores over the next few years as those affluent retained students move up. No spin necessary, dear.

Btw, Oyster's retention in the early grades (K through 3rd is even higher than Adams--mid 90s). You should stick to posting about things you actually know.

Do you need the 5th grade and the 6th grade data, too?
You can stick to your prediction and I will stick with the data, hun.

Your "data" is useless to refute my point. When Deal was eliminated as an option, Oyster's 3rd graders at the time are only entering 5th grade this fall. We don't have their 7th grade test scores, hun.

This is not correct. The kids entering 7th grade now didn't have the opportunity to go to Deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oyster wouldn't be Oyster if it wasn't in Woodley Park. Fact.

Adams rides on the coat tails of Oyster.

You're still getting your information from old gossip about Adams' students left over from the 2007 merger. As someone pointed out up thread, Adams is now retaining over 90% of the SAME Oyster students whose coattails you say they're riding. So I guess they're riding their own coattails, right? Oyster also sends a disproportionate number of its graduates to Walls every year.

Affluent children leave in kinder, first, second...not just in fifth grade, dear.
3rd Grade PARCC scores in ELA and Math (54% and 74%, passing or exceeding)
7th grade PARCC scores: 45% and 40% (8th grade data not available)

What a dip! Maybe it's the lead pipes over at the Adams building.

You and Canizales can spin this however you guys like- please continue to blame gossip and I will just stick with the data.

Adams was only retaining around half of its students (in 4th through 6th grades) before Deal was eliminated as a feeder option. Deal hasn't been an option for only 3 years. Watch those Adams PARCC scores over the next few years as those affluent retained students move up. No spin necessary, dear.

Btw, Oyster's retention in the early grades (K through 3rd is even higher than Adams--mid 90s). You should stick to posting about things you actually know.

Do you need the 5th grade and the 6th grade data, too?
You can stick to your prediction and I will stick with the data, hun.

Your "data" is useless to refute my point. When Deal was eliminated as an option, Oyster's 3rd graders at the time are only entering 5th grade this fall. We don't have their 7th grade test scores, hun.

This is not correct. The kids entering 7th grade now didn't have the opportunity to go to Deal.

Ok, try to keep up. The poster who hates Oyster was trying to make the point that the quality of the student body/test scores take a nose dive after 3rd grade ("Adams is riding on Oyster's coattails.". Her assumption is that 4th grade and up is when those with means peel off for private or move (she assumes this brain drain accelerates in middle school). I made the point that the "high testing" 3rd graders who were shut out of Deal are now only entering 5th grade. So we'll see how this cohort does now that Oyster is retaining >90% of those high performing 3rd graders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can set up all the supposed dual immersion public school programs you want (charter of DCPS) to keep affluent families happy. As the article points out, its attracting enough low-income native speakers to ensure successful immersion that's the trick.

Yeah, the whole "low income Latino" thing in the article made me kinda wonder if the author actually talked to any Latino students/parents at Oyster. Sure there are some low income Latino families, but there are a LOT of professionals, embassy staff, NGO employees.

Exactly! Of course there are low income Latino families at Oyster, but they are definitely in the minority. Most of my children's Latino friends at Oyster have very well educated parents who work at the World Bank, IMF, various embassies, etc. There are also several Latino Oyster parents who held positions in President Obama's administration (including a cabinet level position); and one student is the child of a member of the US Congress.

Well aren't you FANCY!?

This is true of charter schools as well.

The difference is that I have never heard people from my charter brag about this, ever. I would be deeply suspicious of any school where this was discussed.

No one is bragging; nor were any names mentioned. These are just facts. Why are you so bothered?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. We are happy at Oyster- having left a charter immersion school. The difference for DC/family has been in how the administration collaborates with families, pulling in resources as needed. (Reading specialists, counselor, psychologist on staff.) A common thread amongst families like ours is that that dialogue was missing/not as prevalent at LAMB and MV.

Yes, we live in a smaller space, but because we want to attend. Friends cut across those inbounds- and those who lotteries in (often Spanish speakers or with older siblings.)

This is untrue in reference to LAMB. Let's stick to facts and not lies.

In your experience that might be the case. We are friends with former LAMB families who were not fans of the administration there, but have found Berrocal and Canizales to be a great team.

The MV administration's deficiencies are well known- and documented by both current and former families.

At the end of the day, each family is trying to do the best for their kids, period. What works for you may/may not work for us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oyster wouldn't be Oyster if it wasn't in Woodley Park. Fact.

Adams rides on the coat tails of Oyster.

You're still getting your information from old gossip about Adams' students left over from the 2007 merger. As someone pointed out up thread, Adams is now retaining over 90% of the SAME Oyster students whose coattails you say they're riding. So I guess they're riding their own coattails, right? Oyster also sends a disproportionate number of its graduates to Walls every year.

Affluent children leave in kinder, first, second...not just in fifth grade, dear.
3rd Grade PARCC scores in ELA and Math (54% and 74%, passing or exceeding)
7th grade PARCC scores: 45% and 40% (8th grade data not available)

What a dip! Maybe it's the lead pipes over at the Adams building.

You and Canizales can spin this however you guys like- please continue to blame gossip and I will just stick with the data.

Adams was only retaining around half of its students (in 4th through 6th grades) before Deal was eliminated as a feeder option. Deal hasn't been an option for only 3 years. Watch those Adams PARCC scores over the next few years as those affluent retained students move up. No spin necessary, dear.

Btw, Oyster's retention in the early grades (K through 3rd is even higher than Adams--mid 90s). You should stick to posting about things you actually know.

Do you need the 5th grade and the 6th grade data, too?
You can stick to your prediction and I will stick with the data, hun.

Your "data" is useless to refute my point. When Deal was eliminated as an option, Oyster's 3rd graders at the time are only entering 5th grade this fall. We don't have their 7th grade test scores, hun.

This is not correct. The kids entering 7th grade now didn't have the opportunity to go to Deal.

Ok, try to keep up. The poster who hates Oyster was trying to make the point that the quality of the student body/test scores take a nose dive after 3rd grade ("Adams is riding on Oyster's coattails.". Her assumption is that 4th grade and up is when those with means peel off for private or move (she assumes this brain drain accelerates in middle school). I made the point that the "high testing" 3rd graders who were shut out of Deal are now only entering 5th grade. So we'll see how this cohort does now that Oyster is retaining >90% of those high performing 3rd graders.

I still don't get it. I suppose you are an affluent power mommy with the smartest child in what might be considered the greatest Oyster class that ever was? Classes before and classes after don't count because we are tracking this one hybrid class of geniuses?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oyster wouldn't be Oyster if it wasn't in Woodley Park. Fact.

Adams rides on the coat tails of Oyster.

You're still getting your information from old gossip about Adams' students left over from the 2007 merger. As someone pointed out up thread, Adams is now retaining over 90% of the SAME Oyster students whose coattails you say they're riding. So I guess they're riding their own coattails, right? Oyster also sends a disproportionate number of its graduates to Walls every year.

Affluent children leave in kinder, first, second...not just in fifth grade, dear.
3rd Grade PARCC scores in ELA and Math (54% and 74%, passing or exceeding)
7th grade PARCC scores: 45% and 40% (8th grade data not available)

What a dip! Maybe it's the lead pipes over at the Adams building.

You and Canizales can spin this however you guys like- please continue to blame gossip and I will just stick with the data.

Adams was only retaining around half of its students (in 4th through 6th grades) before Deal was eliminated as a feeder option. Deal hasn't been an option for only 3 years. Watch those Adams PARCC scores over the next few years as those affluent retained students move up. No spin necessary, dear.

Btw, Oyster's retention in the early grades (K through 3rd is even higher than Adams--mid 90s). You should stick to posting about things you actually know.

Do you need the 5th grade and the 6th grade data, too?
You can stick to your prediction and I will stick with the data, hun.

Your "data" is useless to refute my point. When Deal was eliminated as an option, Oyster's 3rd graders at the time are only entering 5th grade this fall. We don't have their 7th grade test scores, hun.

This is not correct. The kids entering 7th grade now didn't have the opportunity to go to Deal.

Ok, try to keep up. The poster who hates Oyster was trying to make the point that the quality of the student body/test scores take a nose dive after 3rd grade ("Adams is riding on Oyster's coattails.". Her assumption is that 4th grade and up is when those with means peel off for private or move (she assumes this brain drain accelerates in middle school). I made the point that the "high testing" 3rd graders who were shut out of Deal are now only entering 5th grade. So we'll see how this cohort does now that Oyster is retaining >90% of those high performing 3rd graders.

I still don't get it. I suppose you are an affluent power mommy with the smartest child in what might be considered the greatest Oyster class that ever was? Classes before and classes after don't count because we are tracking this one hybrid class of geniuses?

Yeah, you don't get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. We are happy at Oyster- having left a charter immersion school. The difference for DC/family has been in how the administration collaborates with families, pulling in resources as needed. (Reading specialists, counselor, psychologist on staff.) A common thread amongst families like ours is that that dialogue was missing/not as prevalent at LAMB and MV.

Yes, we live in a smaller space, but because we want to attend. Friends cut across those inbounds- and those who lotteries in (often Spanish speakers or with older siblings.)

This is untrue in reference to LAMB. Let's stick to facts and not lies.

In your experience that might be the case. We are friends with former LAMB families who were not fans of the administration there, but have found Berrocal and Canizales to be a great team.

The MV administration's deficiencies are well known- and documented by both current and former families.

At the end of the day, each family is trying to do the best for their kids, period. What works for you may/may not work for us.

You feel free to post anecdotes you heard second hand about other schools but completely flip out when multiple posters have recounted first hand experience with teachers/librarians screaming at children?

Here is my first hand experience- I went to the oyster book fair and heard the librarian scream at a young preschool/kindergarten aged class, bullying one child in particular horribly because they didn't sit down immediately. It was disgraceful. Thankfully I moved out of bounds as I would NEVER be okay with that level of abuse. It was absolutely verbal abuse.

You have been posting this same screed for about 5 years. And you never lived IB--you wish.

Let me correct you- PEOPLE have been posting about the abusive treatment of students for 5 years at Oyster. My story is just one of the many. I would not send a child here unless I had no other choice.

I'm one of the previous posters on this thread- and dismayed by the lies you seem to spread about Oyster.

Each family and child's experience is unique- and represents one perspective. We did leave another school due to the bullying/behavior issues prevalent- and that school's lack of skill in managing the situation. (Well documented by others on multiple threads.) Oyster is not a panacea- but we are very happy to be part of a nurturing, creative environment where DC is thriving. Academically performing beyond the grade level targets in both languages, and learning how to be a friend and community member via all of the programs offered.

We have yet to see mistreatment of students in any of our classes.

Then you are lucky, so far. Best of luck. Some of us don't want to chance it when it comes to our children.

[Anonymous]

I always thought Oyster lacked good system wide positive discipline and character Ed. But the individual teachers were lovely and doing their best. The opposite of bullies. That's risible. The scary ones were some of the completely demandy parents!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:http://hechingerreport.org/rising-popularity-dual-language-education-leave-latinos-behind/

"Dual language....so sexy"

This may be a relevant issue in other cities but this article is misleading in the context of DC, where all dual language neighborhood schools, following Oyser's lead, have separate Spanish and English lotteries to ensure that Latinos have priority over English speakers until the Spanish speakers make up 50 percent.

The only reason that Cleveland and Houston for example have very low Latino populations is that they are in historically black neighborhoods where Latinos have never lived in large numbers. Cleveland (Le Droit, Shaw) has gentrified significantly so lots more whites but still very few Latinos, and I'd argue that it's not well-served by transit from the neighborhoods where DC's Latinos mostly live. Houston certainly isn't.

One important point not mentioned by the author is that lots of bilingual charters have sprung up to meet demand BUT they cannot run language lotteries like the neighborhood schools, and they cannot always find leases in Latino neighborhoods.

One valid point in the article regarding DC is that the conversion to dual language of neighborhood schools hasn't kept pace with the movement of Latinos in the District. Latinos have been moving east and north away from Columbia Heights as it gentrifies, but they don't find dual language schools everywhere they go. The district struggles to open such schools for the reasons given (bilingual teacher shortage). It's even worse in eastern MoCo where there is a growing Latino population but few dual language schools as far as I know.

But this can also be seen as a result of the large scale of recent immigration, not all of it legal. And IMO given that immigration is a Federal issue, it's unfair to blame school districts for their slowness to respond to the rapid growth in school-aged English Language Learners. The feds could provide additional funds to districts to educate these children, like a kind of Title I+ for ELLSs. Also allow more Spanish speaking teachers to come in on skilled visas if necessary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://hechingerreport.org/rising-popularity-dual-language-education-leave-latinos-behind/

"Dual language....so sexy"

This may be a relevant issue in other cities but this article is misleading in the context of DC, where all dual language neighborhood schools, following Oyser's lead, have separate Spanish and English lotteries to ensure that Latinos have priority over English speakers until the Spanish speakers make up 50 percent.

The only reason that Cleveland and Houston for example have very low Latino populations is that they are in historically black neighborhoods where Latinos have never lived in large numbers. Cleveland (Le Droit, Shaw) has gentrified significantly so lots more whites but still very few Latinos, and I'd argue that it's not well-served by transit from the neighborhoods where DC's Latinos mostly live. Houston certainly isn't.

One important point not mentioned by the author is that lots of bilingual charters have sprung up to meet demand BUT they cannot run language lotteries like the neighborhood schools, and they cannot always find leases in Latino neighborhoods.

One valid point in the article regarding DC is that the conversion to dual language of neighborhood schools hasn't kept pace with the movement of Latinos in the District. Latinos have been moving east and north away from Columbia Heights as it gentrifies, but they don't find dual language schools everywhere they go. The district struggles to open such schools for the reasons given (bilingual teacher shortage). It's even worse in eastern MoCo where there is a growing Latino population but few dual language schools as far as I know.

But this can also be seen as a result of the large scale of recent immigration, not all of it legal. And IMO given that immigration is a Federal issue, it's unfair to blame school districts for their slowness to respond to the rapid growth in school-aged English Language Learners. The feds could provide additional funds to districts to educate these children, like a kind of Title I+ for ELLSs. Also allow more Spanish speaking teachers to come in on skilled visas if necessary.

I dont' think the federal government is going to be increasing funds for education at all, and what is there is being redirected at 'choice' initiatives.

This NPR story from Feb 2017 has good data on ELL students nationwide. http://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2017/02/23/512451228/5-million-english-language-learners-a-vast-pool-of-talent-at-risk

[Anonymous]

The feds could, and certainly should, also amend federal charter law to allow charter lotteries for native speakers (with highest preference for low-income native speakers) in the interests of supporting the mission of the schools. Some states have passed charter laws allowing immersion charters to effectively support language dominant admissions/lotteries, without interference from the feds or the courts to date. So far, we're not serious enough about promoting immersion language study as a society for the feds to bother to take this common sense step. DC's myopic charter law isn't helping in this regard.

[Anonymous]

NP here. Not an Oyster family...,, but considering moving in district.

I have been to the Oyster book fair three times in three years during the late morning or early afternoon. Two of those three times, I saw the librarian with a group of kids and she spoke really harshly to a kid in each occasion., it could be called yelling. The second time, she made the kid (kindergartener.) cry, which was sad. She did then apologize and try to fix it with the kid - I think she realized it was over the top. Which it totally was.

I don't think this is verbal abuse unless you say sonething damaging to the child about themselves, rather than just a harsh correction. That said, she has a harsh tone and should be more careful when she gets frustrated.

But I would still potentially send my kid to Oyster for all of its other great qualities.