Is Andropause real?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I don’t know which PP you think you’re replying to but I’m not one that is filing for divorce. Yet. I do have my ducks in a row because if he doesn’t put any effort into our shared family life beyond earning money, what’s the point? I have my own money. I want a husband for shared experiences, companionship, fun, and support. And my kids want a dad for those reasons, too. Not for his job title.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I think all of these posts are indicating that the DHs don’t believe they are in a psychological crisis, but that the crisis is being caused by those around them or by their job or whatever. They don’t even recognize any internal responsibility for their misery.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I think all of these posts are indicating that the DHs don’t believe they are in a psychological crisis, but that the crisis is being caused by those around them or by their job or whatever. They don’t even recognize any internal responsibility for their misery.

Yes. My DH adamantly denies that there is anything wrong with HIM. The problem is with the rest of us (me, the kids), people at his job, wider society, and so on. If other people would just do (or not do) x y and z then he would be happy. And that he is just here for the ride, a victim of everyone else, nothing to do with him at all. And this is a man with a great career, plenty of $, beautiful home, wife who loves him, great kids who don’t have any real difficulties…really no tangible or material problems in his life. And all of his complaints are within HIS power to fix but he doesn’t see it that way.

[Anonymous]

What helps me keep it together is getting together with other men around the same age on a routine basis. Just for drinks or we'll go on golf trips 1-2x a year. The socialization really helps rejuvenate me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My friends all have DHs 44-48, and they’ve all lost their damn minds. Affairs, mental health crises, lost jobs, wanting to randomly move abroad, alcoholism, you name it and some guy has done it since turning 44/45.

Someone said this is biological and is male menopause. Seriously? If it can be explained that easily, why aren’t we medicating them to the gills the way we do for erectile dysfunction?

I really want to believe this is a biological thing that we can fix so families can be saved. I don’t want to think that most of my friends’ husbands have turned into irrevocable overnight disasters.

DH here: I think it’s generally circumstantial rather than biological, although low T is a meaningful factor for some. That is a stage of life where careers plateau, when you kind of run out of steam work-wise but are looking at needing to grind out another 20 years even so. For many, sex in their marriages has declined to a low ebb. There can be a lack of acknowledgement from one’s spouse about the sacrifices that have been made to provide economically, and many marriages seem to get trapped in the “who has given up more”/lack of affection/mutual recrimination spiral. It’s a time when the reality that you are basically trapped by the results of your prior choices and there is little to be done really bites. Rather than deal with these feelings constructively, some men just crash out instead. Obviously, that’s bad.

But there is no pill for “stuck in job I hate for jerk boss and need to do that for another 20 years to manage college bills.” What most of these men need is to lift weights and read Marcus Aurelius, but not everyone finds that. Religion would help many, too. At root, I think this is not a biological problem, it is a philosophical one. These men don’t need a pill; they need a philosopher or a priest.

Agree.

This is not a biological reaction, it is a values based, attitudes based and philosophical reaction.

Instead of finding peace, happiness and gratitude in what they have c they crash out in search of self fulfillment.

But in reality, sustainable fulfillment is a community and family driven thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I think all of these posts are indicating that the DHs don’t believe they are in a psychological crisis, but that the crisis is being caused by those around them or by their job or whatever. They don’t even recognize any internal responsibility for their misery.

Yes. My DH adamantly denies that there is anything wrong with HIM. The problem is with the rest of us (me, the kids), people at his job, wider society, and so on. If other people would just do (or not do) x y and z then he would be happy. And that he is just here for the ride, a victim of everyone else, nothing to do with him at all. And this is a man with a great career, plenty of $, beautiful home, wife who loves him, great kids who don’t have any real difficulties…really no tangible or material problems in his life. And all of his complaints are within HIS power to fix but he doesn’t see it that way.

The cognitive dissonance required to see things this way is astounding. No wonder they’re tired given the amount of mental energy they’re expending.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

As if we haven’t been trying that for the last 5-10 years.

Have you ever had to work full-time, run a household w kids by yourself, and single-handedly “helped a grown man overcome his mental disorders and mental crises?”

Or even just the latter part- “helped” an adult overcome a disorder or psych crisis?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I think all of these posts are indicating that the DHs don’t believe they are in a psychological crisis, but that the crisis is being caused by those around them or by their job or whatever. They don’t even recognize any internal responsibility for their misery.

Yes. My DH adamantly denies that there is anything wrong with HIM. The problem is with the rest of us (me, the kids), people at his job, wider society, and so on. If other people would just do (or not do) x y and z then he would be happy. And that he is just here for the ride, a victim of everyone else, nothing to do with him at all. And this is a man with a great career, plenty of $, beautiful home, wife who loves him, great kids who don’t have any real difficulties…really no tangible or material problems in his life. And all of his complaints are within HIS power to fix but he doesn’t see it that way.

The cognitive dissonance required to see things this way is astounding. No wonder they’re tired given the amount of mental energy they’re expending.

What way is someone else supposed to see it as? Stupid incel posts that say nothing. You think somehow everyone else and the entire world need to change and not this guy? Not going to happen. People need to find their own peace.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I think all of these posts are indicating that the DHs don’t believe they are in a psychological crisis, but that the crisis is being caused by those around them or by their job or whatever. They don’t even recognize any internal responsibility for their misery.

Part of helping him to overcome his psychological crisis is helping him to understand that it's not being caused by those around him or his job. Maybe it won't be easy... but if it was easy to get over then it wouldn't be a crisis, would it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I don’t know which PP you think you’re replying to but I’m not one that is filing for divorce. Yet. I do have my ducks in a row because if he doesn’t put any effort into our shared family life beyond earning money, what’s the point? I have my own money. I want a husband for shared experiences, companionship, fun, and support. And my kids want a dad for those reasons, too. Not for his job title.

If you were going through a rough patch mentally, would you want him to have this attitude about you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

As if we haven’t been trying that for the last 5-10 years.

Have you ever had to work full-time, run a household w kids by yourself, and single-handedly “helped a grown man overcome his mental disorders and mental crises?”

Or even just the latter part- “helped” an adult overcome a disorder or psych crisis?

Yes. It was no fun at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH is currently spiraling now. It’s bad. I know he doesn’t want to be here anymore. He’s emotionally abusive to me, angry all the time, and absent as much as he can be. Meanwhile, I’m trying to keep the kids, house and my own work going. It’s depressing.

This is mine- I could have written it except mine has turned on the kids. I’m talking to lawyers now because I can’t believe the 180 he’s taken. He used to be happy and fun!

He’s so angry and even when he’s physically present, he’s absent and mad when asked to engage. We have elementary aged kids and I don’t understand how anyone can be angry and checked out with kids that are at such a fun and capable age but still cute and charming. And yet he is. And he thinks everyone is making him like this instead of seeing it as a choice he’s made.

NP here and exact same situation.

I can’t put into words how much it means to see these replies. I really and truly thought it was just me and it was maybe even my fault.

OK but why not think harder about how to help DH overcome his psychological crisis rather than just filing for divorce?

I don’t know which PP you think you’re replying to but I’m not one that is filing for divorce. Yet. I do have my ducks in a row because if he doesn’t put any effort into our shared family life beyond earning money, what’s the point? I have my own money. I want a husband for shared experiences, companionship, fun, and support. And my kids want a dad for those reasons, too. Not for his job title.

If you were going through a rough patch mentally, would you want him to have this attitude about you?

I’m the poster over on Health and Medicine desperately trying to get my DH to take his meds while he insists he’s fine. I’m doing more than my share to support him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What helps me keep it together is getting together with other men around the same age on a routine basis. Just for drinks or we'll go on golf trips 1-2x a year. The socialization really helps rejuvenate me.

But what would you suggest to a DW if her DH isn’t self-aware like you to get him to be motivated to do those sorts of things?