Is there a MoCo equivalent to Duke Ellington School for the Arts?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't think it's to the level you're describing/hoping for but from what I gathered, Northwood HS was the Arts option for the Downcounty Consortium (DCC):

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/school-info/downcounty/northwood/

The Academy of Music, Theater and Dance (AMTAD)

This academy is geared toward students interested in pursuing college and professional careers in the areas of theater, dance, vocal music, and instrumental music. In either solo or group performances, students will produce, act, and perform in a variety of onstage productions. Coursework within the academy is designed to develop the student through the dance and performing arts pathways with focus on technical production, vocal and instrumental music, dance, and dramatics. Students in all academy strands will be integrally involved in all aspects of production, giving students a solid foundation for advanced preparation within the field. The Dance Pathway gives students a strong background in multiple dance styles such as Jazz, Modern, and Ballet. This pathway also provides opportunities for master classes, field trips and choreographic development. The Performing Arts Pathway gives students a strong background in multiple disciplines. Students in this pathway have the opportunity to take a variety of classes in the performing arts field, such as band, chorus, dance and theatre. Students also have the opportunity to focus solely on one discipline.

Einstein’s Visual and Performing Arts Academy (VAPA) is arguably the closest thing to Duke Ellington that MCPS has. It is one of the largest and most prominent programs at the school, and the audition process will become increasingly competitive for next year. Applicants are now required to complete both an in-person audition and a video submission.

Currently, Northwood hosts the regional Theater and Dance programs, though it wouldn't be surprising to see those put in Einstein before 2027.

VAPA is terrific, but it's not an audition-based program. Any Einstein student can check a box on a form and join VAPA, just like the other academies.

And they don’t actually offer all of the courses listed in the various VAPA pathways. We’ve been waiting years for AP Music Theory!

Richard Montgomery has this AP class. Could an Einstein student join virtually??

No, there is no way to do it virtually. Einstein has very limited ap classes. You’d have to go to MC. The principal refuses to make the arts a priority and staff it so these classes can be at the school.

Your student absolutely should be able to take AP Music Theory through the MCPS online AP program:
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/onlinelearning/courses/ap/

The principal shouldn't be blocking it. Contact Brian Beaubien if experiencing pushback from the principal: 240-740-4042 [e-mail]

With the regional model, Einstein is going to decline greatly. It's too bad as it's one of the kinder schools. Few are going to leave their home school as the academics are lacking, as are the arts classes except for the VAC, and with the reduction in students, it means fewer staff, so fewer courses will be offered. If we cannot get our youngest into another school, we will leave MCPS, as we aren't happy with Einstein's academics. Parents have demanded things like AP Music Theory, AP science classes, and more engineering and computer science for several years, and have always been told no or not enough staffing. They have some smart, good teachers who could easily teach AP classes. They are losing a bunch of good teachers this year to other schools. It will be interesting to see what happens as many of the kids leave for Wheaton or Blair.

The theater teacher is fantastic, so it will continue to be a huge draw. She is very inclusive, and I was impressed when she picked a large play to have lots of students being able to participate.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:With Northwood getting the "Dance" pathway for 2027-28 and beyond, will this degrade/move teachers away from the dance program at Einstein? I know MCPS keeps saying every school can keep their existing "local" programs, but I'm confused as to what that means. I can't imagine there are a ton of high level dance teachers to go around.

No, there is no additional funding attached to these programs—it's really just the designation itself. Einstein is actually adding a lot of improvements to their dance program. The issue is that Einstein has a stronger arts program than Northwood, and many students want access to those opportunities even if Einstein is not their home school.

Since the regional programs have not been finalized yet, we'll have to wait and see which schools receive which programs.

Both are very good with arts. It will depend each year on the students there.

It’s less about the students and more about the training and opportunities that each schools offers. Einstein should have the full arts regional program so students can take advantage of the opportunities.

No, it's about the students. Einstein doesn't have the full arts now as the principal doesn't support it. They'd need to allocate a few more teachers for it to be a full arts regional and given the lack of academics its not going to draw students from other schools who are into stem and other specialties. A bunch of students drop out senior year to go to MC due to the lack of offerings.

Many of the students are good, but if you compare them to other schools, they are average. The higher-level arts students are all doing outside programs and private lessons. The talented theater student last year was in YAA, taking private lessons and more. You don't get that good at an MCPS school alone.

What are you talking about? VAPA helped my child get scholarships to participate in YAA. I understand you’re upset with Mr. Brown but VAPA has been nothing but a positive experience for me and my child.

[Anonymous]

Adventure theatre, musical theatre center has a pre professional musical theatre program. I know a dancer in it that transferred to BCC because she could leave school early to attend dance programs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With Northwood getting the "Dance" pathway for 2027-28 and beyond, will this degrade/move teachers away from the dance program at Einstein? I know MCPS keeps saying every school can keep their existing "local" programs, but I'm confused as to what that means. I can't imagine there are a ton of high level dance teachers to go around.

No, there is no additional funding attached to these programs—it's really just the designation itself. Einstein is actually adding a lot of improvements to their dance program. The issue is that Einstein has a stronger arts program than Northwood, and many students want access to those opportunities even if Einstein is not their home school.

Since the regional programs have not been finalized yet, we'll have to wait and see which schools receive which programs.

Both are very good with arts. It will depend each year on the students there.

It’s less about the students and more about the training and opportunities that each schools offers. Einstein should have the full arts regional program so students can take advantage of the opportunities.

No, it's about the students. Einstein doesn't have the full arts now as the principal doesn't support it. They'd need to allocate a few more teachers for it to be a full arts regional and given the lack of academics its not going to draw students from other schools who are into stem and other specialties. A bunch of students drop out senior year to go to MC due to the lack of offerings.

Many of the students are good, but if you compare them to other schools, they are average. The higher-level arts students are all doing outside programs and private lessons. The talented theater student last year was in YAA, taking private lessons and more. You don't get that good at an MCPS school alone.

What are you talking about? VAPA helped my child get scholarships to participate in YAA. I understand you’re upset with Mr. Brown but VAPA has been nothing but a positive experience for me and my child.

You do realize everyone's experience is different. Your child could have easily gotten to YAA without VAPA and gotten scholarships. But, its much harder when you start in high school vs. starting in elementary school or middle school. Glad your child is in YAA as it's a great program. We aren't that impressed with VAPA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Adventure theatre, musical theatre center has a pre professional musical theatre program. I know a dancer in it that transferred to BCC because she could leave school early to attend dance programs

It's very school-specific on what they will allow. Usually, you have to go to the central office and fight for it. I don't get why they don't let kids out for last period as long as they can meet all their graduation requirements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With Northwood getting the "Dance" pathway for 2027-28 and beyond, will this degrade/move teachers away from the dance program at Einstein? I know MCPS keeps saying every school can keep their existing "local" programs, but I'm confused as to what that means. I can't imagine there are a ton of high level dance teachers to go around.

No, there is no additional funding attached to these programs—it's really just the designation itself. Einstein is actually adding a lot of improvements to their dance program. The issue is that Einstein has a stronger arts program than Northwood, and many students want access to those opportunities even if Einstein is not their home school.

Since the regional programs have not been finalized yet, we'll have to wait and see which schools receive which programs.

Both are very good with arts. It will depend each year on the students there.

It’s less about the students and more about the training and opportunities that each schools offers. Einstein should have the full arts regional program so students can take advantage of the opportunities.

No, it's about the students. Einstein doesn't have the full arts now as the principal doesn't support it. They'd need to allocate a few more teachers for it to be a full arts regional and given the lack of academics its not going to draw students from other schools who are into stem and other specialties. A bunch of students drop out senior year to go to MC due to the lack of offerings.

Many of the students are good, but if you compare them to other schools, they are average. The higher-level arts students are all doing outside programs and private lessons. The talented theater student last year was in YAA, taking private lessons and more. You don't get that good at an MCPS school alone.

What are you talking about? VAPA helped my child get scholarships to participate in YAA. I understand you’re upset with Mr. Brown but VAPA has been nothing but a positive experience for me and my child.

You do realize everyone's experience is different. Your child could have easily gotten to YAA without VAPA and gotten scholarships. But, it’s much harder when you start in high school vs. starting in elementary school or middle school. Glad your child is in YAA as it's a great program. We aren't that impressed with VAPA.

Plenty of parents are happy with the academy. If you're unhappy with it, I'd genuinely ask: what are you doing to help strengthen the program? Repeating the same complaints across multiple threads about Einstein's academics or how it compares to Duke Ellington isn't helping the students who are thriving there or the people working to improve it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With Northwood getting the "Dance" pathway for 2027-28 and beyond, will this degrade/move teachers away from the dance program at Einstein? I know MCPS keeps saying every school can keep their existing "local" programs, but I'm confused as to what that means. I can't imagine there are a ton of high level dance teachers to go around.

No, there is no additional funding attached to these programs—it's really just the designation itself. Einstein is actually adding a lot of improvements to their dance program. The issue is that Einstein has a stronger arts program than Northwood, and many students want access to those opportunities even if Einstein is not their home school.

Since the regional programs have not been finalized yet, we'll have to wait and see which schools receive which programs.

Both are very good with arts. It will depend each year on the students there.

It’s less about the students and more about the training and opportunities that each schools offers. Einstein should have the full arts regional program so students can take advantage of the opportunities.

No, it's about the students. Einstein doesn't have the full arts now as the principal doesn't support it. They'd need to allocate a few more teachers for it to be a full arts regional and given the lack of academics its not going to draw students from other schools who are into stem and other specialties. A bunch of students drop out senior year to go to MC due to the lack of offerings.

Many of the students are good, but if you compare them to other schools, they are average. The higher-level arts students are all doing outside programs and private lessons. The talented theater student last year was in YAA, taking private lessons and more. You don't get that good at an MCPS school alone.

What are you talking about? VAPA helped my child get scholarships to participate in YAA. I understand you’re upset with Mr. Brown but VAPA has been nothing but a positive experience for me and my child.

You do realize everyone's experience is different. Your child could have easily gotten to YAA without VAPA and gotten scholarships. But, it’s much harder when you start in high school vs. starting in elementary school or middle school. Glad your child is in YAA as it's a great program. We aren't that impressed with VAPA.

Plenty of parents are happy with the academy. If you're unhappy with it, I'd genuinely ask: what are you doing to help strengthen the program? Repeating the same complaints across multiple threads about Einstein's academics or how it compares to Duke Ellington isn't helping the students who are thriving there or the people working to improve it.

The discussion was about what schools are equal. Many of us have spoken up, gone to the central office, BOE, and more, and nothing changes. The academics are weak in terms of the class offerings, and it makes no sense when there are teachers there who can teach the AP and other classes offered. Einstein is a great fit for many kids but if a family is looking for Duke Ellington-style arts, that's not in MCPS or Einstein.

Kids like yours and mine supplement with outside programs and private lessons, and then bring that to Einstein or whatever school they are in, but if you look at some of the other programs at other schools, Einstein has the potential and could be elevated if the admin would allow it. Many of us would happily jump in to support it and help in any way we can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With Northwood getting the "Dance" pathway for 2027-28 and beyond, will this degrade/move teachers away from the dance program at Einstein? I know MCPS keeps saying every school can keep their existing "local" programs, but I'm confused as to what that means. I can't imagine there are a ton of high level dance teachers to go around.

No, there is no additional funding attached to these programs—it's really just the designation itself. Einstein is actually adding a lot of improvements to their dance program. The issue is that Einstein has a stronger arts program than Northwood, and many students want access to those opportunities even if Einstein is not their home school.

Since the regional programs have not been finalized yet, we'll have to wait and see which schools receive which programs.

The regional programs absolutely are established and have been formally announced. MCPS is holding information sessions on them this month, which have already started. https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/curriculum/regional-programs-and-themes/

Program locations are subject to change based on factors such as school enrollment, facilities, etc.

That's "if we decide we want to make tweaks later, you're not allowed to complain because there's a disclaimer at the bottom" language. It doesn't mean that things are still TBD. They're definitely not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:New to MoCo, parent of a pre-pro dancer, and I'm wondering if there was ever a push to have an arts magnet school in MoCo equivalent to Duke Ellington in DC, LACHSA and OCSA in CA, etc?

Sorry, but no. Nothing we have comes close and BTW, it's all going downhill fast. No joke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:No, but your kid can apply to Duke Ellington and could be accepted as an out of District resident. You’d have to pay tuition though, or move to DC.

Nothing MCPS has compares with that. But I also know from parents at Duke Ellington that the academics aren’t great, so you’d be giving up quite a bit to have your kid attend it.

I know students this year going from Duke to Yale, Hopkins and Smith.

Not saying this is across the board - but I think it might be improving

That is definitely not the norm. People in DC whose kids are serious about academics generally avoid Duke Ellington even when they are very talented.

They are probably going for arts, not academics. Most of the talented kids do outside Mcps. YAA, MCYO, PVYO, etc.

Agree. Those who are serious about academics go with a stronger school and do arts outside of school. Duke Ellington is good for those who are serious about arts but not academics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, but your kid can apply to Duke Ellington and could be accepted as an out of District resident. You’d have to pay tuition though, or move to DC.

Nothing MCPS has compares with that. But I also know from parents at Duke Ellington that the academics aren’t great, so you’d be giving up quite a bit to have your kid attend it.

I know students this year going from Duke to Yale, Hopkins and Smith.

Not saying this is across the board - but I think it might be improving

That is definitely not the norm. People in DC whose kids are serious about academics generally avoid Duke Ellington even when they are very talented.

They are probably going for arts, not academics. Most of the talented kids do outside Mcps. YAA, MCYO, PVYO, etc.

Agree. Those who are serious about academics go with a stronger school and do arts outside of school. Duke Ellington is good for those who are serious about arts but not academics.

They go to the schools assigned or what they can get into. In MCPS, it's up to the principal on what they offer and value.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, but your kid can apply to Duke Ellington and could be accepted as an out of District resident. You’d have to pay tuition though, or move to DC.

Nothing MCPS has compares with that. But I also know from parents at Duke Ellington that the academics aren’t great, so you’d be giving up quite a bit to have your kid attend it.

I know students this year going from Duke to Yale, Hopkins and Smith.

Not saying this is across the board - but I think it might be improving

That is definitely not the norm. People in DC whose kids are serious about academics generally avoid Duke Ellington even when they are very talented.

They are probably going for arts, not academics. Most of the talented kids do outside Mcps. YAA, MCYO, PVYO, etc.

Agree. Those who are serious about academics go with a stronger school and do arts outside of school. Duke Ellington is good for those who are serious about arts but not academics.

Yeah, that's not true at all. MOST art students are actually very passionate about their art AND academics as well. MOST students want a school that excels in both. They shouldn't have to choose and they aren't doing that at Duke Ellington, but please pretend you know more about this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, but your kid can apply to Duke Ellington and could be accepted as an out of District resident. You’d have to pay tuition though, or move to DC.

Nothing MCPS has compares with that. But I also know from parents at Duke Ellington that the academics aren’t great, so you’d be giving up quite a bit to have your kid attend it.

I know students this year going from Duke to Yale, Hopkins and Smith.

Not saying this is across the board - but I think it might be improving

That is definitely not the norm. People in DC whose kids are serious about academics generally avoid Duke Ellington even when they are very talented.

They are probably going for arts, not academics. Most of the talented kids do outside Mcps. YAA, MCYO, PVYO, etc.

Agree. Those who are serious about academics go with a stronger school and do arts outside of school. Duke Ellington is good for those who are serious about arts but not academics.

Yeah, that's not true at all. MOST art students are actually very passionate about their art AND academics as well. MOST students want a school that excels in both. They shouldn't have to choose and they aren't doing that at Duke Ellington, but please pretend you know more about this.

Duke Ellington is rigorous. PP knows nothing, for sure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, but your kid can apply to Duke Ellington and could be accepted as an out of District resident. You’d have to pay tuition though, or move to DC.

Nothing MCPS has compares with that. But I also know from parents at Duke Ellington that the academics aren’t great, so you’d be giving up quite a bit to have your kid attend it.

I know students this year going from Duke to Yale, Hopkins and Smith.

Not saying this is across the board - but I think it might be improving

That is definitely not the norm. People in DC whose kids are serious about academics generally avoid Duke Ellington even when they are very talented.

They are probably going for arts, not academics. Most of the talented kids do outside Mcps. YAA, MCYO, PVYO, etc.

Agree. Those who are serious about academics go with a stronger school and do arts outside of school. Duke Ellington is good for those who are serious about arts but not academics.

Yeah, that's not true at all. MOST art students are actually very passionate about their art AND academics as well. MOST students want a school that excels in both. They shouldn't have to choose and they aren't doing that at Duke Ellington, but please pretend you know more about this.

Duke Ellington is rigorous. PP knows nothing, for sure.

If you look at their course offerings it’s not as rigorous as many would like and that may be what they are referring to. But, it’s a test in audition and that test is very rigorous. Kids aren’t generally there for academics. In some of the other private top groups many if the kids go on for stem and string majors and minor in the arts or drop it in college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:New to MoCo, parent of a pre-pro dancer, and I'm wondering if there was ever a push to have an arts magnet school in MoCo equivalent to Duke Ellington in DC, LACHSA and OCSA in CA, etc?

Sorry, but no. Nothing we have comes close and BTW, it's all going downhill fast. No joke.

Yes, there was a push to have Woodward be an arts magnet (full county). Like Blair, it would have only been a segment of the student population. Not whole school like Duke Ellington. I believe that move even spent some time researching this and how it would work - to do this right.

Instead, we will have the watered down regional program and tbd how good it will be.