Is there an official T10 list?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The most widely believed prestigious colleges are the Ivy plus. The Ivy plus (so referred to by the Ivy themselves) are:

The entirety of the Ivy League, Stanford, MIT, UChicago, Johns Hopkins, Duke (and depending on the field Caltech).

Ivy colleges refer to this themselves.

All other colleges trying to pretend to be part of this group are hopecasting.

+1

Refer to this: https://ivpluslibraries.org/

The Ivies know who their peers are.

This joke has been repeated so many times. It is a library consortium. That is it. The site itself says it is a voluntary union of 13 academic libraries. It does not claim to define every school that can be called ivy+. NU not being on that library list only means NU is not in that particular library consortium. It does not mean NU is outside the ivy+.

Ha! NU mom took the bait. Love it!

You’re so insecure, aren’t you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

Any school that has any form of ED is NOT a T5 school.
Any school that has ED2 practice is NOT a T10 school.

OP, remember these rules, then you won't be fooled by all those non-sensical rankings.

I agree with this analysis.

T5: HYPMS
T10: Duke, Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, Columbia
T15: CalTech, Chicago, Cornell, Northwestern, JHU

Swap Dartmouth and Brown with Chicago and NU. Those two are much stronger than those lower tier Ivies.

Nah- not until Chicago requires test scores and get rid of at least 3 of the 4 rounds of ED.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

That would not the recipe for T10 or even T15-T20 or T4 SLACs
The recipe, for unhooked, to be in serious contention is to first have the academic tablestakes: all As and in the top 5-15% of the high school depending on if it is an above average public or a good private, SAT 740+ on each section, ideally 770+ on math if any stem interest exists, top rigor in all core areas of subjects(math science history english foreign language) which may already be off the table for a sophomore not on a path to do it. If AP's are a part of top rigor at the school they need to have taken the hardest ones and gotten mostly 5s. The AP score distribution has been changed such that 5s are often 15-20% of scores and 4s make up another large chunk. Getting almost all 5 is expected since 2024 when the shift happened.

In addition to that, LOR's that indicate intellectual vitality and that they are one of the top students that year.

In addition to that, deep longstanding interest conveyed by at least one EC that started before high school, plus at least one EC that shows impact in the wider community, and 1 that confirms the intellectual curiosity outside the classroom. That is a minimum, but would be viewed much better than 1-2 year commitments to 10 different ECs and without much depth or impact.

Understand that there is virtually no difference in the top 30-40 universities on the USNWR list when it comes to education.

Understand that there is virtually no difference in the top 10-20 colleges on the USNWR list when it comes to education.

Understand that the top SLACs will provide superior undergraduate education outside of CS and engineering than any of the other schools. This will come with the tradeoff of attending a quite small and often isolated college.

Understand that many on DCUM can't handle the truth and are driven to somehow arbitrarily stack rank schools when one cannot realistically do so. Pointing out that these attempts at ranking cannot be taken seriously or that SLACs provide a superior education will cause them pain. That pain is good pain because it helps them grow. Embrace the pain.

Hi, OP here, acronym check:
Is CS = Computer Science? And what does SLACs stand for? HYPMS = Harvard Yale Princeton MIT Stanford I assume?

Yes.
CS = computer science
SLAC = small and/or selective liberal arts college. On DCUM this category does not include the military academies, although for US News it does.

[Anonymous]

You can see who various institutions view as their peers.

https://nces.ed.gov/IPEDS/DFR/2023/ReportPDF.aspx?unitid=166027

It gives an interesting framework.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

Any school that has any form of ED is NOT a T5 school.
Any school that has ED2 practice is NOT a T10 school.

OP, remember these rules, then you won't be fooled by all those non-sensical rankings.

I agree with this analysis.

T5: HYPMS
T10: Duke, Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, Columbia
T15: CalTech, Chicago, Cornell, Northwestern, JHU

Swap Dartmouth and Brown with Chicago and NU. Those two are much stronger than those lower tier Ivies.

Nah- not until Chicago requires test scores and get rid of at least 3 of the 4 rounds of ED.

NU is TO and not T10 in any capacity

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You can see who various institutions view as their peers.

https://nces.ed.gov/IPEDS/DFR/2023/ReportPDF.aspx?unitid=166027

It gives an interesting framework.

Notice how the schools included are the Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Chicago, Duke, and JHU?

That’s gonna upset a few sour folks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can see who various institutions view as their peers.

https://nces.ed.gov/IPEDS/DFR/2023/ReportPDF.aspx?unitid=166027

It gives an interesting framework.

Notice how the schools included are the Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Chicago, Duke, and JHU?

That’s gonna upset a few sour folks.

It's not a perfect system. I think the poster who said there are really 20 top 10 schools depending on what you want to study is probably the best way to view it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

Depends on people.

DCUM posters: US News.

High school kids committing to colleges: Eight ivies, MIT, Stanford.

Cornell and Dartmouth sneak. They are not T10

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

That would not the recipe for T10 or even T15-T20 or T4 SLACs
The recipe, for unhooked, to be in serious contention is to first have the academic tablestakes: all As and in the top 5-15% of the high school depending on if it is an above average public or a good private, SAT 740+ on each section, ideally 770+ on math if any stem interest exists, top rigor in all core areas of subjects(math science history english foreign language) which may already be off the table for a sophomore not on a path to do it. If AP's are a part of top rigor at the school they need to have taken the hardest ones and gotten mostly 5s. The AP score distribution has been changed such that 5s are often 15-20% of scores and 4s make up another large chunk. Getting almost all 5 is expected since 2024 when the shift happened.

In addition to that, LOR's that indicate intellectual vitality and that they are one of the top students that year.

In addition to that, deep longstanding interest conveyed by at least one EC that started before high school, plus at least one EC that shows impact in the wider community, and 1 that confirms the intellectual curiosity outside the classroom. That is a minimum, but would be viewed much better than 1-2 year commitments to 10 different ECs and without much depth or impact.

Understand that there is virtually no difference in the top 30-40 universities on the USNWR list when it comes to education.

Understand that there is virtually no difference in the top 10-20 colleges on the USNWR list when it comes to education.

Understand that the top SLACs will provide superior undergraduate education outside of CS and engineering than any of the other schools. This will come with the tradeoff of attending a quite small and often isolated college.

Understand that many on DCUM can't handle the truth and are driven to somehow arbitrarily stack rank schools when one cannot realistically do so. Pointing out that these attempts at ranking cannot be taken seriously or that SLACs provide a superior education will cause them pain. That pain is good pain because it helps them grow. Embrace the pain.

Hi, OP here, acronym check:
Is CS = Computer Science? And what does SLACs stand for? HYPMS = Harvard Yale Princeton MIT Stanford I assume?

Yes.
CS = computer science
SLAC = small and/or selective liberal arts college. On DCUM this category does not include the military academies, although for US News it does.

OP here, thank you!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

Any school that has any form of ED is NOT a T5 school.
Any school that has ED2 practice is NOT a T10 school.

OP, remember these rules, then you won't be fooled by all those non-sensical rankings.

I agree with this analysis.

T5: HYPMS
T10: Duke, Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, Columbia
T15: CalTech, Chicago, Cornell, Northwestern, JHU

Swap Dartmouth and Brown with Chicago and NU. Those two are much stronger than those lower tier Ivies.

100%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can see who various institutions view as their peers.

https://nces.ed.gov/IPEDS/DFR/2023/ReportPDF.aspx?unitid=166027

It gives an interesting framework.

Notice how the schools included are the Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Chicago, Duke, and JHU?

That’s gonna upset a few sour folks.

It's not a perfect system. I think the poster who said there are really 20 top 10 schools depending on what you want to study is probably the best way to view it.

This is OP, and the bolded made a lot of sense to me too. And I figured whatever the range of schools we look at is, there will be some that are not even close to T10 or maybe even T20 that would still be a great match for DC. So the idea that there are 20 schools truly in the top 10 seems like a realistic way to view it all. A lot depends on what your non-negotiables and dream characteristics are I'd imagine.

[Anonymous]

Conclusion: depending on who you ask, 15-20 schools are considered “T10.” Most people who say “T10” are referring to the USNWR T10. Thread closed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

Any school that has any form of ED is NOT a T5 school.
Any school that has ED2 practice is NOT a T10 school.

OP, remember these rules, then you won't be fooled by all those non-sensical rankings.

This! This is exactly the point people keep missing.

If a school needs any form of ED to protect yield, it is not a true T5 school. A real T5 does not need to lock students in early just to manage its numbers. The demand is already there.

And if a school runs ED2, it is not a true T10 school. ED2 is basically a second chance yield management tool. Great schools can still use it, and many of them are excellent, but that does not make them T10 in the real sense.

People get distracted by rankings, marketing, and tiny year to year movements. The simpler rule is usually more honest.

Northwestern and Caltech are two examples of true T10 schools.

Who cares. You must so bored, debating rankings and ED on this forum. Endless bickering that leads us nowhere.

(btw Northwestern is not T10. They take middling 3.6 + TO kids from our private + peer private schools nearby)

You should write a strongly worded email to USNWR about your personal ranking system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:wait i didnt know rankings were supposed to be about how schools manage yield with ed? instead of academic bandwith and outcomes? seems like housewife banter to me

It’s very simple, the school my kid goes to is a real elite superior institution.

All other schools are suspect somehow.

There are only three or four real universities, the rest you may as well send your kid to trade school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi all, my DD is a sophmore in HS so we're just starting to truly think about this college application process (but no, we are not only now starting to think about having a well-rounded kid with a variety of interests, that's been her whole life).

But I'm new to reading this sub, and I see lots of people talk about T10 and T5. Are these the top 10 schools according to US News & World Report? Or where is the "official" list of T10 colleges and universities for undergrad?

Depends on people.

DCUM posters: US News.

High school kids committing to colleges: Eight ivies, MIT, Stanford.

Cornell and Dartmouth sneak. They are not T10

There is not a single high school kid in America who thinks this.