Do MAGAs want a Christian Nation or a Free Nation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This White House document about religious freedom seems self-contradictory. A free nation (and the leader thereof) should not specify that people must believe in a single creator or any creator.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/articles/2025/09/president-trump-champions-religious-freedom-unveils-america-prays/

Personally, I value us as a "Free nation." I am also, admittedly, an atheist. Am I still welcome in the US? Or do conservatives want religion as a litmus test for being a "true" American?

people want their children to have good jobs and healthcare. to have hope that their lives will be better.

that will never happen when Democrats allow overwhelming immigration of low wage workers to flood the nation. Add the overwhelming number of H1Bs, OPTs, L1s, H4EAD, over and over and over that allow millions to take US citizens jobs.

wake up progressives.

focus on policies that US voters want and you will get elected and you can implement good things for US workers. rather than pissing in the wind and complaining about those racist magas.

What does this have to do with religion?

Nothing, I think it is astroturfing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sweden, Denmark, high proportion atheist population. Not all of Europe is so religious.

Denmark is a high trust society. mostly because it is homogeneous.

https://www.helenrussell.co.uk/books/the-year-of-living-danishly/

now in the US diversity means 80% Indians in IT and a token white person.

but to progressives that is ok.

Australia, also high atheist population, also diverse.

You guys keep citing Christian countries. Where are your non-Christian examples? You know the places that never were Christian… Surely you must have at least one paradise where no one celebrates Christmas.

*Uh not really. Not if the majority of a country is atheist. It is more about FREE countries. With true religious freedom, there will probably be some celebration if Christmas and other religion holidays. We don't want forced atheism either. Just freedom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A Christian nation. They won't care about freedom until fellow Magas come for them, for whatever reason.

Did you have this much angst when democrats were pushing the state of Michigan to install foot baths in State Universities for muslims at public expense?

1. Student fees, not tax dollars, paid for the foot baths.

2. The university, not Democrats, pushed for this. Students were using regular sinks, which were getting pulled away from the wall and causing water damage to the bathrooms.

3. Using bathroom sinks is unhygienic and dangerous for students who have to balance on one foot on a slippery tile floor.

4. At any university, school funds go towards providing services that not everyone uses. Hillel and kosher meals for Jewish students. The Catholic Campus ministry for Catholic students. LGBTQ for LGBTQ students, and so on. In this case, the foot baths are available to everyone. Many non-Muslim students have expressed interest in using them, such as athletes.

5. “Democrats” and “Muslims” should be capitalized. We know you’re not uneducated because you were careful to capitalize Michigan and State Universities. Are you doing this subconsciously out of disrespect?

6. Always get the full story before forming an opinion. Right wing outrage bait simplifies everything and is lying to you.

Student fees did not pay for them. The government did. That's why the ACLU brought it to court.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A Christian nation. They won't care about freedom until fellow Magas come for them, for whatever reason.

Did you have this much angst when democrats were pushing the state of Michigan to install foot baths in State Universities for muslims at public expense?

1. Student fees, not tax dollars, paid for the foot baths.

2. The university, not Democrats, pushed for this. Students were using regular sinks, which were getting pulled away from the wall and causing water damage to the bathrooms.

3. Using bathroom sinks is unhygienic and dangerous for students who have to balance on one foot on a slippery tile floor.

4. At any university, school funds go towards providing services that not everyone uses. Hillel and kosher meals for Jewish students. The Catholic Campus ministry for Catholic students. LGBTQ for LGBTQ students, and so on. In this case, the foot baths are available to everyone. Many non-Muslim students have expressed interest in using them, such as athletes.

5. “Democrats” and “Muslims” should be capitalized. We know you’re not uneducated because you were careful to capitalize Michigan and State Universities. Are you doing this subconsciously out of disrespect?

6. Always get the full story before forming an opinion. Right wing outrage bait simplifies everything and is lying to you.

Student fees did not pay for them. The government did. That's why the ACLU brought it to court.

Every single source I’ve read says the university planned to tap into student fees to pay for them. And no, the ACLU didn’t bring it to court. In fact, the ACLU of Michigan issued a statement: “Indeed, if the university refused to allow Muslim students to wash their feet in the sink without there being a viable alternative, we would have concerns about whether the university was unconstitutionally interfering with students’ right to practice their religion.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A Christian nation. They won't care about freedom until fellow Magas come for them, for whatever reason.

Did you have this much angst when democrats were pushing the state of Michigan to install foot baths in State Universities for muslims at public expense?

1. Student fees, not tax dollars, paid for the foot baths.

2. The university, not Democrats, pushed for this. Students were using regular sinks, which were getting pulled away from the wall and causing water damage to the bathrooms.

3. Using bathroom sinks is unhygienic and dangerous for students who have to balance on one foot on a slippery tile floor.

4. At any university, school funds go towards providing services that not everyone uses. Hillel and kosher meals for Jewish students. The Catholic Campus ministry for Catholic students. LGBTQ for LGBTQ students, and so on. In this case, the foot baths are available to everyone. Many non-Muslim students have expressed interest in using them, such as athletes.

5. “Democrats” and “Muslims” should be capitalized. We know you’re not uneducated because you were careful to capitalize Michigan and State Universities. Are you doing this subconsciously out of disrespect?

6. Always get the full story before forming an opinion. Right wing outrage bait simplifies everything and is lying to you.

Student fees did not pay for them. The government did. That's why the ACLU brought it to court.

Inclusivity is not taking anything away from you. You are not harmed by someone having access to something that allows them to practice their religion. Now, if the universities were forcing us all to wash our feet in religious observance, you'd have something legitimate to be angry about. But this is not that.

[Anonymous]

The answer is they want a dictatorship that forces everyone to live as trump wants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A Christian nation. They won't care about freedom until fellow Magas come for them, for whatever reason.

Did you have this much angst when democrats were pushing the state of Michigan to install foot baths in State Universities for muslims at public expense?

1. Student fees, not tax dollars, paid for the foot baths.

2. The university, not Democrats, pushed for this. Students were using regular sinks, which were getting pulled away from the wall and causing water damage to the bathrooms.

3. Using bathroom sinks is unhygienic and dangerous for students who have to balance on one foot on a slippery tile floor.

4. At any university, school funds go towards providing services that not everyone uses. Hillel and kosher meals for Jewish students. The Catholic Campus ministry for Catholic students. LGBTQ for LGBTQ students, and so on. In this case, the foot baths are available to everyone. Many non-Muslim students have expressed interest in using them, such as athletes.

5. “Democrats” and “Muslims” should be capitalized. We know you’re not uneducated because you were careful to capitalize Michigan and State Universities. Are you doing this subconsciously out of disrespect?

6. Always get the full story before forming an opinion. Right wing outrage bait simplifies everything and is lying to you.

Student fees did not pay for them. The government did. That's why the ACLU brought it to court.

Inclusivity is not taking anything away from you. You are not harmed by someone having access to something that allows them to practice their religion. Now, if the universities were forcing us all to wash our feet in religious observance, you'd have something legitimate to be angry about. But this is not that.

Actually it does in the same vein that Muslims are upset when we observe Christmas and the Sabbath. It's like all the ethnic groceries, nothing wrong per se but where are all the local root cellar type stores and BBQ places they take up space. Why don't they learn to sing Christmas carols. They just don't like the same things we do. And why are you going to try to paint me as the bad poster for pointing that out. Your argument itself is irritating.

[Anonymous]

People generally don't seem to know that Baptists were among the strongest voices for separation of church and state.

“When Church and State are separate, the effects are happy, and they do not at all interfere with each other; but where they have been confounded together, no tongue nor pen can fully describe the mischiefs that have ensued.”
― Isaac Backus (1724-1806)

Backus strongly supported the First Amendment, as discussed in any number of histories, including Baptist publications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A Christian nation. They won't care about freedom until fellow Magas come for them, for whatever reason.

Did you have this much angst when democrats were pushing the state of Michigan to install foot baths in State Universities for muslims at public expense?

1. Student fees, not tax dollars, paid for the foot baths.

2. The university, not Democrats, pushed for this. Students were using regular sinks, which were getting pulled away from the wall and causing water damage to the bathrooms.

3. Using bathroom sinks is unhygienic and dangerous for students who have to balance on one foot on a slippery tile floor.

4. At any university, school funds go towards providing services that not everyone uses. Hillel and kosher meals for Jewish students. The Catholic Campus ministry for Catholic students. LGBTQ for LGBTQ students, and so on. In this case, the foot baths are available to everyone. Many non-Muslim students have expressed interest in using them, such as athletes.

5. “Democrats” and “Muslims” should be capitalized. We know you’re not uneducated because you were careful to capitalize Michigan and State Universities. Are you doing this subconsciously out of disrespect?

6. Always get the full story before forming an opinion. Right wing outrage bait simplifies everything and is lying to you.

Student fees did not pay for them. The government did. That's why the ACLU brought it to court.

Inclusivity is not taking anything away from you. You are not harmed by someone having access to something that allows them to practice their religion. Now, if the universities were forcing us all to wash our feet in religious observance, you'd have something legitimate to be angry about. But this is not that.

Actually it does in the same vein that Muslims are upset when we observe Christmas and the Sabbath. It's like all the ethnic groceries, nothing wrong per se but where are all the local root cellar type stores and BBQ places they take up space. Why don't they learn to sing Christmas carols. They just don't like the same things we do. And why are you going to try to paint me as the bad poster for pointing that out. Your argument itself is irritating.

I am an atheist and have zero issue with people truly pursuing life, liberty, and happiness, including their own religion as they see fit. I could not give a hoot about other people singing Christmas carols. What? Your problem is within yourself and your prejudices and inability to truly embrace a free country. They are not the problem, you sre.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A Christian nation. They won't care about freedom until fellow Magas come for them, for whatever reason.

Did you have this much angst when democrats were pushing the state of Michigan to install foot baths in State Universities for muslims at public expense?

1. Student fees, not tax dollars, paid for the foot baths.

2. The university, not Democrats, pushed for this. Students were using regular sinks, which were getting pulled away from the wall and causing water damage to the bathrooms.

3. Using bathroom sinks is unhygienic and dangerous for students who have to balance on one foot on a slippery tile floor.

4. At any university, school funds go towards providing services that not everyone uses. Hillel and kosher meals for Jewish students. The Catholic Campus ministry for Catholic students. LGBTQ for LGBTQ students, and so on. In this case, the foot baths are available to everyone. Many non-Muslim students have expressed interest in using them, such as athletes.

5. “Democrats” and “Muslims” should be capitalized. We know you’re not uneducated because you were careful to capitalize Michigan and State Universities. Are you doing this subconsciously out of disrespect?

6. Always get the full story before forming an opinion. Right wing outrage bait simplifies everything and is lying to you.

Student fees did not pay for them. The government did. That's why the ACLU brought it to court.

Inclusivity is not taking anything away from you. You are not harmed by someone having access to something that allows them to practice their religion. Now, if the universities were forcing us all to wash our feet in religious observance, you'd have something legitimate to be angry about. But this is not that.

Actually it does in the same vein that Muslims are upset when we observe Christmas and the Sabbath. It's like all the ethnic groceries, nothing wrong per se but where are all the local root cellar type stores and BBQ places they take up space. Why don't they learn to sing Christmas carols. They just don't like the same things we do. And why are you going to try to paint me as the bad poster for pointing that out. Your argument itself is irritating.

I am an atheist and have zero issue with people truly pursuing life, liberty, and happiness, including their own religion as they see fit. I could not give a hoot about other people singing Christmas carols. What? Your problem is within yourself and your prejudices and inability to truly embrace a free country. They are not the problem, you sre.

I want to know what a root cellar store is. Person sounds nuts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sweden, Denmark, high proportion atheist population. Not all of Europe is so religious.

Denmark is a high trust society. mostly because it is homogeneous.

https://www.helenrussell.co.uk/books/the-year-of-living-danishly/

now in the US diversity means 80% Indians in IT and a token white person.

but to progressives that is ok.

Australia, also high atheist population, also diverse.

You guys keep citing Christian countries. Where are your non-Christian examples? You know the places that never were Christian… Surely you must have at least one paradise where no one celebrates Christmas.

*Uh not really. Not if the majority of a country is atheist. It is more about FREE countries. With true religious freedom, there will probably be some celebration if Christmas and other religion holidays. We don't want forced atheism either. Just freedom.

There are very few true atheists, but a lot of lazy people that don’t want to render unto God what is God’s.

Those people can live off the fruits of their forefathers for a time, but things decay over time.

What you perhaps actually like is to live off the accumulated social capital without having to do anything yourself to maintain it. Much like some people like to live off inherited wealth without having to work hard. That certainly can be appealing.

This is why I’m poking you to name a truly non-Christian nation that meets your definition of freedom. Because such a thing cannot exist without generations of Christians doing the hard work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sweden, Denmark, high proportion atheist population. Not all of Europe is so religious.

Denmark is a high trust society. mostly because it is homogeneous.

https://www.helenrussell.co.uk/books/the-year-of-living-danishly/

now in the US diversity means 80% Indians in IT and a token white person.

but to progressives that is ok.

Australia, also high atheist population, also diverse.

You guys keep citing Christian countries. Where are your non-Christian examples? You know the places that never were Christian… Surely you must have at least one paradise where no one celebrates Christmas.

*Uh not really. Not if the majority of a country is atheist. It is more about FREE countries. With true religious freedom, there will probably be some celebration if Christmas and other religion holidays. We don't want forced atheism either. Just freedom.

There are very few true atheists, but a lot of lazy people that don’t want to render unto God what is God’s.

Those people can live off the fruits of their forefathers for a time, but things decay over time.

What you perhaps actually like is to live off the accumulated social capital without having to do anything yourself to maintain it. Much like some people like to live off inherited wealth without having to work hard. That certainly can be appealing.

This is why I’m poking you to name a truly non-Christian nation that meets your definition of freedom. Because such a thing cannot exist without generations of Christians doing the hard work.

I do not believe utopia exists, but do believe in freedom as an ideal. You seem to lean toward enforcing Christianity (and also that you seem to enjoy being dominant). Yyour inherent belied system seems anti freedom. No thanks. That Christianity was a dominant world religion for a long time does not mean Christianity is the cause of human morality, nor necessary for human morality. Correlation is not causation. But thanks for calling atheists lazy! That was a hoot!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sweden, Denmark, high proportion atheist population. Not all of Europe is so religious.

Denmark is a high trust society. mostly because it is homogeneous.

https://www.helenrussell.co.uk/books/the-year-of-living-danishly/

now in the US diversity means 80% Indians in IT and a token white person.

but to progressives that is ok.

Australia, also high atheist population, also diverse.

You guys keep citing Christian countries. Where are your non-Christian examples? You know the places that never were Christian… Surely you must have at least one paradise where no one celebrates Christmas.

*Uh not really. Not if the majority of a country is atheist. It is more about FREE countries. With true religious freedom, there will probably be some celebration if Christmas and other religion holidays. We don't want forced atheism either. Just freedom.

There are very few true atheists, but a lot of lazy people that don’t want to render unto God what is God’s.

Those people can live off the fruits of their forefathers for a time, but things decay over time.

What you perhaps actually like is to live off the accumulated social capital without having to do anything yourself to maintain it. Much like some people like to live off inherited wealth without having to work hard. That certainly can be appealing.

This is why I’m poking you to name a truly non-Christian nation that meets your definition of freedom. Because such a thing cannot exist without generations of Christians doing the hard work.

DP...I didn't have to look very far because Canada is a non-Christian nation that meets my definition of freedom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A Christian nation. They won't care about freedom until fellow Magas come for them, for whatever reason.

Did you have this much angst when democrats were pushing the state of Michigan to install foot baths in State Universities for muslims at public expense?

1. Student fees, not tax dollars, paid for the foot baths.

2. The university, not Democrats, pushed for this. Students were using regular sinks, which were getting pulled away from the wall and causing water damage to the bathrooms.

3. Using bathroom sinks is unhygienic and dangerous for students who have to balance on one foot on a slippery tile floor.

4. At any university, school funds go towards providing services that not everyone uses. Hillel and kosher meals for Jewish students. The Catholic Campus ministry for Catholic students. LGBTQ for LGBTQ students, and so on. In this case, the foot baths are available to everyone. Many non-Muslim students have expressed interest in using them, such as athletes.

5. “Democrats” and “Muslims” should be capitalized. We know you’re not uneducated because you were careful to capitalize Michigan and State Universities. Are you doing this subconsciously out of disrespect?

6. Always get the full story before forming an opinion. Right wing outrage bait simplifies everything and is lying to you.

Student fees did not pay for them. The government did. That's why the ACLU brought it to court.

Inclusivity is not taking anything away from you. You are not harmed by someone having access to something that allows them to practice their religion. Now, if the universities were forcing us all to wash our feet in religious observance, you'd have something legitimate to be angry about. But this is not that.

Actually it does in the same vein that Muslims are upset when we observe Christmas and the Sabbath. It's like all the ethnic groceries, nothing wrong per se but where are all the local root cellar type stores and BBQ places they take up space. Why don't they learn to sing Christmas carols. They just don't like the same things we do. And why are you going to try to paint me as the bad poster for pointing that out. Your argument itself is irritating.

Who is we? I'm born in Detroit, raised a Hindu, and don't eat BBQ. I don't know a single person who grew up in the US who doesn't know Jingle Bells. Also, none of the truly devout Christians I know (who include people of European, East Asian, Indian, African, Carribean, South American, Latin American backgrounds) consider Christmas carols to have anything to do with their religion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sweden, Denmark, high proportion atheist population. Not all of Europe is so religious.

Denmark is a high trust society. mostly because it is homogeneous.

https://www.helenrussell.co.uk/books/the-year-of-living-danishly/

now in the US diversity means 80% Indians in IT and a token white person.

but to progressives that is ok.

Australia, also high atheist population, also diverse.

You guys keep citing Christian countries. Where are your non-Christian examples? You know the places that never were Christian… Surely you must have at least one paradise where no one celebrates Christmas.

*Uh not really. Not if the majority of a country is atheist. It is more about FREE countries. With true religious freedom, there will probably be some celebration if Christmas and other religion holidays. We don't want forced atheism either. Just freedom.

There are very few true atheists, but a lot of lazy people that don’t want to render unto God what is God’s.

Those people can live off the fruits of their forefathers for a time, but things decay over time.

What you perhaps actually like is to live off the accumulated social capital without having to do anything yourself to maintain it. Much like some people like to live off inherited wealth without having to work hard. That certainly can be appealing.

This is why I’m poking you to name a truly non-Christian nation that meets your definition of freedom. Because such a thing cannot exist without generations of Christians doing the hard work.

DP...I didn't have to look very far because Canada is a non-Christian nation that meets my definition of freedom.

They seem to be attempting to make the point that many free nations historically were founded by Christians, so they can only attribute their success to that and not other things like basic evolution of human intelligence, ability for empathy, and level of education. Ultimately it is a giant correlation argument. Nevermind that atheists are "lazy."